[72projectbird]

Originally Posted by SRR

A big valve 350 is no slouch! Any car that sits non-running will develop issues. Drop it in, your wife will hardly know the difference.

Maybe, but I'd rather be non-running than running 15s

[1965gp]

I’ve pretty much decided on putting the 350 in as is. Everything will line up, the Ac will work and the shaker will line up.

I would like to find a 455 for it but to be honest once it’s together I probably won’t pull it back apart. My 69 TA clone is plenty fast as are the 4th gens. I don’t like putting a 350 in it but I think that’s the best option right now.

I have a 58 Bonneville getting painted any day now, a 97 WS6 getting painted right after that, a 68 Firebird 400 being shipped to me and a 70 GTO convertible I need to do something with. Point is I really don’t need another car that can’t be easily moved.

[1965gp]

Pontiacman I may hit you up for a 400 or 455 short block

72 project- you are absolutely right. Pontiac guys seem to have a certain ‘style’ to what they collect. There are a few of us that have very similar collections.

[Held for Ransom]

1965gp, have your wife read this...

Keep after him to upgrade from the 350 engine once it's put in.

It's worked on me for years.

[Squidward]

Originally Posted by 72projectbird

I'll say this, if you go with a stock 350 Pontiac to get it running, that's more than fine, but please don't try and convince yourself that it's plenty for the street, because it's not.

Agreed, a TYPICAL stock 350 would be anemic for most. 350HO would likely be a different story.

Interesting, I read an article about Jim Wangers last night, and it mentioned he wanted to do a 350 powered GTO for 1969. I never knew that! Delorean had something to say, tho...

1969 GTO Judge

“This is my favorite one of the lot, by far,” admits Jim. “We wanted something to beat the Road Runner–you know, low-priced. I wanted to call it the ET (for Elapsed Time). It was a 350 with GTO heads, a bench seat, no trim rings, and it was a B-post coupe. I showed it to John DeLorean, and he said that ‘over my dead body’ will there ever be a GTO with fewer than 400 cubic inches. So that was that.

https://www.hemmings.com/stories/jim-wangers/

[Squidward]

Originally Posted by 1965gp

I appreciate all of the insight- the goal is to enjoy the car and honestly my wife likes driving this one so it’s important to keep it one piece.

I don’t really beat on my cars and to be honest I don’t even get to drive them that often. I like to hit a cruise on the weekend otherwise I just drink beer and look at them.

I have several projects apart right now so the smart move is probably to drop in the 350 as is and enjoy it.

There is another option- I have a later model 350 I bought from a member here that said it drove great in his 2nd Gen and had gotten it to have decent power. I think it has 5c heads on it. I could pull the 670 heads off my motor and put them on the 350 if that would help.

I run big valve heads on mine. Just be careful about valve lift, because 2.11/1.77 valves WILL make contact with the cylinder at a certain amount of lift. I used checking springs to determine the lift where that took place, and it dictated cam choice. I settled on 489 max exhaust lift (1.5), with a 219/227 duration.

670 heads sound entertaining! I've always wondered what a max effort 350 build would be like (small chamber e-heads, etc), but I don't have the money and time to play with something like that. My driving and car use has changed, and has become more chill.

[Squidward]

Originally Posted by 72projectbird

Maybe, but I'd rather be non-running than running 15s

My rusted cylinder Craigslist 69 350 with 47 heads got out of the 15's with nothing more than a 4 barrel intake swap and Summit 2800 cam on 3.23 gears. Nothing to brag about, I know.

350 Pontiacs are like a dog that gets kicked. For a while I was like a crazy cat lady that wanted to rescue them all.

[blueghoast]

I have two fresh motors a 455 and a 400 both are broke in on the test stand.
A 406 with a torqer intake that has super throttle response with a little attitude
And a 462 with a 90916 cam and 9:89:1 compression.
Both motors have been run in on the test stand. there both ready to bolt in.
For the cost of dyno time can do that also. $6500.00 and $3500.00
Good luck on your decision. Run the 350 for now It's summer time.
Do the change come winter. ooohh winter such a bad word.

GT

[srmmmm]

Originally Posted by Squidward

I run big valve heads on mine. Just be careful about valve lift, because 2.11/1.77 valves WILL make contact with the cylinder at a certain amount of lift. I used checking springs to determine the lift where that took place, and it dictated cam choice. I settled on 489 max exhaust lift (1.5), with a 219/227 duration.

670 heads sound entertaining! I've always wondered what a max effort 350 build would be like (small chamber e-heads, etc), but I don't have the money and time to play with something like that. My driving and car use has changed, and has become more chill.

I'm running the 6X-4 heads on my 350/413 stroker with the Comp XE276HR cam. Lift is .502/.510 with 1.5 rockers. Ross flattops are set at 0.0 deck. No clearance issues and good for 453HP at 5600rpm and enough torque 442 at 4300rpm to tear up third gear in a TCI Streetfighter TH350.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

I'd use the 670 heads , cam and lifters from the 400 onto the 350.
Proven parts on the cheap.
Along with the induction package.
Keep the 48 heads preserved for better things to come.

I have never seen that type of carnage to a rear main cap.
Bedazzling

[1965gp]

I can’t for the life of me figure out how or why someone would run long bolts through the back of the crank. No reason you would do that for an engine stand or anything like that. Makes absolutely no sense at all. Going to interesting to see what the back of the block looks like.

[GT182]

Originally Posted by 67Lemons

I’d throw in the 350 with a quick detail so that I could be driving ASAP. Then I’d take my time to find & build whatever 400/stroker or 455 I could find within my budget, install the following winter.

I'd do the same also. Add a set of Cherry Bombs to the exhaust and you'll get a good sound out of them to make up for the engine change. I have a set on my GTO and love them. Makes my 400/400hp engine sound great too. Get off the gas on a good downhill run and they'll snap, crackle, and pop.

[TXSTARFIRE]

I believe that post #4 is the answer to what happened here.

[unruhjonny]

those rear cap pictures are gnarly.

I am still not able to wrap my head around how this happened;
is the suggestion that the flywheel was bolted up with an air ratchet and too long bolts before the oil pan was installed - and incompitance meant the GTO owner(?) just installed the oil pan and hoped it was ok?

[Lee]

I'm in Crosby, east side of Houston. I have a 400 block & crank, also some 96 and 13 heads. I had planned to sell the 455 out of my current '73 T/A clone, and building a stroker 400... Plans changed, and I'll probably be putting my T/A on the market next month. So, won't be needing the block or other parts.

I'll send you a message.

[HO Kenny]

One more vote for the 350HO. I had the 68 version in a 68 convertible Firebird 4 speed. It was a Surprisingly strong motor. It pulled to 6000 but I shifted at 5400 to keep it in the torque curve.
Rear gearing is important especially with an automatic. What gears do you have?
As said before, because of new cam/lifter issues I’d leave the cam alone. You could clearance the pushrod holes and put 1.65 rockers in. I doubt you’ll need them with those big valve heads.

[1965gp]

After checking the motor out we’ve decided to put a new cam, lifters and bearings in the 350 HO.

Does anyone have any suggestions for the cam? 72 TA clone with a turbo 400 with a little bit looser converter than stock. Gears are pretty tall- factory gears out of a late second Gen disc brake rear.

Since I don’t actually race the car priority is the sound, then driveability.

[SD455DJ]

I imagine your ‘72 TA clone started life as a 350 2-bbl with an automatic transmission (TH350) base bird or an Esprit, so that would mean it would have 2.73 gears standard (3.08 optional). Assuming it has 2.73 gears and with aftermarket AC now, so has a little hp drain and load when operating. Get a good higher stall converter (tight 10”) to help low end torque multiplication for the TH350(?). The 350HO will have at least 10.0 to 1 compression (mine Whistled at 10.3 warm with 72,000 miles) stock and will be detonation prone with the factory 067 cam under load. Make sure your cooling system is in top notch shape and runs at 190 degrees. I think a 068 clone cam would work well, or another cam with lift in the low .400’s since the big valves are limited in lift due to the smaller cylinder bore being smaller than the valve’s overall width. That’s the reason for the bore chamfers to avoid valve to block collisions. I believe you can safely go to .450” lift max, but you need to do the modeling clay test to confirm. The Summit 2801 is the high-lift version of the 068 and is a great cam, but it has .444”/.466” lift that might cause interference problems. Also check your deck height and get Cometic gaskets to tailor your quench to .040” - .050” if possible. That will help minimize detonation by pushing the combustion gases from the perimeter into the combustion chamber. A cam in the 210-215 intake/220-225 exhaust/114 LSA with .430” lift would be good for low end and mid-range power in your 4000 lb. Bird.

Dennis

[Formulabruce]

Consider what YOU will do with it, vs what others think of your car. If you cruise, and like the ride, do the 350 as it is. You don't have to prove anything to anyone. 99.99% of folks NEVER drive at their engines MAX Hp rating.
Pontiac built cars to run in their Torque band, not at peak HP, just a fact...
Ever see a HP converter on back of an engine??