[mgarblik]

Part 2: the bad news. So now I have the SD engine running great, idling smoothly @ 900 RPM's in park, 750 RPM's in drive. Time for a test drive. Car backs up fine, feels good in drive. On the street gentle acceleration, car will not shift. Stays in 1st gear no matter what. Manual shifting or in drive, stays in 1st. Took it up to 4000-4500, no shift. Background on the Turbo 400: It was refreshed/overhauled in 1979 and never installed in the car. I installed it with the hope it would work OK since it was stored in a climate controlled environment the entire time. What do they say about assumptions? Yea, everything that can be wrong with a turbo 400 is wrong with this one. Really only 2 things can likely keep one in 1st gear only. A governor problem or the detent system is stuck open. I had both situations! I unplugged the detent solenoid that was shorted, (passage open). Then I removed the governor and found it to be stuck. I cleaned it, checked it and reinstalled. 2nd road test. Car does have all 3 gears now. 1-2 shift is late and extremely hard. 2-3 shift is also late and very soft. Not to my liking at all. Back in the shop, the transmission is leaking fluid like a torpedoed tanker. Leaking from the front pump seal, leaking from both cooler fittings at the case, leaking from the speedometer adapter O-ring, leaking from the front pump bolts, leaking from the pan too. The only areas dry were the governor cover and dipstick O-ring.
So the transmission will need to come back out and be completely re-sealed and a basic shift improvement kit installed. This will take at least a few weeks to work through the shop. So lesson learned. Expecting ANY automatic transmission to work properly after sitting 45 years is a fools errand IMO. I should have known better. I will update with some pics and video when it's sealed up and ready for a proper road test.

Just remember, you can always count on me to make ALL the mistakes, so you don't have to! You never stop learning, and if anything can go wrong, it will.

[mgarblik]

I thought I would update this thread since so many have been following along with me for so long. My report is a mixture of good and bad news, and as Joe Friday of Dragnet fame would say, "just the facts". Filled the car with fluids last week and tried to start it for the first time. Remember, this engine had been on the dyno about a year and a half ago and ran flawlessly. Engine started fairly quickly but it was immediately clear to me something was wrong. It was very hard to keep running and changing the ignition timing had little to no effect on it. It acted like it was running extremely rich. Made a few checks, pulled a couple spark plugs, soot black. OK something must have happened to the carburetor. Removed it and took it completely apart. Everything looked perfect inside. Reassembled it and reinstalled. Did another spark test. It looked OK but maybe a little weak.

Now, what could have possibly changed from the dyno to the engine bay? Well, allot of things as it turns out. New/different battery and complete wiring harness was different. Checked voltages at the coil in crank and run positions, testing resistance wire. Everything looked great. The dyno did not use the OE ignition coil. It uses a MSD Blaster 2 coil. So I removed the coil and replaced with another stock style Delco coil I had laying around. Started the engine back up and it ran a little better. It would idle now but still very rough and you could tell it was still not right. Still seemed very rich and not responsive to timing changes. Shut it down and began thinking again: What is different from the dyno to right now in the car? On the dyno the distributor is used just as a low voltage switch and the MSD box provides the secondary spark. The only thing left was the distributor, so I removed it for inspection. Replaced the condenser, inspected everything else and reinstalled. Engine started right up and immediately you could tell it was a completely different animal. Fast idled fine, wasn't nearly as rich, reacted to timing and seemed closer to normal.
Still wasn't running great, but much, much better. I ended up replacing the spark plugs, carbon fouled, the used coil I had laying around with a new one and the used condenser I had with a new one. In the thousands of engines I have worked on for over 50 years, I can count on one hand the number of oil filled coils and ignition condensers that were defective. But just my luck, both on my car!. With the new parts installed the engine ran even better, especially starting and idle, but still not perfect.

As many with these early 70's engines do, I had always planned to keep 100% stock look but eliminate the ridiculous TCS system. I removed the distributor once again and began testing the components. The largest offender was the vacuum advance unit. It was providing 24 degrees of vacuum advance !! That was never going to work with today's crap gasoline. I brazed a limiter in at 10-12 degrees maximum. The centrifugal curve looked OK with 20 degrees @ 3800 RPM's. Put it all back together and installed it. Now with 14-15 degrees initial, using ported vacuum for the advance, it runs near perfect.

So that's all the good news. Next post will be the bad news.

[steve25]

In all my decades of repairing electronics and especially in hot running tube gear condensers are the first thing to go, and even more so if that have not had voltage in them in a while as being charged up keeps them in electrical terms being formed.

The heat of a motor is even more demanding on them then residing in tube gear.

Car condensers would last a lot longer if the case was not metal ( which helps them absorb damaging heat ) and they were grounded by a separate wire.

Oh yes, the fast piston speed of a 4.210” stroke will protest with even 18 degrees of vacuum advance depending on the motors CR.

Good to hear that your SD is now well !

[Bill Hanlon]

If you are going to stay with points/condenser ignition I think you should look into replacing the condenser with one that an internet buddy of mine actually makes himself. He is only advertising on Stovebolt.com, a forum for old Chevy/GMC trucks, but says "If you want to use one in a V8 application, a tractor, crop duster, etc please measure the wire from the condenser you have and let me know. It will take an additional day or two but I can adapt one for you."

Look here: https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthreads...er#Post1604579

[mgarblik]

Having a quality, USA made condenser would be nice. I will measure the lead on an old one. Seem to be fine now with the Echlin replacement. I am sorry one of my long rambling posts double posted. No idea why that happened. Hopefully a moderator can remove the double.

[steve25]

At times I have had the double post thing take place for no apparent reason, but that has not happened lately.

What takes place now if I am making a long post is that I loose it unless after I write 2 to 3 paragraphs I preview the post .

So dam strange as that does not take place with at least 5 other sites a frequent.

[grivera]

@Bill - Thanks for posting the great lead on quality condensers! Will be buying one for my convertible - seems one has to join the stovebolt.com forum to buy one?

[Bill Hanlon]

I'll see if Jon will let me post a private request with your contact info.

[grivera]

Thanks - of course I will need to measure the wire but I assume the same length as other v8s

[sdbob]

I like the Trans go shift kit. Of course I haven't bought one in 30 yrs so now a days quality I'm not sure of.

[mgarblik]

Originally Posted by sdbob

I like the Trans go shift kit. Of course I haven't bought one in 30 yrs so now a days quality I'm not sure of.

I like them too. Still American made. The Turbo 400 one is simple and only $40.00. I think it's 8-9 springs and a separator plate. 2 gaskets.

[Held for Ransom]

How did Part 2 (Bad news) precede Part 1 (Good news)???

[sdbob]

When new as I said the m40 in my SD hitting 3rd was very firm. I do not think the TRansgo helped that. Tom Nell (rip)must have known something.

[mgarblik]

Originally Posted by Held for Ransom

How did Part 2 (Bad news) precede Part 1 (Good news)???

I have no idea. I certainly didn't post them that way. Some glitch way above my pay grade.

[Held for Ransom]

Originally Posted by mgarblik

I have no idea. I certainly didn't post them that way. Some glitch way above my pay grade.

I guess Page 1 (Good) posted twice (I didn't see it on the other page). Still, weird.

[mgarblik]

Short update. I removed the transmission today and gave it a quick inspection. I am not happy with anything about it to be honest. I checked the front and rear end play. Front is quite excessive, about .010" greater than the tolerance. The rear end play is about .008": past the tolerance. There were a few aluminum shards in the pan already and a little clutch material. Just not happy with about 1 mile on it and about 1.5 hours of engine run time on it.

I am going to go ahead and completely disassemble it and check the entire transmission, fix the end plays, replace all the rubber and seals throughout. That way I can be confident it's going to be ready for some road trips.

This transmission was completely overhauled in 1979 by a reputable shop in the area that I personally used many times. It was never run after being built. A little disappointed by what I am seeing inside. Oh well, easily fixed. Will just take some time. After working on some of these modern 8 and 10 speeds, this looks like fun. Very few special tools needed. Turbo 400, about as tough as it gets!

[grivera]

Originally Posted by Bill Hanlon

I'll see if Jon will let me post a private request with your contact info.

Jon was a pleasure to work with. I received the condenser today- interesting piece.

[Jack Gifford]

Appears to be a bipolar electrolytic.

[grivera]

Jon says the condensers were originally designed for an inline 6 cylinder engine, which is why the wire length needs altering.

[mgarblik]

I reinstalled the transmission in the car and took a short road test yesterday. The good news is all the external leaks are fixed and there were allot of them. It has all it's gears and shifts OK. I am not 100% satisfied with the shift timing and feel. It's going to require some fine tuning of the valve body, possibly the modulator, and maybe the governor to make me 100% happy. Also, no detent downshift which I have isolated to the switch on the gas pedal. Having a little trouble sourcing that switch locally. Available all over the internet. So progress is being made. I think I mentioned this transmission was replaced by the original owner early in the car's life. It has an SD-455 governor and many other parts, but the valve body is unknown. The 1-2 shift is extremely early under light throttle. Sometimes 5-7 MPH. Would like to stretch it out a little. 2-3 shift is also somewhat early. Shift feel is a little soft for my taste in both changes. If it wasn't an original SD car, it would be getting a 4-speed. Not a fan of automatic transmission muscle cars for street driving. Actually, this is one of the very few I have owned.