[dancolkate]

A couple of items for this thread:

1) Car show season is about to begin. Let's not forget to gather as much data as possible for the EUN database.

2) Somewhere in the middle of this thread, someone was going to ask GTOAA what they thought of this whole topic. Did GTOAA ever respond?

Dan

[my69gto]

Dan, Pretty sure it was Steved400... I think the response at the time (in Nov/Dec?) was they (GTOAA) would discuss and consider it... haven't heard from Steve much cuz he's been really busy lately, but I don't think he's received any further feedback from them at this point...

[md1twal3]

So, I finally took a closer look at my newly purchased WS block today. Guess what...THERE IS NO VIN STAMPED ON IT!!!!!! Not even a trace, attempt or light mark!!!!! The factory machine marks are in tact and there is no evidence of tampering...

Now, without EUN knowledge, how would ANYONE ever know if it really belonged to their car???????

[Bet Winner]

Originally Posted by md1twal3

So, I finally took a closer look at my newly purchased WS block today. Guess what...THERE IS NO VIN STAMPED ON IT!!!!!! Not even a trace, attempt or light mark!!!!! The factory machine marks are in tact and there is no evidence of tampering...

Now, without EUN knowledge, how would ANYONE ever know if it really belonged to their car???????

If there was no vin, there would be no way to know, but an original 69 block with no vin does sound rather fishy. I thought all the blocks had the vin on them by that time. You are talking about a 1969 block, right? What is the cast date on it if you don't mind telling us.

[md1twal3]

It is an A319 block, yes, 1969

[dancolkate]

Are you sure you looked CLOSE? Mine was faint and difficult to see without hitting the area with brake-clean.

[GTO JOHN]

My A069 dated WS block has a VERY VERY faint VIN stamp on it and I can barely read it with a maginfying glass!!! As a matter of fact I cannot be 100% certain that the VIN stamp matches my car because it is so unreadable. After the block gets painted I bet you won't be able to see it at all.

How can you trace the EUN back to the VIN to verify that?

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by GTO JOHN

How can you trace the EUN back to the VIN to verify that?

You would have to have one of these lil' jewels.

[md1twal3]

OK...just went at it with brake cleaner, and there is nothing stamped where it should be. It is, however stamped with 29Z118048 in a different area. I'll have to check John's site to see if anyone is looking for it...

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

California built usually have the VIN stamped way out towards the edge of the machined surface. I believe the Z in the VIN indicates Calipoonia built. Some of them are even stamped up in the area where the machined surface goes up into a 'Y' shape.

[md1twal3]

That is probably it, because the block did come out of CA.

[Judge273]

Has anymore of those '69 Billing Sheets surfaced since this thread started?

[dancolkate]

MD,
The car that your engine came out of was only 181 units away from mine and from the same plant!

Golden opportunity!!

Let's compare our VIN's and EUN's and look for something that makes sense.

My info follows:
VIN: 29Z117867
EUN: 0514569

[md1twal3]

OK....here is a first crack at narrowing down the possibilities.

Dan's info follows:
VIN: 29Z117867
EUN: 0514569
Cast Date: B109

And Mine is as follows:
VIN: 29Z118048
EUN: 0493554
Cast Date: A319

Differences:
VIN: 181
EUN: 21,015
Cast Date: 6 business days apart (subtracted Sats & Suns)

Assumptions for CA Plant:
30 GTOs per day
3,503 #9790071 blocks cast per day (from a foundry)

Given these assumptions, if someone had a B039 cast date 9790071 block, it should fall between 0493554 and 0497057

Thoughts....anybody got a Z (CA) block that was cast between Dan and mine's that we can put to these numbers to see if we are onto something?

[Ron Landis]

I have a late Dec. Z built WS, I'll need to get actual dates. I thought that it had no VIN, but it is out on the edge, as mentioned. The MUN is 0424378. I think it is @ last week of Dec., heads are both Dec. 16. BTW..any way of dating #6709185, purportedly the last #744 cam equipped engine. Just curious. Ron

[GTOnly70]

Has anyone considered requesting the PHS info on a car that had previously been authenticated with the Engine Sequence Number by PHS (pre '90 or so)? If they don't provide the info (blacked or whited out), we'll know that they are withholding info that was previously available.

[GTO JOHN]

BVZ: Iv'e seen that billing sheet before. Wasn't that from the Framingham built Judge that sold on ebay last year sometime? Did you get the car?

dancolkate: I'll try to get a photo of my VIN stamp but it is alot smaller font than yours is and there is some pitting around the stamp so it's darn near impossible to read.

md1twal3: I'll get the EUN off my block too but it appears to be Baltimore (B) car not Fremont (z)

Interesting Note: I bought a 69 Judge from a guy last year and I ran the PHS myself prior to buying it. He ended up giving me the PHS packet that he had gotten for the car in 1999 and there are differences in the PHS sheets. Some info is omitted on mine from 2004 and it is present on the old sheets from 1999! I'll post scans of both as soon as I can.

[md1twal3]

I am anxious to see if we are close, that's for sure. To clarify, my reference to the VIN is to the one on the block, not your car. If your XX and WW blocks are Freemont blocks and carry the same cast numberas the WS, get the EUN to me and I will munch some numbers to see if I can peg the cast date and maybe even the VIN production #.

[69gtocv]

Gtojohn and I have been comparing our two blocks. His Pontiac, mine Baltimore. Mine was stamped 6 days AFTER his, yet my eun is 13664 before his. Both of ours are 70 stamped 979914 blocks, June built.

[69gtocv]

There is also an entry on the EUN list from a Pontiac built Gto that is about 23,000 vin units after Gtojohns, the EUN is 11,028 after.