[Trevor99TA]

Malky, my Flow Kooler looks like the pump posted by Grandville a few posts above (the pump on the left). although, It does have a disc brazed onto the fins that is the same size as the cast fins, so you are correct saying that all I can really see are the inlets and outlets. According to Flow Kooler this greatly improves the flow from idle to 3500 rpm's. I don't know, maybe I'll close up the gap to see if there is a difference. I don't seem to have an overheating problem now so maybe I should just leave it alone.

[Malky]

Trevor,
I agree - if you don't have a problem just leave it. How hot does it get in Wisconsin?

[george kujanski]

I believe the name on the Flow-Cooler is Milodon.

George

[gto1967]

Here's another supplier for the cast impeller 8 bolt pump.Re-manufactured NAPA 58-299, around $24.00

[71 T/A]

But if you need the short style 69 water pump, you can only get the cast impeller in a reman.

[Goatmon]

Great topic! Down here in Savannah, Ga. things are heating UP ! I went out Sat. had with the heat was creeping up to about 200 deg. in traffic. My after market aluimn. pump already has the backing welded to the impeller for increased flow. And when I get off work today there will be green in the Pan and I will be measuring this clearance.I haven't been alarmed yet but this sounds like an area to gain in. I'll reply tomorrow as to my clearance before and after.<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> 71 455 @ .060 / 67 GTO <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[GR8ONE68]

JACKPOT!

I just picked up a NAPA 58-299 as gto1967 recommended. The unit I got is an original Pontiac piece that has been rebuilt, $27.00. It has the part number cast into the body along with the date code. The impeller even has the part number cast into it. Here are pictures. Look at the height of the impeller blades, over 3/4" high. The tape measure is down in the pump housing not sitting up on the gasket surface. I ordered new plates and they actually hit the impeller without the gasket in place, this is going to be a tight fit. First of all, I don't have heating problems any longer. I have replaced the radiator, timing cover, plates, and I have duel electric fans from a '95 Ford Windstar. I can idle forever and not go over 165°F. The closest thing I have to a problem is on the highway at about 80 mph which is 4,000 rpm in my car with 28" tires and 4.11 gears. I will get up to 205°F. On the freeway, I would expect better cooling than at idle not the opposite. This is why I think I have too much clearance. That and the fact that the last water pump I had, the bearing froze and the shaft snapped. The fan went into the radiator (hence the new radiator above) and the impeller pushed back against the plates (again see new plates above). I put the plates back in because they were bent up a little, but not real bad. I will be installing the new pump and plates this weekend.

[GR8ONE68]

Part number.

[GR8ONE68]

Date Code

[GR8ONE68]

Impeller Height

[GR8ONE68]

Impeller Part Number

[71 formula]

I had that same problem with an electric fan setup. It turned out that the electric fan was actually obstructing air at hi speed. I put mechanical fan back on and was fine.

[azbirds]

Well, After reading all of this I wish that my 72 T/A was near enough to work on it. It has a rebuilt 455 HO and I haven't been able to get it to cool good. I've tried everything from a new pump (which one??) 160 t-stat, timing, carb jetting, fan clutch and yes, even a RR. The car will start off OK but slowly build heat, and lots of it (240+) I live in Phoenix, but it does this on days in the 70's, so in frustration my baby sits. I won't have a chance to check it out until June 1st, but reading all of this gives me hope that someday soon I will be able to drive this thing in 115 degree temps. I will post my findings as this will be the ultimate test of this fix.

[george kujanski]

Az: as mentioned in this thread and others, the RR does a great job of exchanging heat from the coolant to the air. If you were still heating, it would seem you have either too much waste heat in your engine, or you are not getting the waste heat out to the radiator to be cooled. I'd say it's doable; just have to find the root cause.

George

[azbirds]

George, I thought that the problem was beeing chased in the right maner but the more you hit your head against the wall the harder it gets to reason things out. It is a new engine and I was getting ready to pull it out and install my other HO in it's place and pull that one apart to see if I messed up somehow. I will check impeller clearance and the type of impeller that I used.

[PMDRACER]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I had that same problem with an electric fan setup. It turned out that the electric fan was actually obstructing air at hi speed. I put mechanical fan back on and was fine. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Quick question - did you mount the fan on the front of the radiator (pusher style) or behind the radiator (puller style). Mounting it in front can cause the electric fan to be a restriction.

I will be using two electric fans on the '71 from a 3.8 F**d Taurus. The fans are integrated into thier own shrouds. The trick will be to create an air door into each shroud that will let air pass when moving at speed. Otherwise they will be a restriction.

Hopefully I'll be able to get the setup on the car in the next few weeks. I'll take pics and post the results.

BTW - Jack and I tested the fans with an airflow meter. They flow over 1800 cfm each.

[71 formula]

I used the fan setup on the inside. I was one of those 2800 cfm flexalite fans with schroud on the inside. I did have a friend that got his setup to work. He has a 89 gta that we put a 455 in and he got a really big griffin radiator with the stock gta duel electric fan setup. But his motor was also less modified than mine and my 68 bird does not fit a big radiator.

[71 formula]

Azbirds did you hardblock the motor to the bottom of the freeze plug? Every motor i build i do that now and i have seem a 30 degree temp drop without changing anything else. Just a thought better than garaging the car.

[azbirds]

71 Formula, No I didn't. I have only done that to my racing blocks, but I've heard people say they use this on the street with no problem. The bad thing at this point is there is only one way to do it at this stage (pull it apart).

[JON240]

This is the first time using this website so no telling where this reply will end up. I own a 1967 GTO convertible with a 400 engine and I have had heating problems for several years. I did all the normal stuff, new water pump, new radiator etc. Finally I called my Livermore buddy, Vidguy, and he told me about this website. I read everything and shopped all around but could not find a cast impeller water pump but did get the divider plates and pump from Original Parts Group. When it came it didn't fit. Turns out I have a 69 timing cover. I sent it back and got a new pump but while I was in there working I noticed one of the sleeve and seal assemblies was missing. Called all around and found a new divider plate and two sleeve and seal assemblies in Antioch. I also took the divider plate and with a hammer bent the center over about 3/16 of an inch. Installed everything and went for a short drive. Oh, I also put in a new balanced HP thermostat (180). I only drove it about 10 miles but the temp never went over 190. This may have fixed the problem...thanks to all for your information.