[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Cool info Jim.
Thanks for bringing us back up to speed on your cars and conquests.
You Rock , Man !


Someone asked me in another thread a few days ago -
If didn't Knafel have a 68 Bird (maybe Ram2 ?).

I couldn't even remember for sure Knafel having a 68 Bird Tin Indian - this week.
Remembered immediately when i saw the pics again last night. (non-selective memory)
We had a brief pow-wow on here about it years ago - very little known about it to us around here.

Don't even know if it was D-port or Round port.
Just "guessing" it was an earlier D-Port since it doesn't seem to have a big race history compared to the Ram2 GTO they raced. just dunno

Is this the car from Ohio Dealer that you have, that is being restored now ?
If it is , or isn't , do you know any details about this Bird ?
It appears it was a White body with Black interior.

From SteveD400 (Steve Hoog) website:

Alright, here is one that fell through the cracks! This 1968 Firebird was raced out of Knafel Pontiac as a Tin Indian.

Some how through the course of time the history of this car fell into a black hole. The story and pictures are provided by John Watson formally of Akron; John’s brother Tom bought this car from Knafel after the race season and it was to never be heard from again until John contacted me October of 2007.

Apparently this Green and White 1968 Firebird was raced; and the Red and Silver 1967 Firebird may have been a show piece.

[MikeNoun]

Knafel raced the green and white Firebird. I've never seen a picture of the red and white Knafel Bird being raced.

[Half-Inch Stud]

12. 1968 RA II Convertible Verdoro Green, Original unrestored. some guy I know, not named Ron. Not 1,8,9.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by Half-Inch Stud

12. 1968 RA II Convertible Verdoro Green, Original unrestored. some guy I know, not named Ron. Not 1,8,9.

That "MIGHT" actually be car #11.
It's one from Joe-ramair2's original list.
Obviously very little / too little info was given on that car.
when Joe checks back in - maybe he can confirm.


Is there anyway possible you could get any additional details ?
Is it 4spd or Auto ? Interior / top colors ?
Build date ? PHS ? picture ? anything ?
Not trying to pinpoint owner or location - just the car itself.


Have been reluctant to add any hear-say type cars to the list.
Several of those have popped in and out with little to no info or details.
I trust your word and knowledge, but more details will keep cars from getting confused or double counted. Or from not being counted at all.

I'm trying to keep it as accurate as possible.

Thanks H-I-S

[Half-Inch Stud]

YES I CAN. NO I WON'T. Well, maybe. Some answers inserted within quote:

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

That "MIGHT" actually be car #11.
It's one from Joe-ramair2's original list.
Obviously very little / too little info was given on that car.
when Joe checks back in - maybe he can confirm.


Is there anyway possible you could get any additional details ? YES
Is it 4spd or Auto ? Interior / top colors ? WILL SUPPLY
Build date ? PHS ? picture ? anything ? MAYBE, IT DOES, PROBABLY
Not trying to pinpoint owner or location - just the car itself. OWNER IS SCHMART.


Have been reluctant to add any hear-say type cars to the list. FIRST-HAND FOR ME.
Several of those have popped in and out with little to no info or details.
I trust your word and knowledge, but more details will keep cars from getting confused or double counted. Or from not being counted at all.

I'm trying to keep it as accurate as possible. WORTHY TO VISIT ( I NEED TO CHECK SOMETHING, BUY SOMETHING, RENT SOME BEER)

Thanks H-I-S

[Judge273]

Sharing info on a car they have is a bad thing for owners? I guess it is their right, but even Yenko guys share their cars info with pride......

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by Half-Inch Stud

Well, maybe. Some answers inserted within quote:

Was hoping Joe would have been back on and commented about whether car #11 was the same car as the Vert you know of.

We'll go ahead and add that Vert anyway when you find out a few more specs on it.
Sooner or later he'll find his way back to this thread.
Can make any adjustments then.

Thanks for anything else you might be able to find out.

[Diego]

I know of a funky two-tone RAII but I thought it was from western MI?

['ol Pinion head]

Originally Posted by Diego

I know of a funky two-tone RAII but I thought it was from western MI?

The one I'm referring to def was ordered & delivered to Iowa.

[Diego]

I don't doubt you, but I wonder if the one I'm thinking of was really from IA? I'd have to ask my friend. I believe he told me the same dealership later ordered a SD 455 T/A in primer, but I could be mixing up two stories.

[MikeNoun]

Hmmm...well, we're comparing die-casts here, not the real car. Maybe they made a few different runs of the die-cast, but I was always under the impression it was red with an off-white.



I think some of the confusion may be that there was a 67 and a 68 Knafel Firebird. The only color photo I've seen of the 68 version was green and white, while the b&w photo of the 68 that everyone has seen is the one where it's sitting on the showroom floor, and it's missing the parking lights.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Mike ...


its Silver and Bronze in your sample too.
maybe a lil orange'r looking due to light/angle.
the pic i posted captures it best.

I had a color shot of the real 67 Knafel Bird - bit its on a crashed box.
Will work on finding something if i can.

but anyways

i posted 2 color shots of the 68 White Green Gold Knafel Bird , De-Lettered.
Here is 1 more with tell-tale ghost shadows visible in the paint.

[MikeNoun]

If you notice on the nose of the 68 version sitting on their showroom, the AMT sticker is covered up. It's the rectangular spot on the front fender, just below the Firebird script. AMT made a model of the Knafel Bird. Not an exact replica obviously, but they sponsored the car. And darn it, that looks red too.

Also noticed that on Steve's webpage, he states, "Apparently this Green and White 1968 Firebird was raced; and the Red and Silver 1967 Firebird may have been a show piece."

[MikeNoun]

Here's a photo of the green car.

[muscle_collector]

Originally Posted by MikeNoun

Hmmm...well, we're comparing die-casts here, not the real car. Maybe they made a few different runs of the die-cast, but I was always under the impression it was red with an off-white.



I think some of the confusion may be that there was a 67 and a 68 Knafel Firebird. The only color photo I've seen of the 68 version was green and white, while the b&w photo of the 68 that everyone has seen is the one where it's sitting on the showroom floor, and it's missing the parking lights.

man i am diggin that wheel / tire combo

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

1. VooDoo Green - Black Deluxe Bench - 4spd
Matching #'s
Restored - 3 owners - 62,000 actual miles
Documented BHC on PY
Joe RamAir2 on PY


2. Special Paint " Bright Green Metallic " - now BlackCherry - Black interior - 4spd
Real Nice Survivor Driver - Matching #'s
Gary - Muscle_Collector on PY
Documented


3. Autumn Bronze - Black Std interior - 4spd
Restored
Has beaten every type Muscle Car ever built at least once in its lifetime on a 1/4 mile.
Most all of them beaten repeatedly for years and years and years.
And still counting....
Jim Mino
Documented BHC on PY


4. Autumn Bronze - Black Std interior - 4spd
Kevin - former Jim Mino car
Restored
Documented


5. Special Paint Red - Red interior - 4spd
Restored - with 9,000 actual miles - only 1 non-required option = Rally Gauges
Radio and Heat DELETE - Bare Bone to the Bone
Currently in Pontiac Museum
Rob C.


6. Convertible - Triple Black - 4spd
Concours restored , Matching #'s
Mark


7. Nightshade Green - 4spd
Matching #'s , in need of full resto
Mark , again


8. VooDoo Green - Blk interior - Blk vinyl top - 4spd
5k miles cosmetic restored - Matching #s
Rob L.


9. VooDoo Green - 4spd
Now restored Triple Black - in process of assembly
Rob L. , again


10. Convertible - Red , White interior , Black top - 4spd
Matching #'s - in need of full resto
Originally Red , presently Green
GC.
documented BHC on PY - supplied by Jim Mino


11. 4spd - 2 owners - Matching #'s
Needs Full Resto
UNKNOWN


12. Special Paint Red - Black Std interior - 4spd
Hood Tach, Gauges, SoftRay All
DELETE heater, radio, carpet padding, seam sealer, 1 horn
1700 miles currently , and previously painted Black
Sold new and sponsored by Wells Pontiac of Richmond, Indiana.
Raced by the Frame Brothers.
Documented


13. White - Black Bench Seat interior - Automatic Column Shift
First Ram2 Bird produced
Ordered and Raced by an Ohio Pontiac Dealer
Currently being restored
Jim Mino
Documented


14. Convertible - Red - Black Custom interior - Black Power Top - 4spd
Highly optioned - currently being restored
Found at Carlisle with miscellaneous engine - with proper wisdom / knowledge was purchased from unsuspecting seller.
Goes to show about being in the know - thats what it takes !
Rick
Documented


15. Special Order Paint Windward Blue - Black Interior - 4spd
Hood Tach, Rally Gauge/Wheels/Stripes (Stripes are gone)
# Matching, Unrestored. 58K miles
PY member dameyerfam
Documented BHC on PY




MIA - 68 Tin Indian Bird - Knafel Pontiac OhiO
appears to have been a White body with Black interior
unkown Engine type / unknown Transmission type

MIA - Towne Pontiac Race Car - Winnepeg Manitoba Canada
Red - Black interior - 4spd

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Welcome to the Forum Rick Mahoney.
Heavy Congrats on that awesome Convertible !
Way to go Man.

Thanks for sharing the info and adding another to the count.
I'm under the impression that car #10 - since it had initials of GC - might belong to a collector in Maryland.

Keep on Crushing the Competition with the Power of the Mighty Deuce.

[dameyerfam]

I still own the car I posted about in 2007. Below is the billing history from PHS.

Windward Blue - Black Interior – 4 Speed
Hood Tach, Rally Gauge/Wheels/Stripes (Stripes are gone)
# Matching, Unrestored. 58K miles

[Rocky Rotella]

From what I was told from the original owner, the car from Iowa was black with a turquoise painted top. Definitely a R/A II, column shift automatic.

Has it surfaced?

[Diego]

Originally Posted by Rocky Rotella

From what I was told from the original owner, the car from Iowa was black with a turquoise painted top. Definitely a R/A II, column shift automatic.

I just confirmed this is the car I thought was from MI but it's from IA. Chances are it's the same car that OPh was thinking of, which begs the question: Did he get the color combo wrong? Or is there another two-tone RAII car out there?