[gtofreek]

I'll go out on a limb by saying with 99.9% confidence that it is not piston slap.

1. It does not sound like piston slap.
2. I setup the pistons with the minimum .0045" clearance that they call for, and I use a torque plate with the same type gasket that I used to assemble with. I've setup a lot of engines with these pistons at .0045" and never had a noise from them. Plus I've honed thousands of blocks over the last 26 years so I'm pretty good at it. I hone to the tenth of a thousandth of an inch so I can say with confidence it had .0045" clearance.

My best guess at this point is possibly a piston pin trying to gall in the pistons bore, but I set those up at .0008" clearance, so they shouldn't be trying to gall. Or possibly a piston skirt collapsed for some reason.

In any case, I will be going to work tomorrow and tearing it down, so I should have an answer for you all tomorrow. My biggest fear is that I won't find anything obvious, so I think it's going to take a very close examination of everything.

[torqhead]

Originally Posted by gtofreek

I'll go out on a limb by saying with 99.9% confidence that it is not piston slap.

1. It does not sound like piston slap.
2. I setup the pistons with the minimum .0045" clearance that they call for, and I use a torque plate with the same type gasket that I used to assemble with. I've setup a lot of engines with these pistons at .0045" and never had a noise from them. Plus I've honed thousands of blocks over the last 26 years so I'm pretty good at it. I hone to the tenth of a thousandth of an inch so I can say with confidence it had .0045" clearance.

My best guess at this point is possibly a piston pin trying to gall in the pistons bore, but I set those up at .0008" clearance, so they shouldn't be trying to gall. Or possibly a piston skirt collapsed for some reason.

In any case, I will be going to work tomorrow and tearing it down, so I should have an answer for you all tomorrow. My biggest fear is that I won't find anything obvious, so I think it's going to take a very close examination of everything.

Paul, in no way was I implying you would have done something wrong. I have the upmost respect for your work even though I haven't had you do anything for me personally....... yet....

Anyhow, if a piston skirt collapsed causing piston slap wouldn't that still count ... I know this is definitely an interesting one for all of us and confident you'll figure out what the hell it is!

[gtofreek]

Originally Posted by torqhead

Paul, in no way was I implying you would have done something wrong. I have the upmost respect for your work even though I haven't had you do anything for me personally....... yet....

Anyhow, if a piston skirt collapsed causing piston slap wouldn't that still count ... I know this is definitely an interesting one for all of us and confident you'll figure out what the hell it is!

Trust me, no offense taken. I have pretty thick skin! But yes, you are right, I suppose if a skirt did collapse, it would count as piston slap, so yes, you would be right in that case. Thanks for the confidence!

[Va68goat]

cnc,
Yes, this is the same distributor that was used during the dyno.

[Va68goat]

What a relief....Paul called it early on that it was going to be something stupid. Since I don't know cars that well, I don't how rare of an issue this is but I'll always remember this one.

I purchased the MSD "Ready to run" distributor Part# 8528 at Advance Auto Parts on March 6th, 2017 (Just incase any of you guys are wanting to know where and when it was purchased). I had to order it online because it's not over the counter.

https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/...528/22360318-P

[Va68goat]

Paul,

I guess doing what I did for a living made me a little OCD..Yes, I have pictures of the MSD distributor box when it was mailed to me. I looked at my book of receipts and i saw that I purchased the distributor on March 6, 2017. When I ordered it online from Advance Auto, it was selling for $411.99. I used a gift card and a coupon code and I ended up paying $311.99 (tax included)

[ponchjoe]

I’d mag the windage tray

[TedRamAirII]

Great News! Too bad it had to be removed and shipped back for that. I thought the distributor had been examined already? The noise seemed pretty "rhythmic" on the video, so I figure with a load on the oil pump shaft, it must have been hitting every revolution. I sure was fooled by the noise, as it sounded like it was in the bottom, not from the top, and certainly not a "clicky" type noise. That's why I suggested to get your hand around the engine and feel for vibrations, you may have picked up on a bad vibration originating from the distributor area. A good thing is that Paul gets to look it over and verify and all is well. Although it would not have made sense at the time, to even check the distributor, a shop with a ignition scope would have surely seen a irregular ignition pattern. I can tell you, I dont think anybody would have put a knock and ignition issue together! I'm sure Paul will get it shipped back ASAP and you can get RIPPIN'

MSD 90 day warranty! They really stand behind their product! It surely didn't last that long. I would contact them and try to send it back. I'll bet they blame it on the engine and claim "Nobody else has had that problem!"

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by TedRamAirII

Although it would not have made sense at the time, to even check the distributor, a shop with a ignition scope would have surely seen a irregular ignition pattern. I can tell you, I dont think anybody would have put a knock and ignition issue together! I'm sure Paul will get it shipped back ASAP and you can get RIPPIN'

Actually I suggested it very early on in this thread. I've had sounds just like this that were distributor related, timing related, vacuum advance related, or any one of those scenarios. But when I mentioned it, there weren't any other comments mentioned afterwards other than Highway said he would look closer at that deal. Then nothing mentioned as they went on to other things and swore it was the windage tray.

I would tend to think that looking at the pics Paul posted and the severe wear, especially up on the reluctor wheel and magnet, that if the timing was checked as I suggested, someone would have seen something erratic going on that might have warranted some further inspection.

We talked about this last weekend when I was down there. I knew all along it was going to be something simple and was no fault of Paul at all.

Excellent detective work Paul, as usual.

[cnc]

I'm goin rod issue.....due to oil starvation for some reason.....It's a guessing game right .....
Been through this twice ......not fun.....
Hope Paul figures the issue out.....

[wrench]

I think you will tear it down and find absolutely nothing wrong. I hope I'm wrong, easy to fix if you find an issue, but I like that sign, lol. So that's my guess.

[Va68goat]

Originally Posted by wrench

I think you will tear it down and find absolutely nothing wrong. I hope I'm wrong, easy to fix if you find an issue, but I like that sign, lol. So that's my guess.

I dont know if guessing finding nothing wrong will be the winning answer considering the strange knocking noise. I hope it's something simple but unless that knocking noise is normal, I'm sure he will find something!

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[Cardo]

I've got a feeling it's oil pump related... that half speed in relation to rpm and deep in the motor makes me think it's there.

[gtofreek]

Originally Posted by Cardo

I've got a feeling it's oil pump related... that half speed in relation to rpm and deep in the motor makes me think it's there.

Unfortunately, that has already been eliminated as the cause.

[dataway]

I am also voting for an oil pump/ oil pump drive issue.

[grivera]

I think one of the crank counterweights is making contact with something - maybe the windage tray after the oil pan is installed. As in the oil pan making contact with the windage tray and pushing it so crank clearance is compromised.

[tooski]

Originally Posted by grivera

I think one of the crank counterweights is making contact with something - maybe the windage tray after the oil pan is installed. As in the oil pan making contact with the windage tray and pushing it so crank clearance is compromised.

If it is half engine speed, it wouldn't be a counterweight making contact.
I've been watching this thread as I'm curious.

[JSPONT]

The second you tube video(the short one) really shows the issue. I have never had a MSD wear out that bad. There was a bunch of bogus MSD stuff a few years back being sold.
Great work Paul, sad to think someone could have slandered your name over an issue that had nothing to do with you. Glad to see that did not happen here.

[Va68goat]

Formulajones,

The timing was checked at least 4 times during this process. Of course I have no clue how to time it but but nothing was mentioned that was erratic. I sure learned a lot with this experience!

[napster]

I wonder if this carries over to other items from MSD. I have had five engines built and each one uses the MSD Ready to Run distributor. I haven't had a problem. Haven't heard any noises coming from the engines.

I'm having another one built. We'll see what to do when it comes to the time we dyno the engine.

Jim