[Firebob]

Yeah, I kind of did "already know that". Just needed some confirmation to make me feel better about my decicision. Not that my clutch and rear will last any longer with what I currently have but at least I can say that I didn't purposely do something I knew was wrong(ha, like it would be the first time or something).

[GOAT WHORE]

Just don't run sticky tires and you'll be fine, imo.

[ponyakr]

Might as well add mine to the junk pile. I raced with 8.2's in a 4-speed Goat and a '68 Bird with TH400 & 9" converter. Won races with both. But that was with 400 engines.

Then I started bracket racing and switched to 455's. They probably only made 400hp, but had 500ft lbs of torque. I switched to 12 bolts in both cars and never broke one.

Then I put another '68 Bird together for another guy to drive. Well I didn't have another 12 bolt, but I found a Buick 8.2 posi with 3.64 gears, real cheap. I've read that the Buick 8.2's are stronger than the Pontiac 8.2's. Don't know if it's so or not.

"1967 buick still used the pontiac gears sets but the GS had larger 507 ag bearing to take more performance load
1968 ALL buicks skylarks and lesabre used the new designed 10 bolt 8.2 with the large driver side bearing and larger left hand thread bolts and MUCH larger inner bearing shaft of 1.875. Buick always had a 27 spline yoke ,but used a different outer seal diameter then the Pontiac. They used the 8620 pinion seal." "THE 68-70 BUICK 8.2 is different."

http://fabcraftmetalworks.com/produc...-Pinion-Gears/

http://forum.jdrace.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=324

Anyhow, with a very mild 455 and TH400 with stock 13" converter, the car hooked good and would even get a little air under the front tires. It ran consistent 12.50's and won some races. The rear lasted almost the whole season, maybe 150-200 runs. Then one night in Tyler, Texas it broke on the track at the 1-2 shift.

Besides being broke, everybody is mad, cause we dumped rear end grease on the track. So, nothing but 12 bolts or 8.5" 10 bolts since then. And make sure you tack weld the axle tubes to the center section in at least 4 spots 90 degrees apart, if you plan to put sticky tires on it. I tried to get by one race without doing it and wound up with the pinion yoke sticking up thru a hole in the floor.

[67GTONUT]

How much stronger is the 8.2 with the "N" cast in it? ....

I am lucky enough to have that in mine..... but I am always curious how much abuse it can hold....

[GOAT WHORE]

Big difference in getting an 8.2 to live on the street compared to lifting the tires off the ground at the track.
This is the street section

[goatwgn]

Originally Posted by GOAT WHORE

Big difference in getting an 8.2 to live on the street compared to lifting the tires off the ground at the track.
This is the street section

Very, very true. If it hooks up a lot of things start showing their weak spots.

[carcrazy]

I've scattered more 8.2's than I care to think about. Some with relatively stock 400's. As noted by many, you'll "probably" be ok unless you have sticky tires. Myself-I won't run one anymore!!!

[stickboy]

I wouldn't do an 8.2 even on a street tire. A spinning tire is not as safe as a hooking tire - on the street. Put a good rear end behind that much power because you want a sticky tire so you can control the car. If it is always spinning, it's not as safe and you could ditch it if you are not careful.

Plus its no fun to sit and spin, more fun to hook and go!
just my 2c

['ol Pinion head]

Originally Posted by 67GTONUT

How much stronger is the 8.2 with the "N" cast in it? ....

I am lucky enough to have that in mine..... but I am always curious how much abuse it can hold....

Have known of a few nodular early Bird rears that lived in high 10 sec Birds with a careful maintainance procedure. The Birds were all conderably lighter than A-body's and seemed to hold up, have yet to run across a nodular 8.2 that lived at the same 60 foot times in a 3600-3800 lb A-body. note: as with any leaf spring rear, the axle tubes have to be carefully welded to the center section. otherwise if the car hooks and the factory plug welds are weak, the axle tube will spin.

Pontiac went to the nodular center housing construction in its performance ratio 8.2's in '67. it's not the smaller pinion bearing that's the problem, it's the lack of pinion support in the weak gray iron 8.2 Pontiac housing. Thats why Pontiac used a crutch, the nodular housing, to reduce warranty claims when building their performance application 8.2 rears. In the best HD 8.2 Safe-T-Tracks, they also installed the good forged axles. Over 25 years ago, I picked through the first blown up 8.2 Pontiac rears I had aquaintance to in essence, learn on. All but one were gray iron Pontiac 8.2 rears with with low gears, 4.10-4.88 Zooms. Pinon deflection under heavy loads is what killed them.

In the early 90's several of us in N Texas also had been toiling with the weak gray iron 8.2's and stumbled onto what intrinsic strength an 8.5 A-body rear has. It's strength is a direct correlation to the 8.5 having much more pinion support. Sure, it has the larger (small) pinion bearing shared with a 12 bolt, but the 8.5 also has more beef in the pinion area, and thus more pinion support. We also had figured out what an improvement tapered axle bearings were over sealed axle bearings. Later I found out Dodge & Plymouth figured that out around 1965, having gotten away from the archaic sealed axle bearings a good 4 years before Ford and GM. Upon understanding how strong the 8.5 rear was & through building basically blueprinted stockers that many were ran at the track, we learned the stock 8.5's axle limitations and how to make the 8.5 hold up under much quicker vehicles. Around that time built a few 12 bolts with Moroso Brute Strength carriers & in a move tp improve on axle strength began building 8.5 a body rears with 30 spline Eaton carriers & A10 axle bearing Moser axles. Both style builds were run into the high 10's in footbraked 3600-3900lb A-body's on slicks. Even built a few 8.5 Nova rears with 33 spline spools and axles, in light weight budget built built Novas and early Camaro's each were running consistently into the low 10's. The choice was made on my case, to never look back, if someone wanted an early gray iron 8.2 Pontiac rear gone through, had no problem if it was for a restoration or moderate street machine type vehicle. Trying to throw a ton more torque at an 8.2 than it was designed for, not going there, been there before.

When a question like the OP's is asked, it would be easy for me to state, yeah if you take it easy on it... Today, it simply boils down to for most of what I've been building rears for over the last 20 years, the gray iron 8.2's are I'll say it, junk, and very expensive junk to rebuild with new posis, quality new gears, and HD axles. Even with $1300-1600 thrown at them, the big weaknesses remain. Why throw good money after bad?

One can always argue this is the Street Section. Hate to say it guys I've personally seen the results of broken stock axles in 13 sec street cars, a spun axle tube in a 13 sec street driven 78 Z28 that spun its axle tube on the street on $60 a piece rock hard 60 series tires. Not even going there with what some consider a streetcar. Trying to downplay things like how a vehicle rear may be torque loaded just takes away in safety margin. Even GM divisional engineers realized in the late 60's how strong the differentials were and made signifocant strides to either upgrade them or replace them with something quite a bit stronger. 500 ft lbs of torque, imho, is too much for a gray iron 8.2 in a performance A-body, esp in a manual trans car with sticky tires which is shifted at anything above a moderate level. Behind iron headed tripower equipped 455 '65 and 66 GTO's and LeMans with auto transmissions, I do know of a few prepped early gray iron 8.2's that are still alive.

[i82much]

http://www.strangeengineering.net/hi...ng-mounts.html

[Skip Fix]

When I raced the NMCA Top Stock class with my TA John McWhirter (an original Comp Cams owner) and his 67 442 stick tri power (a race car since new) were in my class. John was running high 11s where most of us were mid to low 12 sec cars. His car left hard too. If you drew John in a runoff you knew you had a 50-50 chance of beating him-if his rear held up he won, if he broke -quite often -you won. This was a 9" slick class.

John finally started re heat treating the gears himself also as they would break. He found a way to machine the pads on the cones to keep the posi going before they ere other aftermaket posis available.

[Nicks67GTO]

Originally Posted by 'ol Pinion head

Have known of a few nodular early Bird rears that lived in high 10 sec Birds with a careful maintainance procedure. The Birds were all conderably lighter than A-body's and seemed to hold up, have yet to run across a nodular 8.2 that lived at the same 60 foot times in a 3600-3800 lb A-body. note: as with any leaf spring rear, the axle tubes have to be carefully welded to the center section. otherwise if the car hooks and the factory plug welds are weak, the axle tube will spin.

Pontiac went to the nodular center housing construction in its performance ratio 8.2's in '67. it's not the smaller pinion bearing that's the problem, it's the lack of pinion support in the weak gray iron 8.2 Pontiac housing. Thats why Pontiac used a crutch, the nodular housing, to reduce warranty claims when building their performance application 8.2 rears. In the best HD 8.2 Safe-T-Tracks, they also installed the good forged axles. Over 25 years ago, I picked through the first blown up 8.2 Pontiac rears I had aquaintance to in essence, learn on. All but one were gray iron Pontiac 8.2 rears with with low gears, 4.10-4.88 Zooms. Pinon deflection under heavy loads is what killed them.

In the early 90's several of us in N Texas also had been toiling with the weak gray iron 8.2's and stumbled onto what intrinsic strength an 8.5 A-body rear has. It's strength is a direct correlation to the 8.5 having much more pinion support. Sure, it has the larger (small) pinion bearing shared with a 12 bolt, but the 8.5 also has more beef in the pinion area, and thus more pinion support. We also had figured out what an improvement tapered axle bearings were over sealed axle bearings. Later I found out Dodge & Plymouth figured that out around 1965, having gotten away from the archaic sealed axle bearings a good 4 years before Ford and GM. Upon understanding how strong the 8.5 rear was & through building basically blueprinted stockers that many were ran at the track, we learned the stock 8.5's axle limitations and how to make the 8.5 hold up under much quicker vehicles. Around that time built a few 12 bolts with Moroso Brute Strength carriers & in a move tp improve on axle strength began building 8.5 a body rears with 30 spline Eaton carriers & A10 axle bearing Moser axles. Both style builds were run into the high 10's in footbraked 3600-3900lb A-body's on slicks. Even built a few 8.5 Nova rears with 33 spline spools and axles, in light weight budget built built Novas and early Camaro's each were running consistently into the low 10's. The choice was made on my case, to never look back, if someone wanted an early gray iron 8.2 Pontiac rear gone through, had no problem if it was for a restoration or moderate street machine type vehicle. Trying to throw a ton more torque at an 8.2 than it was designed for, not going there, been there before.

When a question like the OP's is asked, it would be easy for me to state, yeah if you take it easy on it... Today, it simply boils down to for most of what I've been building rears for over the last 20 years, the gray iron 8.2's are I'll say it, junk, and very expensive junk to rebuild with new posis, quality new gears, and HD axles. Even with $1300-1600 thrown at them, the big weaknesses remain. Why throw good money after bad?

One can always argue this is the Street Section. Hate to say it guys I've personally seen the results of broken stock axles in 13 sec street cars, a spun axle tube in a 13 sec street driven 78 Z28 that spun its axle tube on the street on $60 a piece rock hard 60 series tires. Not even going there with what some consider a streetcar. Trying to downplay things like how a vehicle rear may be torque loaded just takes away in safety margin. Even GM divisional engineers realized in the late 60's how strong the differentials were and made signifocant strides to either upgrade them or replace them with something quite a bit stronger. 500 ft lbs of torque, imho, is too much for a gray iron 8.2 in a performance A-body, esp in a manual trans car with sticky tires which is shifted at anything above a moderate level. Behind iron headed tripower equipped 455 '65 and 66 GTO's and LeMans with auto transmissions, I do know of a few prepped early gray iron 8.2's that are still alive.

This^^^^ is exactly why I decided to shy away from an 8.2 and build a 9". Can they live? Sure. Its happened. But can you rely on them? No.

[Lemans64]

I run a 8.2 in my 64 with 530 hp, muncie 4spd. Multi disc clutch.
3.9 rear gear, BUT I also run an Auburn posi unit with moser axles and street 255/70/15 tires BFG t/a's. No breakage yet. And yes it gets abused.

[Tom Vaught]

Originally Posted by Skip Fix

When I raced the NMCA Top Stock class with my TA John McWhirter (an original Comp Cams owner) and his 67 442 stick tri power (a race car since new) were in my class. John was running high 11s where most of us were mid to low 12 sec cars. His car left hard too. If you drew John in a runoff you knew you had a 50-50 chance of beating him-if his rear held up he won, if he broke -quite often -you won. This was a 9" slick class.

John finally started re heat treating the gears himself also as they would break. He found a way to machine the pads on the cones to keep the posi going before they ere other aftermaket posis available.

How did he get away with running the 1966 One Year Only Tri-Power on a 1967 442, Skip? You break a lot of stuff with 8.2 axles, a good 9" Slick tire class, and a 11 second vehicle (WITH A MANUAL TRANS), LOL!

Tom V.

[Skip Fix]

Tom could have been a 66, those look alike to me not being a Olds expert. Still like old 442s and Hurst Olds.

One of our Texas NMCA "running buddies" what farmer from Amarillo ran a 70's W-30 in the Pure Stock classes.

John was a great guy and would help you with anything. The Comp guys the Smeltnicks were great too they sponsored the original NMCA stuff car show and race days with heads up classes. A lot of fun for guys like us that weren't professional racers.

[Tom Vaught]

Originally Posted by Skip Fix

Tom could have been a 66, those look alike to me not being a Olds expert. Still like old 442s and Hurst Olds.

One of our Texas NMCA "running buddies" what farmer from Amarillo ran a 70's W-30 in the Pure Stock classes.

John was a great guy and would help you with anything. The Comp guys the Smeltnicks were great too they sponsored the original NMCA stuff car show and race days with heads up classes. A lot of fun for guys like us that weren't professional racers.

Yes, John's 66 could have been one of the original 54 cars with the W-30 option, from the factory (he had enough money to afford to buy one). Olds built another 93 “Track Pack” conversions, (Olds Dealers retrofitting the 93 cars with the W30 components). I worked on two of the W-30 cars for a guy in Naples, Florida and he was the original owner of one of the two cars.
That is why I asked Skip!

Tom V.

[Half-Inch Stud]

OPH ditto.

Dana60 or 12-Bolt look nice, and handle hard play. Been wondering about the Ford/Lincoln 8.8 rears for our old GM cars.

['ol Pinion head]

Originally Posted by Half-Inch Stud

OPH ditto.

Dana60 or 12-Bolt look nice, and handle hard play. Been wondering about the Ford/Lincoln 8.8 rears for our old GM cars.

have no need for a Dana... not running a teansbrake or building the 9 sec streetcar.
8.8's, in a leaf spring street rod, would be worth a go, too much work in an A-body.

For my own '72 & 71 A bodys, am sticking with big tapered bearing axle 8.5 A-body rears. With two of the three having original coded 12bolts, have no desire to trim their hsg ends off and go with the Strange street/strip c-clip elims. With the same size A10 tapered bearing end stock on the GM A body housing, very hard to beat it in value also have the bonus of more pinion support than a common 12 bolt.

[hectore3]

I broke an 8.2 with a bone stock 2 barrel "economy" 400 Pontiac. I wouldn't trust those rears for performance use. if my memory serves me right GM's dividing line for rear end step up to 12 bolts was 300hp. That was back when it was 300 gross!

[azbirds]

Originally Posted by hectore3

I broke an 8.2 with a bone stock 2 barrel "economy" 400 Pontiac. I wouldn't trust those rears for performance use. if my memory serves me right GM's dividing line for rear end step up to 12 bolts was 300hp. That was back when it was 300 gross!

that doesn't make sense. All Firebirds with the 400 would have the 12 bolt then.