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#61
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Quote:
Stewart
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1976 TA, nose converted to 1970 style, 406, ported #13 Heads, '70 iron intake without crossovers, Q-Jet - Cliff style, RARE OS manifolds, Pypes duals w/crossflow, UD 230/238 custom HR 4/7 swap cam with solid roller lifters , Hydro-Boost 4-wheel discs, 4 Speed, 3.23 posi. “Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.” - Winston Churchill |
#62
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Well...., I know that most cam cards list lash at the valve with 1.5 rockers, you would need to add 10% with 1.65's. For example, Harold Brookshire suggested I use .018 with 1.5's and the UD solid, I run .020 with 1.65's. Also there is such a thing as "lobe lash" which confuses the matter even more(to my small brain-LOL). So... do you think .006 at the top of the valve stem would be correct with 1.65 rockers? I am thinking maybe ..007? Does it matter? Is there a range for tight lashing solids on a HR? Cliff, you out there? Thanks -Jim
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#63
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Is there any way to view the actual profile of the lobe?
Meaning, the 050 is being shown with a hyd roller lifter. What are the real specs with the solid? |
#64
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Jim:
If you want to take it to .007" or .008" go ahead, no harm, no foul. I've never heard of varying the lash because of the rocker ratio though. Stewart
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1976 TA, nose converted to 1970 style, 406, ported #13 Heads, '70 iron intake without crossovers, Q-Jet - Cliff style, RARE OS manifolds, Pypes duals w/crossflow, UD 230/238 custom HR 4/7 swap cam with solid roller lifters , Hydro-Boost 4-wheel discs, 4 Speed, 3.23 posi. “Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.” - Winston Churchill |
#65
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Quote:
Stewart
__________________
1976 TA, nose converted to 1970 style, 406, ported #13 Heads, '70 iron intake without crossovers, Q-Jet - Cliff style, RARE OS manifolds, Pypes duals w/crossflow, UD 230/238 custom HR 4/7 swap cam with solid roller lifters , Hydro-Boost 4-wheel discs, 4 Speed, 3.23 posi. “Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.” - Winston Churchill |
#66
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My thoughts are the space is most important between the cam lobe and the lifter (lobe lash). To make this space the same when measured between 1.5 and 1.65 rockers, 10 percent should be added when measured at the top of valve stem? -Jim
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#67
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I degree My cams with sollid lifters regardless, I also use light checking springs instead, don't forget to check piston to valve clearance. .006 lash is ok with 1.65 rockers, .010 is as loose as you want to run it, The more i look at running a sollid roller on a hyd roller I don't like it, No lash ramp and a Very small lash window to stay in, I know Myself and I'd be checking all the time to make sure its not loosening up I guess the proof will be a real street/strip car and lots of Miles, I know there are cars running them But i think for the majority Hyd roller is plenty fine for anything 10's and slower JMO, The Comp Xtreme Street Sollid Rollers are good cams, The XR292R in Cutrones 69 GP is awesome gring for 455's
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D.S.R.E. Your NW Pontiac Street/Strip Engine Builder, Specializing in Cylinder Head,Intake Manifold,and Exhaust Manifold Porting services and Building the Most Efficient stock rebuilds to Hi HP Pump Gas and Race Combinations for Pontiac,Buicks,Olds,FE Fords,385 Series and HP Gen 3 and 4 LS engines! 2006 silvy Z71 4X4,383 LS 600+hp NA Shared Toy-66 Lemans 470cid by me 537hp 580tq-manifolds, 570hp 590tq-2"headers,custom cam,rpm intake, mild e-heads, Looks stock ;-} |
#68
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#69
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Quote:
Stewart
__________________
1976 TA, nose converted to 1970 style, 406, ported #13 Heads, '70 iron intake without crossovers, Q-Jet - Cliff style, RARE OS manifolds, Pypes duals w/crossflow, UD 230/238 custom HR 4/7 swap cam with solid roller lifters , Hydro-Boost 4-wheel discs, 4 Speed, 3.23 posi. “Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.” - Winston Churchill |
#70
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Quote:
Stewart
__________________
1976 TA, nose converted to 1970 style, 406, ported #13 Heads, '70 iron intake without crossovers, Q-Jet - Cliff style, RARE OS manifolds, Pypes duals w/crossflow, UD 230/238 custom HR 4/7 swap cam with solid roller lifters , Hydro-Boost 4-wheel discs, 4 Speed, 3.23 posi. “Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.” - Winston Churchill |
#71
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Quote:
Stewart
__________________
1976 TA, nose converted to 1970 style, 406, ported #13 Heads, '70 iron intake without crossovers, Q-Jet - Cliff style, RARE OS manifolds, Pypes duals w/crossflow, UD 230/238 custom HR 4/7 swap cam with solid roller lifters , Hydro-Boost 4-wheel discs, 4 Speed, 3.23 posi. “Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.” - Winston Churchill |
#72
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Why go through all this when you can specify fast ramp action (different lobe profiles MSP-UD, RT, etc -comp) in a solid profile? |
#73
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As to how it is spec'ed, I guess you'd have to talk to Tim Goolsby at Bullet Cams. Stewart
__________________
1976 TA, nose converted to 1970 style, 406, ported #13 Heads, '70 iron intake without crossovers, Q-Jet - Cliff style, RARE OS manifolds, Pypes duals w/crossflow, UD 230/238 custom HR 4/7 swap cam with solid roller lifters , Hydro-Boost 4-wheel discs, 4 Speed, 3.23 posi. “Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.” - Winston Churchill |
#74
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Stewart-
I agree on the asymmetric lobes being easier on components. |
#75
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Stewarts Ultradyne hydraulic roller could be lobes HR14 and HR15 but that's a guess based on their website information or it's close to these. The specs on these lobes are:
284/292 rated at .006" tappet lift, 230/238 at .050, 152/158 at .200 and both have .3533" lobe lift or 0.529" lift with 1.5 rockers before his proposed 0.006" lash. When your dealing with such a small amount of duration it's hard to find the same or something similar in a SOLID roller profile, example the Comp RT series mentioned, which are also asymmetrical lobes, doesn't even start untill 244 degrees at .050 lift. The Comp Xtreme Energy Street solid roller, again with assymmetrical lobes, is available with the same 230 degrees of duration. It has 153 degrees duration at .200" lift and a larger .3680" lobe lift, or .552" lift with 1.5 rockers before lash. But remember when evaluationg the differance the XE solid roller will have 0.014" (or 0.016") lash compared to his proposed .006" lash. And since the lash shortens the actual duration I suspect he is counting on it being slightly more aggressive off the seat and up toward .200" lift, but this is just a guess. And then there is the fact that the XE lobe would net about 0.538" lift verses his 0.523" lift. I wonder which one would have more area under the curve ? |
#76
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Stewart, I understand what you are saying but the amount of space(at the lobe) does change between 1.5 and 1.65 rockers. If you set lash at .006 on to top of the valve stem using a 1.5 rocker, to get the same space between the cam lobe and lifter you would have to add 10 percent if using a 1.65 rocker. Basically with a 1.5 rocker you would have .004 space between the cam lobe and lifter if you set lash at .006, if using a 1.65 rocker to get the .004 space you would set the lash at .0072. Hope this makes sense. -Jim
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#77
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Quote:
Stewart
__________________
1976 TA, nose converted to 1970 style, 406, ported #13 Heads, '70 iron intake without crossovers, Q-Jet - Cliff style, RARE OS manifolds, Pypes duals w/crossflow, UD 230/238 custom HR 4/7 swap cam with solid roller lifters , Hydro-Boost 4-wheel discs, 4 Speed, 3.23 posi. “Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.” - Winston Churchill |
#78
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I didn't want to go to a solid roller profile. For my purposes SR profiles start at "too big" for my engine, given the stated purpose of the build is a broad, flat torque curve with power to pull well to a 6K shift point. Plus I didn't want to have to use 650#+ springs. I could have gone with hydraulic rollers but I was intrigues by the thread on solid rollered HR grinds. I figured I would try it, save some $$ and weight (I know, probably not relevant) on the lifters and see if it would give me what I wanted better than other options. After talking all this over with Tim he said this cam, using the HR14 and HR15 lobes and the 106 ICL and 110 LSA, would fit my wants/needs very well. Our discussions were fairly lengthy and detailed. There may be better cams out there but this one fits what I need as well as what I want and I've always wanted to build a Pontiac engine with a custom UltraDyne roller cam. Go figure! Plus it's different to do it this way. Stewart
__________________
1976 TA, nose converted to 1970 style, 406, ported #13 Heads, '70 iron intake without crossovers, Q-Jet - Cliff style, RARE OS manifolds, Pypes duals w/crossflow, UD 230/238 custom HR 4/7 swap cam with solid roller lifters , Hydro-Boost 4-wheel discs, 4 Speed, 3.23 posi. “Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.” - Winston Churchill |
#79
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Stewart, it all sounds fine I'm sure you will be pleased. But for conversation there is little differance between the UD 230 hyd roller lobe and a Comp XE 230 solid roller lobe, as noted they are about the same. Again we are talking about a small roller cam. And with some thought the XE lobe could probably be run with similar spring pressure. I suggest the differance in your 175 lb seat pressure and 180-190 or so lbs. seat pressure is mute. And any differance in "noise" between the two cams, again probably a mute point to most.
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#80
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when going to solid roller lifters it is much better to err on the high side of spring pressure.It seems that roller lifter failure can be pointed to lifter bounce or float.That might be the reason Comp had me run 200 on the seat with my 400 lobe lift HR cam and solid roller lifters.Tom
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