[Rob B]

Dave, Just go out and buy a Kia or a Hyundai and piss everyone off who have partisipated in this thread!!


Buy what YOU (or your wife) wants and if your happy with Toyota, so be it!
We've had good luck with every make we've bought new so I'm not as "brand loyal" as others may be but I do seem to lean to the Ford and Dodge makes for styling.

[David Jones]

Champ, you read waaay to much into what you see on a Minnesota Toyota dealers lot.
Hoover Toyota, which is walking distance down the street has a car about every 8th or 9th slot on the front half of the lot. A small percentage of their "normal" inventory. No, I don't spend a lot of time inventorying as you seem to so I don't have exact numbers. The reality here is somewhat different than you describe. If you really believe that Honda and Toyota's sales numbers aren't wounded badly by their situation in Japan then your world IS pretty small. As I've said in this same discussion with you other places check back with me NEXT August and give me the numbers. When the playing field is level.

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by David Jones

Champ, you read waaay to much into what you see on a Minnesota Toyota dealers lot.
Hoover Toyota, which is walking distance down the street has a car about every 8th or 9th slot on the front half of the lot.

If they are leaving their lot that empty - it may be to create the illusion that these popular cars are in short supply. But if you look at their website - they proudly proclaim differently:

Hoover Toyota currently has 19 Corolla's in stock today, with another 17 arriving between 9/12 and 10/24. They also advertise that there are another 5,813 available in the southeast.

They have 30 Camry's (this does not include Camry Hybrids) in stock today, with another 17 arriving between 9/9 and 10/24.

The reality here is somewhat different than you describe.

Looks like your area has a pretty solid supply - much greater than mine does.

[David Jones]

Originally Posted by The Champ

If they are leaving their lot that empty - it may be to create the illusion that these popular cars are in short supply. But if you look at their website - they proudly proclaim differently:

Hoover Toyota currently has 19 Corolla's in stock today, with another 17 arriving between 9/12 and 10/24. They also advertise that there are another 5,813 available in the southeast.

They have 30 Camry's (this does not include Camry Hybrids) in stock today, with another 17 arriving between 9/9 and 10/24.



Looks like your area has a pretty solid supply - much greater than mine does.

That's a solid supply? Based on what? What were those Southeastern inventory numbers for the Camry and Corolla before the tsunami? Where did Hoover Toyota proudly proclaim differently that they had plenty of inventory? Or did you dream up the "proudly proclaim differently" line to make it sound like you really knew the ins and outs of Hoover Toyota's and the southeast Toyota regions inventory needs and normal supply? Are the numbers you quoted up from the last few months since Toyota is trying to refill the pipeline? Maybe Toyota arranged the earthquake/tsunami/nuclear issue to cover up the beating they were taking at GM's hands?

[Formulabruce]

This is a waste of a thread... question was asked, and answered.. but the BS lives long after that! LOL

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by David Jones

That's a solid supply? Based on what? What were those Southeastern inventory numbers for the Camry and Corolla before the tsunami? Where did Hoover Toyota proudly proclaim differently that they had plenty of inventory? Or did you dream up the "proudly proclaim differently" line to make it sound like you really knew the ins and outs of Hoover Toyota's and the southeast Toyota regions inventory needs and normal supply? Are the numbers you quoted up from the last few months since Toyota is trying to refill the pipeline? Maybe Toyota arranged the earthquake/tsunami/nuclear issue to cover up the beating they were taking at GM's hands?

David

Supply seems to be better than you claimed.

I think Hoover's website proves that they have more inventory than you posted.

If your post is 100% accurate (1 car every 8th or 9th slot), than did Hoover normally have about 162 Corolla's and 255 Camry's in stock (8.5 x current inventory)?

Dealers typically don't stock too many more new cars than they do used cars - typically maybe something like 60% new 40% used. 70/30 would be higher than normal, but possible. Hoover has 165 used cars in stock today.

Hoover has 11 Prius, 1 Yaris, 35 Corolla, 47 Camry, 2 Camry Hybrid, 31 Avalon, 21 Sienna, 17 RAV4, 41 Highlander, 1 Highlander Hybrid, 21 4Runner, 4 Sequoia, 15 Venza.... That's already well over 200 new Toyotas in stock or arriving shortly and we haven't even counted the Toyota trucks.

What is in short supply is the Scion product (none in stock at Hoover) and the Japaneese imported product - like the Yaris. The Camry/Corolla inventory is pretty solid

Maybe I'm overstating the supply somewhat. But I think you are crying wolf a little too loudly and frequently. The tsunami is over and supply is rapidly returning or has returned to pre tsunami levels in most of the country for Toyotas best selling vehicles.

I am fully aware of the shortage of Scion and Yaris product - but I haven't claimed that supply was good on those lines and I don't think that the lack of those products affects the Corolla being down 19% in August.

[David Jones]

I believe the reason you didn't list trucks is that didn't fit your position. 22 total.
The numbers you spent so much time compiling tell a much different story if you happen to know Hoovers lot size....which is huge. They normally have a lot full...no, I haven't counted as you do your Toyota dealers lot but I have passed it every day for a decade. So the layout of the inventory is just as I described, your conclusion that I'm not being truthful to the contrary. Hoover Toyota is right next door to the old Hoover Hyundia (closed 2-3 years and owned by the same man), which is Hoover Toyota's full sized new car dealer, USED CAR LOT. It IS full of used cars. Thank you for pointing out the used/new mix. Hoover Toyota has ABSOLUTELY no used cars sitting on it's lot at all, so 260ish (IF that's accurate) is a drop in the bucket on their lot.
Your conclusion about Toyota's inventory levels here there and everywhere are just your opinion and have no basis in fact.

I think you just proved my point and I appreciate it.

Check back with me this time next year.

[The Champ]

David

The reason I didn't list the trucks is on Hoover's website - is it was too difficult to go through all the hoops (regular cab/extended cab/4 door/2wd/4wd) to get to the numbers. As I posted - even without counting any trucks at all - is well over 200 (as I previously posted).

FWIW - Toyota Tundra sales are up 7% YTD (inspite of the tsunami) - maybe (this is speculation) Hoover sold more than they anticipated.

Your conclusion about Toyota's inventory levels here there and everywhere are just your opinion and have no basis in fact.

If you doubt anything that I've posted about the stock levels at Hoover - please go to Hoover's website to confirm. I'm not dealing in idle speculation/perception - just the facts at your hometown Toyota dealer.

If you can't accept the info directly from Hoover's website, I guess there is no reason to continue this conversation.

[David Jones]

Oh, I accept that Toyota is publishing accurate info, it's the determination you've made that it's adequate that's laughable...........
Hoover Toyota's lot is good indication of Toyota's inventory shortage. A lot that is normally full that has cars only every 8-9 spaces as evidenced by my looking as I drive by and by your good detective work on Hoover Toyota's own website.
Toyota executives say that inventory levels would START coming back around in August IF things progress as they are in Japan. That's the Japan that still has 100,000 people without a place to live. Toyota and Honda are far from being back to normal.

I'm also now considering a Highlander.

[Mr Twister]

Originally Posted by 69goatboy

We all know to keep an eye on the lot lizard, but it's the dealer's finance guy that you need to keep two eyes on. For he is guy that can stick it to you in ways that will not be realized until long after you leave the lot.

If you choose the finance route, use your own bank or credit union.

Good luck on whatever you and yours decide to do.

Yes, I recently got a new Silverado @ 0 percent APR. The Finance person went in to great detail how their preferred bank @ 3.9 percent apr is less expensive than free financing. Made it sound real good though.

[David Jones]

Originally Posted by Mr Twister

Yes, I recently got a new Silverado @ 0 percent APR. The Finance person went in to great detail how their preferred bank @ 3.9 percent apr is less expensive than free financing. Made it sound real good though.

You mean you didn't bite?

[Kyflier]

Originally Posted by Mr Twister

Yes, I recently got a new Silverado @ 0 percent APR. The Finance person went in to great detail how their preferred bank @ 3.9 percent apr is less expensive than free financing. Made it sound real good though.

If there was a rebate involved to get the 0%, depending on how big the rebate was, you may have cost yourself money for not taking the rate, but the 3.9% isn't a real good rate right now if you have good credit, 2% is about what 740 and above can get.

[Mr Twister]

Yes, there was a small rebate.

[Kyflier]

As I said, it depends on the size of the rebate. If it was less than say 2500 you were better off taking the 0%, if it was more, you need to look at both sides. Say the truck was 35000, and a 5000 rebate if you take conventional financing @3% total amount finnaced is 32624.75 including tax and fees, payment is 588.83 with no money down. Your total payments over 60 months would be 35329.80.


Now take same truck at no rebate and 0% financing, total amount financed is 37624.75 with taxes included and no additional money down. payment is 629.07 and over 60 months is 37744.20.

You just cost yourself 2415 by taking 0%


People think 0% is the greatest thing since sliced bread, you have to look at the whole package.

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by Kyflier

People think 0% is the greatest thing since sliced bread, you have to look at the whole package.

If you finance for the maximum amount for the maximum term, it sometimes makes sense as you stated so well.

I believe in substantial down payments and short term loans on items that depreciate. 3 years is the longest I've ever financed a new vehicle. If I couldn't afford the loan payments then maybe I shouldn't be buying the vehicle.

I was upside down in a car one time (figuratively and literally). Ask me how much depreciation you have on a 4 month old 1979 Caprice Classic Landau after it's been totalled (forced off highway - end over end)...

I never wanted to owe money on something after my insurance settlement check again.

This philosophy is what helped me in the purchase of our current daily driver when we purchased it new. Took the LARGE rebate in lieu of the 0% financing, $2200 in GM credit card cash, the cash from the sale of our last new car and a steep dealer discount on their last remaining '06 Torrent in March of '07 and the ultimate amount due was low enough to just write a check.

[David Jones]

We'll pick up our new 2012 Highlander Limited tomorrow. Sizzling Crimson Mica (dark metallic burgundy) with gray leather. Glenda drove both the Venza and the Highlander and preferred the larger feel and ride of the Highlander. And like a good car shopper she liked the color better than what was available on the Venza's.

Kenny, thank you for your help and info.

Hoover Toyota had 68 new cars/trucks in inventory this afternoon. They are the largest volume Toyota dealership in Alabama, according to our salesman. Seems that what was counted earlier in this thread didn't take into account many (3/4) that hadn't been delivered yet as noted on Hoover's website on each units listing. Our salesman said that before the earthquake/tsunami, Hoover normally had between 450-550 new cars on the lot at any one time. He did say that Toyota is now back to capacity but that their dealership is selling them as fast or faster than they can get them in.

[David Holmberg]

We looked at the Highlander, nice SUV.

She'll be happy David, and that will make David happy too.

[fyrffytr1]

What was the question? Oh Yeah, You can't decide whether to stay home or ride the bus! I went through a whole bag of popcorn on this thread.
That being said I really don't have anything to offer other than my wife has been driving a Toyota Highlander for 10 years and it is just now reaching the 100,000 mile mark. I have replaced the front brakes one time and had one oxygen sensor go bad. Other than that it's been normal maintenance. We have been looking at the Venza as well but I hope to keep the Highlander for another 2-3 years.
I do have two minor gripes with this car. I don't like how they located the A/C vents and I can't ride with the windows down. It sounds like a helicopter and actually hurts my ears!

[lust4speed]

I had a really crappy thing happen to us a month ago when we went to the local Chevy/GMC/Buick dealer to buy my son a used small truck. The SOB's actually had the nerve to price the truck on their lot below Edmund's and KBB's suggested trade-in value with the accessories on it. Cost me another 35 minutes checking my figures and then the truck to make sure that things were as they seemed. Took all the fun out of negotiating the purchase.

Twenty five years ago I had the need for the Kelly Blue Book for mobile homes, and once in their system, any book could be ordered. I always had the current edition of both used and new cars on my desk. The sticker prices and accessory prices were spot on the money. Then later, Edmonds hit the early internet, and I didn't have to buy the KBB's any more. Edmonds was also spot on.

Then about 8-10 years ago, it seemed that Edmonds sold themselves out to the big money. They became more interested in referrals to dealers, and their listed prices stopped matching the MSRP's of the vehicles. Every year the gap between their listed prices and reality seems to widen. At the very least it was shoddy publishing, and at the worse it was misleading people using their services.

David, congratulations on your new car.

Kyflier, I'd rather have you in my corner looking out for me than trying to depend on the misinformation that is being published today.

[David Jones]

Originally Posted by lust4speed

I had a really crappy thing happen to us a month ago when we went to the local Chevy/GMC/Buick dealer to buy my son a used small truck. The SOB's actually had the nerve to price the truck on their lot below Edmund's and KBB's suggested trade-in value with the accessories on it. Cost me another 35 minutes checking my figures and then the truck to make sure that things were as they seemed. Took all the fun out of negotiating the purchase.

Twenty five years ago I had the need for the Kelly Blue Book for mobile homes, and once in their system, any book could be ordered. I always had the current edition of both used and new cars on my desk. The sticker prices and accessory prices were spot on the money. Then later, Edmonds hit the early internet, and I didn't have to buy the KBB's any more. Edmonds was also spot on.

Then about 8-10 years ago, it seemed that Edmonds sold themselves out to the big money. They became more interested in referrals to dealers, and their listed prices stopped matching the MSRP's of the vehicles. Every year the gap between their listed prices and reality seems to widen. At the very least it was shoddy publishing, and at the worse it was misleading people using their services.

David, congratulations on your new car.

Kyflier, I'd rather have you in my corner looking out for me than trying to depend on the misinformation that is being published today.

Mick, I was amazed at how Hoover seemed to want to sell me the car also. I had a folder full of info gleaned from every imaginable source and when Jason slid the 1st price across his desk I tried to hold back the smile. I was perfectly happy with their 1st offer, short of my idea on what our trade was worth. I discussed that with him, he wandered off and came back with my number and I signed the paper. Total dickering time was approx 5 minutes. $500 deposit and we'll see you tomorrow........