[unruhjonny]

Originally Posted by Ccass

... My plea is simply to combine the technical and social resources of the Classic Pontiac hobby with the technical and social resources of the Late Model Pontiac hobby. Currently, there is a real line drawn in the sand by both classic and Late Model owners. And it's very evident on the internet as most Late Model owners choose to share there resources on Late Model sites and most classic Pontiac owners choose to share their resources on PY's Forums. This is fine for now but if something isn't done, it won't be fine for either group individually down the road but combined, that's a different story.

I never understood this...
But I totally know what you're talking about.

[teeraven]

I think the big problem with the divide between classic and late model owners is that the cars are totally different animals. Way too many classic owners feel like the late model cars are garbage or not real Pontiacs, or whatever other reason they choose to bash them. There are a lot of late model owners that aren't Pontiac guys, they're just enthusiasts of the specific model they own. For example most 4th gen f-body owners have less in common with py guys and more with the LS forum crowds. Same for GTO, G8, or the various V6 cars.

For me personally, my love of classic Pontiacs is what lead to liking newer Pontiacs. Though honestly even though I appreciate Grand Ams and G6s, etc, I'd never own one. I would love a GTO or G8 GT but classic cars are my priority. If I owned a newer model and didn't want classics, I'd have not reason to be part of a Pontiac community.

[aukc]

Chris, correct me if I’m wrong here, but my understanding of this topic is for Pontiac hobbyists to come together on this forum, for the good of all of us that care about Pontiac. So it’s not only breaking down the line between classic and late, it’s getting everyone that cares about Pontiac onto this forum.

If I’ve got that right, then let’s really go for it! How about PY and POCI come to an arrangement or agreement, what ever you want to call it, and make this forum the official forum for POCI, migrate the POCI members over to this forum (half of them are here already) and make the forum link on the POCI site point to here. POCI saves the expense of operating the current POCI forum, and the hobby starts to come together.

I think there’s something sort of like this already happening with the Buick Club which hosts their forum on the AACA site, plus isn’t PY already the official tech advice forum for the GTOAA?

How about the “1950’s Pontiac” yahoo group, get them to make PY their official forum and migrate them here. I bet there’s some other forums and group that belong here at PY.

If we could really “come together” then maybe these groups could help out with providing tech advisors, forum moderators, etc. to help take some of the burden off you.

Also I know you’re in perfect health and plan to live forever, but maybe somewhere in the coming together there should be a conversation about succession planning, I’m concerned our hobby is so fragile right now, I don’t even want to think about it, but what would happen to the Pontiac hobby if we lost this forum. Should we have some sort of plan in place to minimize the risk of that happening?

There are my thoughts on the issue, hope I’m not too far off base, Mike

[dennis kirban]

Interesting topic.....

Chris is rite about companies buying up other forums. I belong to several and in case I joined and like all the other forums I use my real name is my own email address. They would not allow it since people could figure out how to go to my website based on my last name. They said I had to come up with some other name which I refused.

As for combining the old with the new Pontiacs....Its a logical move. As some of you reading this realize I am deeply involved business/wise with turbo buicks. When the GSCA club welcomed what then was the new turbo regals (1984-1987) time frame some of their members were very upset. But as a club you need fresh blood to keep the cycle going and keep the numbers up.

Pontiac unless I am wrong you seen your last hooray since Pontiac like Oldsmobile is no longer. The smart money is keep open minded....

Look how many years it took for the POCI and GTOAA to finally combine their national events.

The later GTOs 2004-2006 and the G8 models both saw very limited production when you compare to any year of the original GTOs. Combining is just logical sense. I know when we reproduce a part if it fits the turbo Regal and the C5 Corvette sales increase and costs go down.

Enough rambling......

[email protected]

[Ccass]

Originally Posted by teeraven

I think the big problem with the divide between classic and late model owners is that the cars are totally different animals. Way too many classic owners feel like the late model cars are garbage or not real Pontiacs, or whatever other reason they choose to bash them. There are a lot of late model owners that aren't Pontiac guys, they're just enthusiasts of the specific model they own. For example most 4th gen f-body owners have less in common with py guys and more with the LS forum crowds. Same for GTO, G8, or the various V6 cars.

You are right on with your assessment! However, what we're saying is that mentality should change. The common ground is they are all Pontiacs. That common ground needs to be the reason we come together as 'Pontiac' owners although there are plenty of good that can be passed back and forth between these two very different technologies and sometimes different owners. The more that happens, the more resources become available to BOTH groups.

[Ccass]

Originally Posted by teeraven

I would love a GTO or G8 GT but classic cars are my priority. If I owned a newer model and didn't want classics, I'd have not reason to be part of a Pontiac community.

I feel differently on this. As long as there is a passion for the type of car you own, there will also be online communities to share that passion with. With the LM Pontiacs, you don't have the restoration aspect to deal with, but all the other elements are still there. Help finding parts because of an accident. Advice on performance issues, styling modifications, Wheel and tire fitment, Exhaust sounds, accessorizing, shows to attend etc. But the most important aspect is the sharing of a commonality creates an often enjoyable social environment.

[Ccass]

Originally Posted by aukc

Chris, correct me if I’m wrong here, but my understanding of this topic is for Pontiac hobbyists to come together on this forum, for the good of all of us that care about Pontiac. So it’s not only breaking down the line between classic and late, it’s getting everyone that cares about Pontiac onto this forum.

If I’ve got that right, then let’s really go for it! How about PY and POCI come to an arrangement or agreement, what ever you want to call it, and make this forum the official forum for POCI, migrate the POCI members over to this forum (half of them are here already) and make the forum link on the POCI site point to here. POCI saves the expense of operating the current POCI forum, and the hobby starts to come together.

I think there’s something sort of like this already happening with the Buick Club which hosts their forum on the AACA site, plus isn’t PY already the official tech advice forum for the GTOAA?

How about the “1950’s Pontiac” yahoo group, get them to make PY their official forum and migrate them here. I bet there’s some other forums and group that belong here at PY.

If we could really “come together” then maybe these groups could help out with providing tech advisors, forum moderators, etc. to help take some of the burden off you.

Mike

I agree 100%. The more we merge together, the better off our hobby will be. For all those that attended the 2009 and 2013 Co-Ventions, you don't need me to convince you. I have already had conversations with GTOAA and the 'GTOAA Tech' forum is the result and the first step in this regard.

[Ccass]

Originally Posted by aukc

Also I know you’re in perfect health and plan to live forever, but maybe somewhere in the coming together there should be a conversation about succession planning, I’m concerned our hobby is so fragile right now, I don’t even want to think about it, but what would happen to the Pontiac hobby if we lost this forum. Should we have some sort of plan in place to minimize the risk of that happening?

There are my thoughts on the issue, hope I’m not too far off base, Mike

A 'disaster backup' or 'under the home bomb shelter' of sorts. First off, we are lucky enough to have an entire staff and a group of loyal Moderators that have pretty much the same aspirations and goals that I do. My Son Eric (eric cspn) at age 25 is now a full time member of the staff and an active member of the forums. While he specializes in the Late Model Pontiac side of the business, he took my 1967 GTO to his Senior Prom and fully appreciates the roots of this hobby.

That being said, if some unforeseen PY Forums catastrophe were to occur, the beauty of the internet is that it could be duplicated rather easily and cheaply. And just as quickly and easily, the members would migrate to the successor Pontiac Forum.

[unruhjonny]

Originally Posted by teeraven

I think the big problem with the divide between classic and late model owners is that the cars are totally different animals. Way too many classic owners feel like the late model cars are garbage or not real Pontiacs, or whatever other reason they choose to bash them. There are a lot of late model owners that aren't Pontiac guys, they're just enthusiasts of the specific model they own. For example most 4th gen f-body owners have less in common with py guys and more with the LS forum crowds. Same for GTO, G8, or the various V6 cars.

For me personally, my love of classic Pontiacs is what lead to liking newer Pontiacs. Though honestly even though I appreciate Grand Ams and G6s, etc, I'd never own one. I would love a GTO or G8 GT but classic cars are my priority. If I owned a newer model and didn't want classics, I'd have not reason to be part of a Pontiac community.

I too was drawn to late models over my love for the classics;
I had at one time said that I'd never own a "computerized car";
At the time, I was making aprox $300/week, and spending $200/week on gas - that was enought to make me go over to what I previously viewed as the dark side...
lol

I'd still rather a V8 car be a classic, and have been instead having fun with newer four cylinder, or four cylinder turbocharged cars...

[Ccass]

We just got back from Carlisle and wanted to update everyone at how encouraged I was to see a consistent amount of 'under 50' car owners and even a number of Father-Son tandem's. To see such 'teenage' Pontiac owners collecting parts for their restoration was really a testament to both the time tested cool factor of our Pontiacs as well as the parental involvement with their siblings. It was really a pleasure to see.

I also want to thank all of our customers for both stopping by and saying hi as well as supporting us at the show. We tied our 2nd best Fall Carlisle ever. It's amazing how many new Pontiac owners are entering our hobby and never heard of us OR the PY Forums!

[Ccass]

This topic got kind of long and there are a lot of sub-topics within. I just wanted to re-post the heart of the matter.

this topic is about the future of the hobby in 5 years, in 10 years etc.

My plea is simply to combine the technical and social resources of the Classic Pontiac hobby with the technical and social resources of the Late Model Pontiac hobby. Currently, there is a real line drawn in the sand by both classic and Late Model owners. And it's very evident on the internet as most Late Model owners choose to share there resources on Late Model sites and most classic Pontiac owners choose to share their resources on PY's Forums. This is fine for now but if something isn't done, it won't be fine for either group individually down the road but combined, that's a different story.

[PMD1969]

Appreciate all of the efforts! I joined in 03' but had to rejoin after the moderators and myself could not find my old membership.

Good to hear that PY is going to tow the old line and I am sure it will keep the atmosphere what it is. Might make a suggestion that PY seriously needs to update their parts catalogs and online information. Compared to others they are very hard to use, slow and lacking information. To stay competitive I can't see how they can stay the same?

[taalltheway]

I m from Germany and without this Forum the Hobby would basically not exist for me....i learned about so many things here and bought cars through this site...thank you for that!

I also run a few businesses and know the importance of the right type of Internet presence...

Here is what i would do:

1. Integrate sections for late Pontiacs and Pro touring cars.
2. Close the "clubhouse"...it is so full of political hate that it really puts me off. This stuff has no place in a hobbysite and leaves a bad taste in the mouth. Every newbie who reads this gets a completely wrong idea abou the members being crazies...
3. I hate to say it but not only the concentration of old Pontiacs makes this site look old....the whole look and feel of the Forum and also your PY-Website feels like 1995...other sites like Summit, etc look much better and make it easier to find parts. ldtimers may be contempt with the old Website but today a Company is judged by ist webpresence and your site makes me think "small Outfit on the verge of going under"...sorry for being honest.
4. Make al your advertisers pu links on the sites that link to this place. This will increase traffic.

[Ccass]

Good stuff PMD and our Meunster Germany connection! Thanks. All suggestions for a better integration are welcome and will be seriously considered.

[Tom Vaught]

My Uncle and Aunt were PONTIAC DEALERSHIP OWNERS for 69 years.
Just because PMD decided to drop the traditional Pontiac Engine and install the corporate engine did
not make any of the PONTIAC NAMEPLATE vehicles less of a PONTIAC, in my opinion.
The vehicles were PONTIACS up until General Motors killed the brand.

At that point, PONTIAC DIED.

So why would you discriminate against any PONTIAC NAMEPLATE vehicle?
Because a guy named George only wants to hear only about Traditional Pontiac Engine built vehicles?

I give you a big Gold Star for this one Chris!

Tom Vaught

ps If an advertiser's parts need some work, that is their problem, not yours JMT. (especially if someone speaks the truth about the parts.)

[KS circutguy]

My Uncle and Aunt were PONTIAC DEALERSHIP OWNERS for 69 years.

Tom, that has to be some kinda record ?

[Tom Vaught]

Most of the older Corporate Sales People at Pontiac knew of my Uncle & Aunt.
My Uncle was a personal friend with the National Sales Manager.
My Aunt, being an accountant by trade, "gave a few lessons" to the Corporate People on how to properly do a set of books. LOL!

[Alvin]

Bump

[herdswoman]

Chris, thank you for the valuable insight into what is going on "behind the scenes" and the future direction of the hobby. Most importantly, you've raised your son so that he's joined the business and will provide consistency. Kids raised right = most important job of a lifetime. PY will always be home, just as David Holmberg said. Glad this is a sticky.

[Garry Sr]

I tried to order a dash pad for a 69 Firebird in blue and you no have in stock. Competitor did & price matched. I owe nobody anything on this forum and if you're going to sell me parts you need to have them.