Pontiac - Street No question too basic here!

          
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #81  
Old 12-10-2025, 02:33 PM
Stan Weiss's Avatar
Stan Weiss Stan Weiss is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 5,339
Default

If I knew some of the other port center line length I could do them also

146 cc port - 5.0" port center line = 1.7810 ACSA

1.7810 ACSA - 211 cfm = 284.191 fps Avg Air Speed / Port Velocity

While averages need can be looked at. When someone is developing a port on the flow bench localized velocities is what is most important.

Stan

__________________
Stan Weiss/World Wide Enterprises
Offering Performance Software Since 1987
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/carfor.htm
David Vizard & Stan Weiss' IOP / Flow / Induction Optimization - Cam Selection Software
http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV
Download FREE 14 Trial IOP / Flow Software
http://www.magneticlynx.com/DV/Flow_..._Day_Trial.php
Pontiac Pump Gas List
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_gas.htm
Using PMD Block and Heads List
http://www.magneticlynx.com/carfor/pont_pmd.htm
  #82  
Old 12-10-2025, 07:58 PM
Ponchomike57 Ponchomike57 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2025
Posts: 18
Default

So after reading reading the hot rod article at the beginning of this thread, I contacted Edelbrock and Kauffman for there flow charts. After getting the information I was surprised to see the flow of of the Eheads especially on the exhaust side. It’s not that far off of a stock 6X head. I thought Jim Hands book says the exhaust side should be close to 75% of the intake side. Am I reading that wrong? Here are the number’s I got.The Kauffman heads look like a more balanced head, numbers wise.
Ehead PN#61599, 61595, 61599
.100-65/52
.200-136/103
.300-199/130
.400-237/146
.500-256/151
.600-263/157
Ehead PN# 61569, 61575, 61579
.100-65/52
.200-140/105
.300-201/131
.400-236/145
.500-250/151
.600-257/156
On the performer series head the intake runner is 204cc and the exhaust runner is 145cc
Kauffman ready to run heads
.100-92/53
.200-166/116
.300-214/148
.400-241/171
.500-253/185
.600-261/191
Intake runner 185cc and 165cc exhaust runner

  #83  
Old 12-10-2025, 08:36 PM
Half-Inch Stud's Avatar
Half-Inch Stud Half-Inch Stud is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: BlueBell, PA or AL U.S.A.
Posts: 18,890
Default

...said it here before; EXH CFM flow ought not have any ratio related to intake CFM.

28" depression is a nice STD for Inhale. 28" has no relation to EXH application. 60" maybe

  #84  
Old 12-11-2025, 10:10 AM
scott70's Avatar
scott70 scott70 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: maine
Posts: 2,733
Default

Does the exhaust flow look high for this particular head? Also just noticed 45 degree angle.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_4498.jpg
Views:	54
Size:	61.2 KB
ID:	662020  

__________________
72 lemans,455 e-head, UD 255/263 solid flat,3.73 gears,,,10" 4400 converter,, 6.68 at 101.8 mph,,1.44 60 ft.2007
(cam 271/278 roller)9"CC.4.11gear 6.41 at 106.32 mph 1.42 60 ft.(2009) SOLD,SOLD
1970 GTO 455 4 speed #matching,, 3.31 posi.Stock manifolds. # 64 heads.A factory mint tuquoise ,69' judge stripe car. 8.45 @ 88.1 mph on slippery street tires.Bad 2.19 60ft.Owned since 86'
The Following User Says Thank You to scott70 For This Useful Post:
  #85  
Old 12-11-2025, 10:49 AM
johnta1's Avatar
johnta1 johnta1 is online now
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: now sunny Florida!
Posts: 22,516
Default

Quote:
28" depression is a nice STD for Inhale. 28" has no relation to EXH application. 60" maybe

If both were flowed at 60" the ratio would still be the same.
Perhaps if the exhaust was flowed from the exhaust port (at 60" even) to the head chamber (valve seat)?



__________________
John Wallace - johnta1
Pontiac Power RULES !!!
www.wallaceracing.com

Winner of Top Class at Pontiac Nationals, 2004 Cordova
Winner of Quick 16 At Ames 2004 Pontiac Tripower Nats

KRE's MR-1 - 1st 5 second Pontiac block ever!

W.E.C moment


"Every man has a right to his own opinion, but no man has a right to be wrong in his facts."

"People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid." – Socrates
  #86  
Old 12-11-2025, 03:25 PM
Jay S's Avatar
Jay S Jay S is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Nebraska City, Nebraska
Posts: 2,584
Default

It probably should be mentioned in the past KRE’s flow bench is often 10% high against the big Superflow bench Edelbrock uses. I am not sure why, seems like it was the type of bench they had, maybe that is not true anymore with what they have now. It as not as easy to compare Edelbrock and KRE flow number as it would seem. Jim Hands reported flow numbers ( I have only seen the Max Avgs for the KRE’s) were all from his smaller Superflow bench.


Last edited by Jay S; 12-11-2025 at 04:01 PM.
  #87  
Old 12-11-2025, 04:50 PM
Steve C. Steve C. is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Liberty Hill, Tx. (Austin)
Posts: 10,928
Default

At one time Kauffman used a JKM (Jamison Equipment) flowbench. Not a orifice based system, its a pitot style.
Some have said that this bench is more conservative then others, because its registering points are farther from the work compared most benches.

It could be different today.

__________________
'70 TA / 505 cid / same engine but revised ( previous best 10.63 at 127.05 )
Old information here:
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/0712p...tiac-trans-am/

Sponsor of the world's fastest Pontiac powered Ford Fairmont (engine)
Best time 5.13 at 140 mph (1/8 mile) , true 10.5 tire, stock type suspension
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDoJnIP3HgE

Last edited by Steve C.; 12-11-2025 at 04:57 PM.
The Following User Says Thank You to Steve C. For This Useful Post:
  #88  
Old 12-11-2025, 04:57 PM
Jay S's Avatar
Jay S Jay S is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Nebraska City, Nebraska
Posts: 2,584
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scott70 View Post
Does the exhaust flow look high for this particular head? Also just noticed 45 degree angle.
In stock form 64s have closer to a 146 cc intake port instead of a 153cc same era big valve heads. Would be interesting to know what port volume your 64s have with the 45* valves. There should be more volume taken out of the bowl than a 30* intake. The exhaust ports on a 64 should be the same as the other heads and capable of similar flow numbers to the other heads that had 1.77s. Your exhuast flow numbers look pretty typical after receiving his CNC work. I think SDP had a very nice CNC program for iron D ports with 45* valves.

The Following User Says Thank You to Jay S For This Useful Post:
  #89  
Old 12-12-2025, 08:24 AM
scott70's Avatar
scott70 scott70 is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: maine
Posts: 2,733
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay S View Post
In stock form 64s have closer to a 146 cc intake port instead of a 153cc same era big valve heads. Would be interesting to know what port volume your 64s have with the 45* valves. There should be more volume taken out of the bowl than a 30* intake. The exhaust ports on a 64 should be the same as the other heads and capable of similar flow numbers to the other heads that had 1.77s. Your exhuast flow numbers look pretty typical after receiving his CNC work. I think SDP had a very nice CNC program for iron D ports with 45* valves.
If it doesn’t take much time I’m sure the machine shop could measure one out. That’s where the heads are at the moment

__________________
72 lemans,455 e-head, UD 255/263 solid flat,3.73 gears,,,10" 4400 converter,, 6.68 at 101.8 mph,,1.44 60 ft.2007
(cam 271/278 roller)9"CC.4.11gear 6.41 at 106.32 mph 1.42 60 ft.(2009) SOLD,SOLD
1970 GTO 455 4 speed #matching,, 3.31 posi.Stock manifolds. # 64 heads.A factory mint tuquoise ,69' judge stripe car. 8.45 @ 88.1 mph on slippery street tires.Bad 2.19 60ft.Owned since 86'
  #90  
Old 12-12-2025, 11:14 AM
Jay S's Avatar
Jay S Jay S is offline
Ultimate Warrior
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Nebraska City, Nebraska
Posts: 2,584
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scott70 View Post
If it doesn’t take much time I’m sure the machine shop could measure one out. That’s where the heads are at the moment
Your heads 64 heads that SDP did against the 64 Heads Jim Hand ran, against the KRE heads he had are all interesting comparisons. I think the CNC program Dave used for your heads used the digitized tool path from a 6X ports and he changed the floor height for your heads. The floor height has an effect on the head flow numbers, somewhat like it does on the 72cc & 87cc E heads. Your 64 heads with the work done to them are pretty unique.


Last edited by Jay S; 12-12-2025 at 11:29 AM.
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:31 PM.

 

About Us

The PY Online Forums is the largest online gathering of Pontiac enthusiasts anywhere in the world. Founded in 1991, it was also the first online forum for people to gather and talk about their Pontiacs. Since then, it has become the mecca of Pontiac technical data and knowledge that no other place can surpass.

 




Copyright © 2017