Would you buy the New GTO if they changed the styling?

[67gtoTony]

The 07 GMC Acadia is the nicest vehicle I've ever owned, and probably the nicest I've ever driven. It is an example of what GM can do right.

[SuperQuad]

Seems like I've seen this argument before.

[Jeff R]

Originally Posted by SuperQuad

Seems like I've seen this argument before.

Argument?

[Mr_GTO]

Originally Posted by GTObsessed

What a moronic statement. The orginal GTO's started the revolution known as the "MUSCLE CAR" . Can't say the same for the new GTO.

Sure it's based on the same principle as the orginal. However, it was not the catalyst of major change in the automotive industry.

Your closing statement only supports my argument and contradicts your ubsurd opinion.

Moronic? OK newb. The old GTO's started it but other than the Mustang name one other V8 powered RWD 2+2 coupe out there.

The GTO most certainly did spur the Camaro and Challenger. In fact the GTO was a stop gap measure while the Camaro was being designed.

[Mr_GTO]

Originally Posted by GTObsessed

So your saying the new GTO started a revolution?

I beg to differ. If you look at the average HP in domestice and import cars of the last 5-10 years it was actually import company's like NISSAN/SUBARU etc...that started doubling horsepower & performance numbers in their sedans. Pontiac did not lead that race. Sure they made a smart move and pushed the HP envelope much farther than the imports.

I'd agree with the last statement. However, it's nothing revolutionary considering it was done befor ie: the 60's! The 60's GTO did not repeat the past, it started a trend. There is a big difference.

Bottom line a Shift is not equal to a Revolution!

Really? The 2002 WS6 Trans Am had 325hp. We're talking about MUSCLE CARS in this thread, not V6 or H4 Subaru's....jesus...

This isn't the 60's anymore...get over it. The 2dr coup segment is small and not a money maker for any division as evidence by Mustang sales and Ford's woes.

[Mr_GTO]

Originally Posted by Ron Genovese

If they come out with a PONTIAC GTO retro, what will happen to resale on the current GT UT-OH!

Depends on what it looks like...chances are the folks here won't like it unless it is an exact clone of the older ones. It's too bad people who hate the current car don't actually go and drive one....many here have and were converted.

[poncho-mike]

When I stated I was willing to pay $25K for a new 05 in my earlier post, there were some comments on what $25K would buy you in a new car.

I wouldn't have had any problems paying $30K if the car had some character. It has outstanding performance, but it lacked character. Still, it is one of the most awesome cars I've ever driven.

I would consider buying the next GTO Pontiac comes out with if it has performance and style. Updated retro would be nice, but if it looks like a Lexus, forget it. It has to stand apart from the rest of the ho-hum cars out there.

Mike

[Old Blue 66]

Originally Posted by Mr_GTO

Moronic? OK newb. The old GTO's started it but other than the Mustang name one other V8 powered RWD 2+2 coupe out there.

The GTO most certainly did spur the Camaro and Challenger. In fact the GTO was a stop gap measure while the Camaro was being designed.

Oh please. Will you stop allready?? Youve made you point. You talk as if your on the GM design and planning staff.

[455HOGT37]

I always have said that anything sold as a "Pontiac GTO" needs to have some distinctive links to honor the Pontiac heritage (Dodge even put a hockey stick stripe and a wing on a TRUCK, and called it Datona, fer cripes sake!). So GM screwed the pooch and brought over the jellybean as a GTO and pissed off a bunch of the traditionalists, while pretty much every one else in the world STILL doesn't know what the car is. This does not take away from the fact that it is a fine automobile that would be perfectly acceptable in this market with 300 HP - except for those unfortunate three little letters. But the letters do come off with a hair dryer and dental floss, and the car has 400 HP! To those continuing to complain about the lack of style... I want to ask, would you give up 100 HP for some "style", how about 1 less gear in the transmission? Well that is what the Mustang buyers do.

We are performance people here, aren't we? There is a relatively cheap performance offering from GM that is undeniably an ass kicking car... who gives a damn what it is called or looks like? I think it's funny that so many make fun of the "all show and no go" ricer crowd, yet many of you are turning your noses up at this low 13 second car because of how it looks, while embracing the slug Mustang for the SAME reason.

Look, it was a marketing disaster, but that’s over now. But the cars are still sitting on dealer’s lots. I suggest people forget about words like “icon” or “legend” or “retro”… or for that matter “resale”. Just buy one and drive it like you stole it. Just like the old days.

[Jerry H.]

Originally Posted by 67gtoTony

The 07 GMC Acadia is the nicest vehicle I've ever owned, and probably the nicest I've ever driven. It is an example of what GM can do right.

GMC Acadia? Just wondering what kind of vehicle that is, as I have never heard of it before and I was a sales manager at a GMC store from 99-03.

[GTObsessed]

Originally Posted by Mr_GTO

The GTO most certainly did spur the Camaro and Challenger. In fact the GTO was a stop gap measure while the Camaro was being designed.

fact: The Camaro and Challenger have retro aspects of their modern design.

Aside from the badge on the new GTO there is NOT a DAMN thing about the Styling that is retro.

Mustang for that matter honered their previous design more than the new GTO. Therefore, setting the retro trend.

The GTO did raise the bar on dollar for dollar performance. But econobox import sedans were leading the direction years before.

[455HOGT37]

Originally Posted by GTObsessed

fact: The Camaro and Challenger have retro aspects of their modern design.

Aside from the badge on the new GTO there is NOT a DAMN thing about the Styling that is retro.

Mustang for that matter honered their previous design more than the new GTO. Therefore, setting the retro trend.

The GTO did raise the bar on dollar for dollar performance. But econobox import sedans were leading the direction years before.

So you put a higher value on retro styling than performance... We get it.

[GTObsessed]

Originally Posted by Mr_GTO

Really? The 2002 WS6 Trans Am had 325hp. We're talking about MUSCLE CARS in this thread, not V6 or H4 Subaru's....jesus...

This isn't the 60's anymore...get over it. The 2dr coup segment is small and not a money maker for any division as evidence by Mustang sales and Ford's woes.

Actually the topic of the thread wasn't muscle cars. However, undeniably imports are responsible for Sedans pushing the performance envelope again. Until recently import and domestic sedans were more about gas mileage and economy.

As for your last statement, I can only laugh.....Wrong again! Domestic manufacturers are primarily the only ones having problems pushing the 2dr coups.

The sales of 2dr coups has been very successful for many of the imports.

IE: Infinity g35C, Nissan 350Z, Subaru WRZ, just to name a few.

It's not the 60's. I never said that GM should produce an exact replica of any 60's car model. Obviosly GM,Dodge, Ford and other domestic producers are on to something. It seems everyone has something in the works that will pay tribute to their muscle car roots.

I not going to argue with you anymore.

If the new Camaro performs anything like the new GTO and keeps the modern/retro look it will prove what I have been trying to say. I am sure, it's sales will blow GTO sales out of the water! Unless of course they redesign the GTO like some have mentioned.

When and if that happens I am sure you'll find the resale of 04-06 GTO's will be piss poor.

Personally I can't wait for 2009.

It's kinda like highschool prom. You'll be there with the old worn out ugly chick...I'll be there with the fresh new drop dead gorgeous prom queen. Yeah we may both get lucky at the end of the night.....but... I'll be the one who doesn't have to chew my arm off the next morning to get away.

[GTObsessed]

Originally Posted by 455HOGT37

So you put a higher value on retro styling than performance... We get it.

You obviously, haven't read my post. I think it's great what the did with the new GTO as far as performance is concerned. I think the looks are drab....It has no style to speak of. Side by side it could pass for a nissan sentra or chevy cobalt. It's style does not distinguish it self from the rest of the pack .

What i have been trying to say is where would those sales be if they combined style and the performance?

[Mr_GTO]

Originally Posted by Jerry H.

GMC Acadia? Just wondering what kind of vehicle that is, as I have never heard of it before and I was a sales manager at a GMC store from 99-03.

It's brand new...try to keep up with current vehicles.

[Mr_GTO]

Originally Posted by GTObsessed

fact: The Camaro and Challenger have retro aspects of their modern design.

Aside from the badge on the new GTO there is NOT a DAMN thing about the Styling that is retro.

Mustang for that matter honered their previous design more than the new GTO. Therefore, setting the retro trend.

The GTO did raise the bar on dollar for dollar performance. But econobox import sedans were leading the direction years before.

Yea, they do. Who said it needed to be retro? Is the 350Z retro to a 280Z NOPE.

Before Lutz came into the picture there would have been no RWD V8 coupe, there wasn't even any V8 RWD car planned for Pontiac. The current GTO , again, was a stop gap measure. Do you have any idea how long it takes to design a car within a company that lost BILLIONS of dollars in the last few years? Think about it.

[455HOGT37]

Originally Posted by GTObsessed

You obviously, haven't read my post. I think it's great what the did with the new GTO as far as performance is concerned.

So we agree it's a fast car... Go buy one.

Originally Posted by GTObsessed

I think the looks are drab....It has no style to speak of. Side by side it could pass for a nissan sentra or chevy cobalt. It's style does not distinguish it self from the rest of the pack ...

So we agree its a fast car that is drab looking. Does your ego need that kind of boost that you would ignore breathtaking performance and a fantastic interior because no one will notice you? Do you buy cars to convey some kind of "status" to the world, or do you buy them for transportation?

Originally Posted by GTObsessed

What i have been trying to say is where would those sales be if they combined style and the performance?

Based on sales of the dog slow but good looking Mustang, I would say much higher... But it also would have been higher if it was named ANYTHING else. People expect to see a GTO, and this wasn't it. However, it is a fine looking car in its own right (far from perfect), and looks better than almost every other current GM offering in my opinion. So marketing was as much to blame as "bad" styling.

People forget that not all of us want to drive around in a cartoonish car that screams "look at me!", some of us want to go unnoticed, but very quickly.

[Mr_GTO]

Originally Posted by GTObsessed

Actually the topic of the thread wasn't muscle cars. However, undeniably imports are responsible for Sedans pushing the performance envelope again. Until recently import and domestic sedans were more about gas mileage and economy.

As for your last statement, I can only laugh.....Wrong again! Domestic manufacturers are primarily the only ones having problems pushing the 2dr coups.

The sales of 2dr coups has been very successful for many of the imports.

IE: Infinity g35C, Nissan 350Z, Subaru WRZ, just to name a few.

It's not the 60's. I never said that GM should produce an exact replica of any 60's car model. Obviosly GM,Dodge, Ford and other domestic producers are on to something. It seems everyone has something in the works that will pay tribute to their muscle car roots.

I not going to argue with you anymore.

If the new Camaro performs anything like the new GTO and keeps the modern/retro look it will prove what I have been trying to say. I am sure, it's sales will blow GTO sales out of the water! Unless of course they redesign the GTO like some have mentioned.

When and if that happens I am sure you'll find the resale of 04-06 GTO's will be piss poor.

Personally I can't wait for 2009.

It's kinda like highschool prom. You'll be there with the old worn out ugly chick...I'll be there with the fresh new drop dead gorgeous prom queen. Yeah we may both get lucky at the end of the night.....but... I'll be the one who doesn't have to chew my arm off the next morning to get away.

Really? The current GTO is a muscle car. We aren't talking about rice a roni cars.

LOL, again your ignorance about the sales volume's of the current GTO shows. The GTO wasn't meant to compete with the Mustang as far as sales went..it was meant to compete with the 3Series coup, G35 Coupe, etc. Do you know the sales figures of those cars?

[HUMBLER]

Originally Posted by GTObsessed

fact: The Camaro and Challenger have retro aspects of their modern design.

Aside from the badge on the new GTO there is NOT a DAMN thing about the Styling that is retro.

Mustang for that matter honered their previous design more than the new GTO. Therefore, setting the retro trend.

The GTO did raise the bar on dollar for dollar performance. But econobox import sedans were leading the direction years before.

Thank god, retro is dead, have you seen the state of Ford lately, LOL!

Now we're talking sedans, when did that happen?!

C'mon Blue / Obsessed, humor me, what are you driving? Accord / Camry c'mon you can tell us!

[Old Blue 66]

Originally Posted by Mr_GTO

Really? The current GTO is a muscle car. We aren't talking about rice a roni cars.

LOL, again your ignorance about the sales volume's of the current GTO shows. The GTO wasn't meant to compete with the Mustang as far as sales went..it was meant to compete with the 3Series coup, G35 Coupe, etc. Do you know the sales figures of those cars?

Please, those cars are TEN times the car the GTO ever was. And you just contradicted your self. If the GTO was meant to be a muscle car, than how could its target market have been a BMW 3 Series?