[MUSLCAH]

Originally Posted by Chief of the 60's

Not bad. Did you use a Mack brush?

I just watch guys use them ...freehand.

[MUSLCAH]

Originally Posted by Chief of the 60's

Not bad. Did you use a Mack brush?

Nope...I just watch guys use them....freehand.

[TAKerry]

Originally Posted by MUSLCAH

Attachment 510809Hey...I’ve been painting cars for ovah 40 years.....so I said to myself....if I can paint a car,I should be able to paint with a brush too !

Im generally a non confrontational type of guy, however I cant help but to seem to think this sarcasm is directed at my last post. I have read your many posts regarding yourself as a professional painter and I am sure you do great work. However the majority of the guys on the forum are not professionals. Myself included. I offer what I can as MAYBE a bit of inspiration to those guys that either dont have the means to spend on a high dollar paint job or maybe just want to learn something new. As so I appreciate your comments on how a professional approaches the job, I try to pick up as much advice and ideas on anything I can.

[Bruce Meyer]

No more paint shops for me. I almost lost a car to one. One day I got a call from a junkyard telling me my car was sitting down there. Apparently the body shop went out of business and just left the cars sitting for the landlord to deal with. The landlord sent them to the junkyard. Thank God the junkyard owner was honest. He found an old receipt in the glovebox and called me. My next project I will paint myself.

[dataway]

Much like artistic oil painting .... I don't have any $50K paintings on my wall. I won't have any $15K paint jobs in my garage.

Great for the people that can afford either the painting or the paint job. The vast majority of us are not those people.

And the people that walk in my house wouldn't be able to tell a $50K painting from a $15 one, nor would they be able to tell a $20K paint job from a $5K. So play to your audience, if you go to high end car shows, or take paintings off your wall and put them in galleries ... maybe you should get that $20K paint job. If you are like me and have friends that will probably spill beer on your car .... maybe not.

[Stuart]

This is getting off track...it's not about how much he wants to spend on the work, it's about finding a shop that will actually do the work.

[bird72]

Are there eco-rules, or typical county / city rules that don't allow home shop painting for occasional hobby purpose? Is it getting harder to do legally? I am more and more interested in maybe trying my hand at it. Everything in threads like this and what dataway says about scope matching real world need / level of perfection. I know I have good prep skills and amateur paint level ability. I can see it being a lot of fun.

The "shop" that did my small door repair last year:

Left clearcoat run (like a petrified rain drop)
Butchered 200 buck stripe kit (cut short)
Wash grunt person blew off one inch end of existing other side small width edge stripe
Did lazy blend and the whole side (I wanted to reserve as much ORIGINAL paint as possible)
And grand finale: put chip in trunk lid 1/2 inch dia. (would not admit) wash guy wand (?)

I was so disgusted I car covered car all last summer, because got PO'd every time I looked at it.

Why wouldn't I learn to paint?

[MPKind]

I just want it done. I care some about the fee but it’s all the lost time. Can’t get that back. Now I have to spend a month re detailing and cleaning everything that was good before dipstick got a hold of it. Sucks.

[pggto]

Going through the same BS as you are. I bought my 72 Lemans GT from the guy that owns the body shop. Worked out a deal with him to have the car painted. Been sitting disassembled for almost two years now. At least I did a pay as we go with this guy. Probably going to pick the car up in a few weeks. The one time I visited, the car was outside with the front clip off. I called and complained, then it got pushed in an out building on the property. I've tried setting up a time to stop by and talk and surprise visits, nobody home. Apparently he now has a full time job doing something else. I'm just hoping he still has all the parts.

[i82much]

I have a fairly crazy resto story of my own. I hired a shop to restore my 65 GTO. They started doing me work and sending me large bills. I'd go check on the car every now and again and see a little progress, but it never seemed like the progress matched up to the bills. At some point I had 25K into the car and it still wasn't in paint.

So, I had an after-hours meeting with the shop manager. I was in law school at the time and I told them that I could file suit myself if I needed to (I was bluffing). I also told them that I would be calling the state's attorney general to investigate for consumer fraud.

Well, whaddya know, a week later my car is painted. 13 years later and it still looks great. They did some mechanical work for me, got it running and delivered the "finished" resto to me on a Wednesday a month or two after that meeting.

Well here's the crazy part. The shop went bankrupt and out of business 2 days after I got my car back. So guess what happened to all the other guys that had thrown money at them for years? Well, because I went in and pounded my fist on the table, my car got put in front of theirs and they all got royally screwed. People just got parts back, lucky if they were primered. Can you imagine being in for 25 or 30k and getting parts back?

So even crazier - I stayed in touch with the shop manager after the place shut down for a few months, looking to follow up on a few issues. Just so I'd know what they did to my car, not looking for warranty work obviously. Well, the shop manager told me that the owner of the shop had been in deep to the IRS and committed suicide not long after the place went out of business.

[Mrp613]

Originally Posted by dhutton

You are wasting your time expecting him to finish the car. He has all his money and zero incentive to work on it, especially since he obviously has cash flow problems. He needs more cash coming in and working on your car generates zero cash. Negative cash actually because he has to pay for materials, overhead, and and any salaries for his employees if he has any.

Pick up the car before he starts selling off your parts....

Don

This is what to do. I worked for a guy like this. Did good work but used the money from a new job to sort of finish an old job and finance his racing. I felt bad for the customers and wound up doing bodywork for a few of the customers after they reclaimed their cars. I basically sanded them down, fixed what I could and shot them in sealer over the course of a weekend. I charged them a pretty low rate but told them exactly what I would do or not do. No large panel replacement, mostly beating out dents and patches. If you have to talk to some of the employees of a few shops. Normally they need extra cash and you can find someone to do work over the course of a 2-3 day period. It won’t be show quality but you can probably have color on it in a reasonable timeframe

[Squidward]

Originally Posted by Mrp613

This is what to do. I worked for a guy like this. Did good work but used the money from a new job to sort of finish an old job and finance his racing. I felt bad for the customers and wound up doing bodywork for a few of the customers after they reclaimed their cars. I basically sanded them down, fixed what I could and shot them in sealer over the course of a weekend. I charged them a pretty low rate but told them exactly what I would do or not do. No large panel replacement, mostly beating out dents and patches. If you have to talk to some of the employees of a few shops. Normally they need extra cash and you can find someone to do work over the course of a 2-3 day period. It won’t be show quality but you can probably have color on it in a reasonable timeframe

Late to the discussion, but I saw this firsthand when my brother was getting an enclosed trailer built out here in AZ. The guy kept stringing him along, wanting another cash infusion to move his job up. Turns out that each new job's down payment was funding work/completion of jobs started many months prior. It was almost like a classic investment scam, where new investor money would keep the whole thing afloat for as long as possible. We found out later that the owner was flaky with payroll, and couldn't keep his fabricators around.

There are so many people who should not run their own business. In fact, many people start their own businesses because their personal attributes would get them fired if they worked for someone else.

This is why I will paint my own cars, and IDK... they may stay in primer forever.

[geeteeohguy]

Have been dealing with this in industry for decades. Very common for the 'rob Peter to pay Paul' syndrome to kick in......Money given up front is used for other projects that came prior due to mis-management, usually drugs, but often simply bad budgeting: shop owner buys a new Jeep, Bass boat, etc. Go's to Vegas, gets re-married, etc. etc. Regardless, infusions of your money go to feed the lifestyle, not to fix your car. I recommend a binding contract, with the payment for the labor due at completion of the project. Payment for materials is prudent up front, but get something in writing. The worst cases I have seen are 'handshake deals' with unregistered, off-the-grid bodymen and painters. When it all goes wrong and you lose your car, there is no recourse. I see it ALL the time.

[Doug1]

All right, I can trump all you guys. Unfortunately.

The story is over on Trans Am County. I now do all my own work or pay a very reputable shop to paint. No deal seeking anymore for me.

Took a 76 455 4Spd car with 35,000 original miles to be painted by the painter of a well known shop at that time. The car had zero rust. Anyway, he painted on the side and had painted a few buddies cars so I gave him mine.

Sometime over the next year he got heavily into drugs. Excuse after excuse for a couple of months and then I gave up and went to get my car. All the cars were gone. He had sold them to the scrapyard for like $400 each for drug money.

I had pulled the interior, the drivetrain and even the VIN. The car was gone. He went to jail and the day he got out he OD'd and he was no more.

Sued the car crushing place and we worked out a settlement since they bought a car without a VIN. The tried to lie about it initially by a detective found it on their scale log.

Also sent the Triple Threat Trans Am car to Frank Serafine at Prodigy Customs and then it went to Fletcher's Customs from him. That's a whole different multi-year saga but I came out with the car and most of the parts.

So now I build my own and it is far less stressful to learn the skills than it is dealing with questionable characters. I still don't like to paint, so I will hire that part out and just pay the going rate at a reputable shop. I learned to quit looking for deals. They cost more in the long run.

[scott70]

These are the stories that probably have kept me away from the "full on body/paint job" for many years that i wanted to do. I would be a nervous wreck not knowing whats going on and having these things possibly happen.. Listened to the horror stories enough really never pulled the trigger til now. Luckily my car is at a persons shop 3 houses down from me and I see him weekly. He hasnt asked for any money except for materials. And I like the work hes done so far. After these stories I feel lucky.

[dataway]

A whole lot of good body guys went a bad way back in the 80's. I worked for a great body and paint man for 2 years, and a good friend. Had a good business out in the sticks, did paint and collision work for the local dealers, sold tires, was doing great ... ended up spending seven years in prison for cocaine.

[Rob in NH]

i've been doing body work for myself in a 2 bay body shop since 82 and every so often i take in an old car to do usually for a friend. I try not to since they take lots of time to finish. I never take any money in the beginning, i wait until i do some work then after so many hrs i give a bill. I feel thats a fair way to do the job.

[MUSLCAH]

Originally Posted by dataway

A whole lot of good body guys went a bad way back in the 80's. I worked for a great body and paint man for 2 years, and a good friend. Had a good business out in the sticks, did paint and collision work for the local dealers, sold tires, was doing great ... ended up spending seven years in prison for cocaine.

Ahhh.....the awesome 80’s.....a lot of people went bad. Just glad I made it through...lol

[MUSLCAH]

Originally Posted by Rob in NH

i've been doing body work for myself in a 2 bay body shop since 82 and every so often i take in an old car to do usually for a friend. I try not to since they take lots of time to finish. I never take any money in the beginning, i wait until i do some work then after so many hrs i give a bill. I feel thats a fair way to do the job.

Same here.....take one in ..get 1,000 up front for some materials.....get 40 hours on it....show the customer what’s been done....he pays.....then another 40 hours....I give NO ESTIMATE. If the customer feels like he’s getting screwed....we stop...and I call a wrecker and out it goes. I tell all the customers this...So it’s very clear where we stand. Iam done giving hours away for free..

[64speed]

I can’t afford a 20k paint job either for something I’m gonna drive everyday. I got an estimate from a place here about an hour away called classic pontiac rescue that actually specializes in a bodies and firebirds. All the work I have seen that comes out of there looks top notch and it is a very nice shop but I friended the guy on Facebook and he’s a little out there plus I’ve seen in his Facebook comments people talking about him being a little slow. He came and gave me an estimate of 13,000 but that’s everything with the car reassembled and returned to me ready for drivetrain and interior, even providing glass and installing all of it. I still have feelers out there but he’s in the county where I was a deputy so if things went south I think I could get justice. He wants 6500 up front for materials and then I am gonna pay him 500 a month till the work is done. One thing I did like is he told me he did not want it with the engine or transmission or my wheels. Those are big ticket items and he doesn’t want to be responsible for them even though the car will be stored inside.