[vitamin c]

How are your head pipes from Gardner configured? One piece off the manifold, or two piece with the manifold elbow needing to be welded after installation? I just installed the 2 1/2''Gardner system and had to weld the elbows after the system which is no big deal, but after the install I was thinking that the elbow looks pretty restrictive.

[njsteve]

The Gardner systems are an exact duplicate of the original ones - with the same original flow restrictions and all.

If you are looking for performance, go aftermarket like a Pypes system. If you are going for restoration go Gardner.

I have had the Gardner systems on two 455HO 1972 Formulas and they looked perfect on a full restration but I went with a Pypes crossflow on my Gramma's car with their new 2-1/2" Ram Air D-port manifolds, and that exhaust completely out performs the stock/Gardner system in terms of performance.

[74 SD455 Formula]

Steve,
I did something similar except I took a Gardner Exhaust off of my 72 455 HO GTO and put on a 2 1/2 R.A.R.E. X pipe set up on and what a difference,like night and day. The motor can breath.

[OVERULD]

My car had headers and some Dynamax mufflers, with some over the axle tail pipes without tips - just a slash cut pointed at the ground. I wanted the original looking tail pipes and close to original sound, so I chose to go with the Gardner. But, because the engine had been built pretty stoutly, I wanted it to breath better than the log manifold would allow, so I went with the AMES 2.25" Ram Air manifold. I hope it breaths well enough for the way the engine has been built and tuned.

njsteve answered the question on how the head pipes are configured, but to be more specific, there is no welding required with the Gardner system. See photos below and they should answer your questions. These are photos of all of the components laying on a friend's shop floor before we began the installation. The clamps and hangars are on a workbench and are not pictured, but they are all there.





Here are a few before shots, showing the old system. Look at how close the headers are to the starter and the oil filter. No wonder the starter gets heat soaked and drags on a hot start.





Here is a shot of the car on the frame contact lift for the removal of the old system from the header collectors back. Once we got that much removed, we moved it over to the drive on lift. We removed the headers and will install the new system with the suspension loaded.



A Tale of Two Shops....You've Just Seen the New Shop...Now, Here's the Old School Shop.

This shop has been in operation for over 46 years specializing in drivelines and springs. They have never had a lift and do the work old-school on jack stands with crawlers. Check it out.



3.73 Ring & Pinion is out and the new 3.08 is in.



Check out the pattern! Also check out the Detroit Posi Carrier. It uses the clutch packs instead of the helical gears, so we added GM's AC Delco additive.



Had to replace the axles - both showed signs of wearing where they ride on the bearings, so I went with the Yukon Alloy performance axles, with new bearings and seals.



Is this a date code on the brake drum? 10/73?



BJ

[OVERULD]

And an update on today's efforts on the Exhaust install.

All went well until we got to the muffler hangars. Apparently the 74s used a different muffler hangar than the 70-73s did. There is a small hat-shaped bracket mounted to the body by two bolts, and there is a rubber grommet with a slot in it under that bracket. The muffler hangers have a tang that goes into that slot. Well, we had one of the brackets on the passenger side, but it was missing on the driver's side. In addition, it turns out that we got the 70-73 hangers instead of the 74 hangers, which was throwing the entire geometry of the muffler and tail pipes off. I called Eric Gardner (because he was kind enough to give me his personal cell in case we needed some technical support) and he immediately knew what the issue was. New brackets and hangers are coming via FedEx, shipping Monday to arrive on Tuesday. It will be right when we are done.

The new manifolds went on without having to raise the engine, but we did remove the oil filter adaptor to give a bit more clearance, plus, both inner fenders are still out from all of MPRs work on the fenders, etc.

Quick Question - Do the bolts that hold the manifolds on need lock washers? The bolts that Ames shipped with the gasket set are like three different lengths, which is pretty much self explanatory. But there were no flat washers or lock washers with them. What is the norm here?

Long day - and a few good Woodford Reserve Bourbons this evening...think I'll hit the sack! More Tuesday after we get the exhaust finished.

BJ

[Judge273]

Good Bourbon makes things go better...These cars fight you all the way.

Gardner supplies all the factory like hangers?

My exhaust manifold never had lock washers on them. I've seen them and see some of them for point Judging.

[vitamin c]

The super Duty system I got from Gardner had I believe 2 1/2'' head pipes and Eric explained if I wanted that exact SD copy I would have to weld the elbows just off the manifolds as they are 2 1/4'' to fit through the round manifold clamps. My system looks identical to yours other than the motor ends of the head pipes, very nice fit. I just feel that elbow looks restrictive compared to the rest of the system.

[Held for Ransom]

Originally Posted by OVERULD

Is this a date code on the brake drum? 10/73?



BJ

Looks like L 3 73 (Dec. 3rd, 1973) to me.

[njsteve]

What size rear sway bar is that? It looks like a 1" aftermarket bar???

[74 SD455 Formula]

Originally Posted by njsteve

What size rear sway bar is that? It looks like a 1" aftermarket bar???

It is.

[OVERULD]

Got the new Gardner Exhaust system installation finished today. We had to call in the big guns and got Eric Gardner involved in an issue regarding the muffler hanger brackets. He came through like a champ and had us the correct brackets by mid-day today, and the job was finished by 1:00 PM. Here are the after pics, along with a lot of different angles of the chrome tips. I'm struggling with the way they look. I remember them being more tucked up to the body line and turned inward a little. Give me some input - leave as is or tweak them some. Post some pics of others to support your input. Also posting a link to the short sound bite of the 455 Standard Duty at idle.





























Here is a close-up of the exhaust tip hanger. Any ideas on the best way to bring the tips up and in toward the center?














And here is the link to the sound clip.

https://youtu.be/4Rb5v6gOf2o

Thanks,
BJ

[OVERULD]

Originally Posted by njsteve

The speedo may not be working because the speedo gear housing is wrong for the 3.73 gear. There were at least two "housings" used, one for the 3.08 and lower numerical gears, and one for the higher number 3.42, etc gears. You may have the 3.08 housing with the wrong plastic gear in it so it is not meshing properly.

I am in the process of converting from 3.42s to 3.08s and had to buy the 3.08 housing to replace the 3.42 collar i had previously installed.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/tci-880022

Steve:
I figured out the issue with the speedometer. The headers I just replaced with the Gardner system were installed in a way that had them in direct contact with the speedometer cable. They basically melted the cable causing it to bind up and strip the gear at the transmission. I have a red, 37 tooth gear and also need a new speedometer cable. The link you provided above says it is for a TH-700R4 and I have the TH400. Will that item work on my transmission? Can I specify what color gear and the number of teeth? Are the cables unique to the car and transmission or will any cable work and just cut to fit?

BJ

[unruhjonny]

yeah those tips look off;
it's hard to tell from the hangar picture, but would turning them inward angle them up even a little?

i, personally would want them about horizontal, if not angled ever so slighly upward, as well as inward - to kind of follow the bottom of the quarter panel...

I love what you're doing with this car, and am very impressed on how quick everything is getting done!
Congrats!

[njsteve]

Yup, you should adjust those tips inwards toward each other at a slight angle that duplicates the angle of the quarter panel flow as it slims down toward the rear bumper. Great install job, BTW.

[njsteve]

Originally Posted by OVERULD

Steve:
I figured out the issue with the speedometer. The headers I just replaced with the Gardner system were installed in a way that had them in direct contact with the speedometer cable. They basically melted the cable causing it to bind up and strip the gear at the transmission. I have a red, 37 tooth gear and also need a new speedometer cable. The link you provided above says it is for a TH-700R4 and I have the TH400. Will that item work on my transmission? Can I specify what color gear and the number of teeth? Are the cables unique to the car and transmission or will any cable work and just cut to fit?

BJ

Can you post a photo of your gear. The TH350 and 700R4 share the large gears while the Turbo 400 uses a much smaller one. This is a Turbo 350 gear. Use this website to figure out what gear you now need for the 3.08s. You will need to know what the height of your tires are. http://www.tciauto.com/tc/speedometer-gear-calculator/

[Held for Ransom]

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/tci-880010

Stock '74 Firebird models with GR70-15 tires and auto/3.08:1 rear used the 37 tooth.

[njsteve]

If it already had the 37 tooth gear, then it looks like they never changed it when they put in the 3.73s. So you can get the replacement for the stripped factory gear from TCI via Summit. (I may have misspoken on the small versus large gear as I was thikning about the automatics versus manual trans which used the small gear (I think).

[Held for Ransom]

Correct, small gear was used on manual trans.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/tci-880042
Forgot to add the TH400 housing link.

[njsteve]

I think he may already have the correct housing in there if the 37 tooth gear was working before the cable melted.

[Held for Ransom]

His question was if the item you called out would work for him. I just linked the correct housing for the gear selected.