[rexs73gto]

If that was a 370hp engine it would have the long branch manifolds on it as the 370hp 428 would have been a Ram Air engine & not used the std manifolds. To me this looks like an engine that was installed & then possibly taken out of the car for some reason. Also it haas to have been apart at one time or another because it doesn't have the lock tab style washers on the exhaust bolts. I have a feeling this really isn't what really is what it is said to be. Besides when you bought an engine from Pontiac back then you got a short or long block which didn't come with a fuel pump, intake, exhaust, valley cover or timming chain cover. All those itwms where transfered over from another engine, or bought seprate over the counter & not installed on the engine for you. Somebodys pullin our leg. Good engine but NOT NOS from Pontiac like that in the pic's. I worked for a dealer at that time.

[The Boss]

Originally Posted by prfixer

Oh &*(^! Have I forgotten about a 2nd stamp on the block and I'm thinking of the wrong one?

[400 4spd.]

What I found odd (for a never fired engine) is the dis-colored weak paint that is around the center intake ports, esp. the choke area.

[Cammer-6]

Originally Posted by rexs73gto

If that was a 370hp engine it would have the long branch manifolds on it as the 370hp 428 would have been a Ram Air engine & not used the std manifolds. To me this looks like an engine that was installed & then possibly taken out of the car for some reason. Also it haas to have been apart at one time or another because it doesn't have the lock tab style washers on the exhaust bolts. I have a feeling this really isn't what really is what it is said to be. Besides when you bought an engine from Pontiac back then you got a short or long block which didn't come with a fuel pump, intake, exhaust, valley cover or timming chain cover. All those itwms where transfered over from another engine, or bought seprate over the counter & not installed on the engine for you. Somebodys pullin our leg. Good engine but NOT NOS from Pontiac like that in the pic's. I worked for a dealer at that time.

there was no Ram Air 428
the HO was 390 HP
375HP still had standard exhaust

[428ho4spd]

The XF code is the std 370 HP 428 with std log manifolds, the XG 390 HP 428 would have the long branch manifolds.

[Cammer-6]

Originally Posted by 428ho4spd

The XF code is the std 370 HP 428 with std log manifolds, the XG 390 HP 428 would have the long branch manifolds.

whoops I was thinking 68 when I said 375HP

[rexs73gto]

When I said Ram Air for the 428, I do know that there were no Ram Air 428's Thats why I said Like the Ram Air , you know as in haveing the similar parts & pieces that a car with Ram Air would have had.ot that it was a Ram Air 428.

[ccie3611]

i'm not sure if my friends engine is actually "NOS" but one piece of compelling “evidence” is that the block has no VIN stamp! not sure if any engines installed in a car left the factory with no VIN stamped on the block.

[steve v]

Interesting that it's set up for a manual steering non ac car, I didn't think manual steering was available in the Grand Prix or Bonneville line ups?

A friend was a factory backed Oldsmobile drag racer in the early 80's & GM would send him 350 Olds engines on skids like this one. They were complete with all accessory brackets, fuel pump, oil filter, carb, AIR emission system etc & he said they were pulled from the line at the engine assembly plant.

[Cammer-6]

no VIN means it wasnt installed or was not used because there was a problem on the line.
Ive got a M-21 that has no VIN and remember the guy bought it over the counter.

[The Boss]

Originally Posted by Cammer-6

no VIN means it wasnt installed or was not used because there was a problem on the line.
Ive got a M-21 that has no VIN and remember the guy bought it over the counter.

Not necessarily - I've run across several engines and transmissions in the last 25-30 years that didn't have VINs on them - I currently have a 71 WC that will be going in my convertible that has no VIN on it - and I know the car that came out of because I parted it 18 year ago. I also have a no stampings whatsoever M-22, bought from a member here that will be going in the same car.

It's entirely possible it went in the car and somebody, after a few beers at lunch on a Friday, forgot to stamp a VIN in it.

[Cammer-6]

Originally Posted by The Boss

Not necessarily - I've run across several engines and transmissions in the last 25-30 years that didn't have VINs on them - I currently have a 71 WC that will be going in my convertible that has no VIN on it - and I know the car that came out of because I parted it 18 year ago. I also have a no stampings whatsoever M-22, bought from a member here that will be going in the same car.

It's entirely possible it went in the car and somebody, after a few beers at lunch on a Friday, forgot to stamp a VIN in it.

dont count out the fact that it could be a replacement.
warranty,non warranty replacement that happened close to that model year.
OR even some demo used at tech school(have some of those here as well no VIN)

and just a sidenote
I wonder if those Myrtle and Nunzi Firebirds used fresh off the line crate motors and had no VINs

[muscle_collector]

Originally Posted by The Boss

Not necessarily - I've run across several engines and transmissions in the last 25-30 years that didn't have VINs on them - I currently have a 71 WC that will be going in my convertible that has no VIN on it - and I know the car that came out of because I parted it 18 year ago. I also have a no stampings whatsoever M-22, bought from a member here that will be going in the same car.

It's entirely possible it went in the car and somebody, after a few beers at lunch on a Friday, forgot to stamp a VIN in it.

chris, what and where dealership did that car sell new at??

[The Boss]

Originally Posted by Cammer-6

dont count out the fact that it could be a replacement.
warranty,non warranty replacement that happened close to that model year.
OR even some demo used at tech school(have some of those here as well no VIN)

The engine has an EUN - which means paperwork was generated to have that engine produced to be placed in a car. If there was an engine being produced for warranty work, warranty replacement, tech center use or donation to a tech school - it was produced under a different process and was assigned a SR number.

If you want me to say "Anything could have happened." I guess it could, but the processes were in place to track millions of engines - and that's how it got done.

[The Boss]

Originally Posted by muscle_collector

chris, what and where dealership did that car sell new at??

29 176 Maxon Pontiac Inc Route 22 West Edison NJ

Very hard to read Gary - I had to pull the PHS out of the drawer and look up the number on John Wallace's site. I could read MAX___ ___TIAC INC. and could see dealer # 176.

Framingham build - hindsight I probably shouldn't have parted it huh?

[se428bandit]

I maybe wrong but these look like aftermarket head gaskets and not factory GM.

[Cammer-6]

Chris,I respectfully disagree
I have 2 tech school motors here
No VINs but a normal EUN and usage code

yes Ive found mistakes before in EUN and VIN stamps so never say never.
But the chances of 2 motors coming from a tech school and neither having VINs
but have correct usage codes and a complete EUN,hows that for chances of a "mistake"?
Also motors could be bought same year as production without the SR #.
But one thing I think we all could agree on is this 428 isnt NOS.
Will someone with a borescope please go inspect it and pull a spark plug,look in bore and settle this once and for all..........

Originally Posted by The Boss

The engine has an EUN - which means paperwork was generated to have that engine produced to be placed in a car. If there was an engine being produced for warranty work, warranty replacement, tech center use or donation to a tech school - it was produced under a different process and was assigned a SR number.

If you want me to say "Anything could have happened." I guess it could, but the processes were in place to track millions of engines - and that's how it got done.

[Cammer-6]

Originally Posted by se428bandit

I maybe wrong but these look like aftermarket head gaskets and not factory GM.

I believe youre on to something there
looks to be composite not steel single layer as OEM was

[muscle_collector]

hindsight I probably shouldn't have parted it huh?

coulda shoulda woulda sighhhhhhh i know all to well

[Alvin]

http://dallas.craigslist.org/dal/pts/3527376705.html

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