[dr-doug]

I've searched other threads with differing info, thought I would post the question here.
I sent what I thought were the original master cylinders to Bill to restore off of my black '70 and my '71. He found stamped codes of EB and BE, my build sheet for my '70 lists DH, and I can't read the '71 in that area.
I need 4 total, correct fall of '69 built master cylinders(for '70 cars), but I really don't know what I'm looking for...any help?...DW

[SWEETJUDGE]

Henley would be your guy to ask. EA is 69 only & is a dual bail style. 70 & 71s are more boxy & i have no clue on those codes or where they are

[Judge273]

Here is a nice example of a 70. Looks like EB.

[dr-doug]

Thanks Mike. I wonder if somebody just got dislexic on the one I own that is stamped BE.
Is that your RAM IV? The detail is excellent!...DW

[wheelman]

Have one, date 254=Sept 11 1969, EB on front machined pad, Part #5470409. Original never rebuilt, still has a very small hint of black paint on it. If you need it PM me.

[Judge273]

Doug, That is the one Scott Tiemann did for the RA IV red vert that was winning all the top awards last year. It is very well detailed as you said, and wish mine looked like that.

wheelspin, you have a pm.

[SWEETJUDGE]

BE may be a bad or wrong re stamp?????

[dr-doug]

It's not a restamp, it's an original part. Does it look like somebody replaced this with a restamp, it was sitting in a barn since 1978 until I pulled it out.


DW

[Judge273]

Doug,

Do you have a picture of the stamp and cast date?

That is a 71 from what I can tell and maybe BE is correct for 71?

[dr-doug]

It will be back here Friday and I'll post a picture then....DW

[Francois Raby]

What is the correct master cylinder code for a 1972 ? Same as 1971 ? EB on the front pad ? thanks to reply...

[70RAlll]

Originally Posted by Judge273

Here is a nice example of a 70. Looks like EB.

Doug, it is Bill..UPS picked up your masters today and you will have them friday. Your EB looks identical to this one. You boosters are not as shiney as the one pictured,and I will argue they never were originally. That is the difference between zinc vs real cadmium.. zinc is just too "electric" "bling'y" for my taste.. Plus every original,including yours,booster I have disassembled .... on the inside protected areas.... were the more muted cadmium sheen vs the electric shine of gold zinc.Plus I ordered a new zinc booster , took it apart to see how the inside was, same shiney sheen as the exterior.Yes, I was curious..
Now to your EB and BE stamings. Man this is strange. As you know, I am a 70/71 TA guy.70/71 TA's used an EB master cylinder with the exact same design as yours. BUT, and this is the strange part. The font on the stamping is twice as big as the one pictured here. AND yours are the smaller font as pictured . I guess GTO Masters' were code stamped at a different location,hence the different stamping fonts. I have done over forty 70/71 TA EB's over the past 2 years and all had the larger font EB stampings..Plus your BE had the same small font. And I know these had never been apart. The primary piston on these have 6 identification rings(vs 4,2,or 1) and 3 metering holes(vs 5 or 4) and both of your boosters had these correct primary pistons installed. They had never been apart, you should have seen the sludge inside the bore, almost looked like sand mixed with heavy oil,strange..really strange, had a "grit" to it???. So rest assured, these have never been messed with before I took them apart. Plus they are painted like the one in the photo, not as glossy black(which i think it was not originally) but more like a 50% gloss.. You will be happy with the result..

[dr-doug]

So for sure EB is the correct stamped code on a '70 GTO power front disc, drum rear master cylinder. Jury is still out on '71
I'll add that the booster for a '70 GTO is coded 8519 on the rear portion of 12 o'clock tab, with a julian date code on the front.
The booster code for a '71 GTO is 1951, same location as above, date coded as above.
I'll have to check my '69 tonight for correct codes unless somebody else wants to enlighten us.
Anybody here have what they know is a correct '71 setup(booster and master)..DW

[Bet Winner]

Originally Posted by 70RAlll

Your boosters are not as shiney as the one pictured,and I will argue they never were originally.

One of the restorers told me that he believed that they were all zinc so I found Bill to do mine.

At first, I did not really know what was used originally, but I remember going with my Dad to look at Pontiacs when I was a kid--the boosters had that rather muted/mottled look--not bright and polished so I knew that most of the restored ones did not look quite right. It is odd what you notice when you are young--but it seemed odd to see something on a car that was gold with hints of blue/green/red in it so I noticed them. I was mostly looking at Bonnevilles/Catalinas--Vann York Pontiac in High Point seemed to be a family car dealership (although the RAIV Judge that recently sold came from there).

[motorcitymusclecar]

I was going thought the green cover 69 shop manual the other day for something and found a page that listed all the masters for the 69 cars and I always thought there was only one EA for power disc but to my surprise there were a few different manufactures and EA was one of them if Delco made it had one code and if Bendix or another manufacture made it it was another. Your car may have the common one or the uncommon one and i am sure substitutions were made all the time based on supply and manufacture.

[TEG]

I just wanted to mention that I just received my MC from Karps. I had it powdercoated the correct black for durability. It looks great. Jeff at Karps indicated that many rebuilders use brass sleeves rather than stainless which create problems down the road. According to Karps, a lot of business is fixing recently rebuilt MCs that had brass sleeves installed. It was about $250.00 with powder coat finish and I am pleased.

Just an FYI--

[motorcitymusclecar]

Found the page in the manual this is 69
Pontiac Delco Morine - Power Drum & manual Drum - HU
GP - Tempest Delco Morine - Power Drum & manual Drum - CT
Firebird Delco Morine - Power Drum & manual Drum - CT
GP - Tempest Delco Morine - Power Disc- EA
Firebird Delco Morine - Power Disc- GA
Pontiac Delco Morine - Power Disc- RA
Bendix - Power Drum - HU
Bendix - Power Drum Heavy Duty - PP
bendix - Power Disc - YM

1" bore for drum brakes and 1 1/8" for disc brakes

[Sport71]

Originally Posted by TEG

I just wanted to mention that I just received my MC from Karps. I had it powdercoated the correct black for durability. It looks great. Jeff at Karps indicated that many rebuilders use brass sleeves rather than stainless which create problems down the road. According to Karps, a lot of business is fixing recently rebuilt MCs that had brass sleeves installed. It was about $250.00 with powder coat finish and I am pleased.

Just an FYI--

TEG - can you post a pic when you get a chance?

[70RAlll]

FWIW...I have done probably 40 plus of these Masters over the past 18 months,the 1970 style that is, and have yet to have one that needed to be resleeved.sleeving is mandated when the bore is too pitted to hold the fluid pressure when stopping. The majority of your pitting,albiet light pitting, happens on the rear of the bore.Why I have no idea...This side operates the rear drum brakes.SO even with a light pits, you may loose 10% or so efficiency in the rear while the foward portion of the bore, which is never pitted(at least in my experience), functions for the front disc brakes. And as I said, never had to sleeve one yet. Yours must have really been bad to need a sleeving... But quality sleeving is guaranteed to rescue an otherwise unusable master

[TEG]

Originally Posted by 70RAlll

FWIW...I have done probably 40 plus of these Masters over the past 18 months,the 1970 style that is, and have yet to have one that needed to be resleeved.sleeving is mandated when the bore is too pitted to hold the fluid pressure when stopping. The majority of your pitting,albiet light pitting, happens on the rear of the bore.Why I have no idea...This side operates the rear drum brakes.SO even with a light pits, you may loose 10% or so efficiency in the rear while the foward portion of the bore, which is never pitted(at least in my experience), functions for the front disc brakes. And as I said, never had to sleeve one yet. Yours must have really been bad to need a sleeving... But quality sleeving is guaranteed to rescue an otherwise unusable master

Actually, no. The MC was in really great shape and I bought it from Steve Gregori on the west cost. I cannot pretend to be an expert on these, however, Karps indicated that the risk without sleeving is leakage over time. After years of work and tens of thousands of dollars, I sure didn't want brake fluid dripping all over the firewall, frame, etc. It's great that you have had success. Everyone I spoke with said its imperative to resleeve when you rebuild. Who knows? Just a little more money but I definately want it done right. I think Karps has a lot of experience doing these things and they sure are decent guys.

I would be happy to post a pic or two.