[bulletpruf]

Ok, so I have a 455 that I built for my 1968 Lemans convt. It's a strong pump gas motor with moderate compression (9.5:1 or so).

It was off the road for a few years while I was finishing up a tour with the Army a few thousand miles away, and now that I've dusted it off and gotten it running again, the starter motor is definitely not happy. It doesn't spin over very fast, and when it does, I get the rapid clicking from the starter, so it does not seem like the starter is getting enough voltage.

Starter itself is just a stock unit.

Battery is new and fully charged.

My plan at this point is to change the battery cables to something thicker. The cables were new when installed a few years ago, but they're just basic stock cables.

What size cable should I go with? Looks like the stock stuff is 4 AWG (gauge), so I'm thinking 2 or 1 AWG. I plan to buy bulk cable and build them myself using crimped lugs, heat shrink, and military terminals. I have some 2/0 cable (not 2 gauge; much thicker!) left over from a 7.3 diesel job but that seems really thick for this application.

Thanks,

Scott

[Goatracer1]

If you have low compression you shouldn;t need thick cables. I would check the battery ground on the engine block, Could have rusted while you were away. Also the connection of the starter to the block. Remember just because it was a new battery doesn;t mean it;s good. Check the date code on it. I;ve seen them on the shelf a couple of years old.

[78w72]

x2 thinking its not a cable issue, i use stock cables on the same comp 455 for 10+ years with no issues.

I would check/clean the connections & grounds first, then look at the starter itself, especially the solenoid. Have had bad solenoids act the same way.

[bulletpruf]

Originally Posted by 78w72

x2 thinking its not a cable issue, i use stock cables on the same comp 455 for 10+ years with no issues.

I would check/clean the connections & grounds first, then look at the starter itself, especially the solenoid. Have had bad solenoids act the same way.

I checked all the connections and grounds. I thought the ground on the cylinder head might have been the problem because it had some corrosion, so I cleaned it up with a wire brush and sandpaper and re-assembled with dielectric silicone grease and no change - still clicking.

I just had the starter and solenoid off (I removed it when I pulled the trans) and all looked nice and clean and fresh as I reinstalled.

It would be easy enough to pull the starter and replace the solenoid and double check everything. I don't want to load up the parts cannon unnecessarily, but no big deal if I end up with a new solenoid.

I think I'll still replace the cables with 2 gauge. Won't cost much and that'll give me an excuse to use my fancy crimping tool.

[george kujanski]

Low battery or poor battery connection...including the ground side. Make sure the batttery terminals are clean/tight.

George

[bulletpruf]

Originally Posted by george kujanski

Low battery or poor battery connection...including the ground side. Make sure the batttery terminals are clean/tight.

George

It's possible that I have a bad battery. It's fully charged, but I haven't load tested it.

Terminals are clean and tight.

[Shiny]

My new battery sat for about 5 yrs without a trickle charger and it died.

Suggest you haul your battery to the parts store and get it tested.

That is a really nice color combo.. pretty car!

[bulletpruf]

Originally Posted by Shiny

My new battery sat for about 5 yrs without a trickle charger and it died.

Suggest you haul your battery to the parts store and get it tested.

That is a really nice color combo.. pretty car!

The battery is only about a month old, but it will only take a few minutes to yank it and bring it to the nearest parts store for testing.

Thanks

[Shiny]

Woops, sorry I assumed...

Yes, seems unlikely to be the battery. What George said.

[bulletpruf]

Originally Posted by Shiny

Woops, sorry I assumed...

Yes, seems unlikely to be the battery. What George said.

I pulled the battery to load test it and it tested good.

However, when I removed the battery, I was able to pull the negative cable out of the battery terminal without using too much force. Never have been a big fan of these type of terminals. Anyway, then I crimped on a lug and installed on a military terminal (yes, I used the positive terminal; first one I grabbed) and then tried it. It turns over quicker and with less clicking, but the clicking is still present.

[bdk1976]

I fought starter issues for years on my 65 - last year I put in a mini starter using 1/0 wire and military terminals and zero issues since.

[bulletpruf]

Originally Posted by bdk1976

I fought starter issues for years on my 65 - last year I put in a mini starter using 1/0 wire and military terminals and zero issues since.

What mini starter did you use? What engine and compression?

Thanks

[bdk1976]

Summit mini starter - low compression '73 455 (~8:1)

[Greg Reid]

Check the voltage on the purple wire coming from the ignition switch to the S terminal on the solenoid while someone turns the key. That wire gets baked over the decades and will develop resistance giving you low voltage to the solenoid. I had to change mine out for the same reason. I didn't bother the ignition switch, just spliced in a new wire from the firewall to the S terminal.
By the way, I switched to a mini starter also. It did the same thing and that's when I started diving deeper and found the low voltage situation on the solenoid wire. IMI is the brand I used because I like the terminals on the side opposite the exhaust manifold.

[Shiny]

Progress!

If you clean up all the connections like you did and still have an issue, the solenoid is where I'd look next.

Greg is on the same path...

As to the cable, a bigger one might help, but make all the connections good first. A new cable might, however, fix a couple bad connections!

A voltmeter with some long test leads could sort it out pretty fast if you're comfortable using one.

[78w72]

Originally Posted by bulletpruf

I pulled the battery to load test it and it tested good.

However, when I removed the battery, I was able to pull the negative cable out of the battery terminal without using too much force. Never have been a big fan of these type of terminals. Anyway, then I crimped on a lug and installed on a military terminal (yes, I used the positive terminal; first one I grabbed) and then tried it. It turns over quicker and with less clicking, but the clicking is still present.

I was gonna mention loose wire in the terminal or cheap crappy terminals, good to hear that improved it.

One thing to mention that im sure isnt causing the problem, but dielectric grease is not intended to be used on electrical connections, it is only for moisture prevention like in the boots of spark plug wires but not on the terminals. Common misconception with that stuff since the name kind of implies its for electrical connections. I would clean it off any ground or power connections to be sure the connections are good bare metal to metal.

I use a summit mini starter too on another 500hp+ 10.75:1 engine, with stock cables and no problems at all, even with an older battery.

[george kujanski]

To diagnose if you have a purple wire problem after the battery terminals are clean and tight: add a wire to the solenoid terminal and use it to jump directly to the battery. If it works better, the purple solenoid wire has an issue. This connection goes from the battery thru the firewall, thru the ignition switch, thru the park switch (auto trans) then to the solenoid.

A good opportunity for poor/worn connections over time.

I had a problem on a car that had the battery in the rear section (Caddy Allante) that began to have solenoid issues so I added a relay in the solenoid circuit to shorten/ eliminate the long OEM connection. Problem solved. Then again the car has an Italian electrical system....'nuff said!

George

[bulletpruf]

Originally Posted by george kujanski

To diagnose if you have a purple wire problem after the battery terminals are clean and tight: add a wire to the solenoid terminal and use it to jump directly to the battery. If it works better, the purple solenoid wire has an issue. This connection goes from the battery thru the firewall, thru the ignition switch, thru the park switch (auto trans) then to the solenoid.

A good opportunity for poor/worn connections over time.

I had a problem on a car that had the battery in the rear section (Caddy Allante) that began to have solenoid issues so I added a relay in the solenoid circuit to shorten/ eliminate the long OEM connection. Problem solved. Then again the car has an Italian electrical system....'nuff said!

George

I see you live in Palatine; small world. A good friend of mine from college is your Police Chief.

[bulletpruf]

Working on new battery cables today. 2 gauge wire, crimped on lugs, military terminals, adhesive lined heat shrink.

[bulletpruf]

So, I'm worse off today than I was yesterday....

I swapped in the new solenoid and re-installed the starter. Didn't turn over at all; didn't even try. Figured my new solenoid was bad, so I reinstalled the old one and put it on the car. Still nothing at all, just a faint click that sounds like it may be coming from the voltage regulator area.

Bench tested the starter and it works fine.

Tried a jumper wire from the positive terminal on the battery to the S terminal (where the purple wire connects) on the solenoid. Nothing happened.

I swapped back to the old battery cables that I had on it before. Still nothing.

Battery is good; has 12.7 volts.

I am getting power to the car; interior lights, dash, etc.

I am using the S terminal on the solenoid.

I can't recall if the car had a working park switch; if it does, maybe I could have jarred it loose?

Any ideas?

Thanks!