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Old 12-30-2020, 08:47 AM
66sprint6 66sprint6 is offline
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Default Ignition switch smoking!

Last night I was sitting in my newly acquired '67 Lemans, just going through the car and trying various lights, etc. When I turned the ignition on, the switch started to smoke. I turned it off and tried to look underneath, but I can't see anything because of all the air conditionng ductwork. It was dark so I just disconnected the battery and hopefully I can get a better look in the next couple of days. I'm trying to think of what would cause something like that. Maybe some creative wiring under the dash from a previous owner?. I've been checking online and have found this switch to be quite rare indeed. The ignition switch for an A/C car has 7 terminals, instead of six for a non-A/C car. It also has the provision for the ignition lamp. Is there a source for these? Can I use one from another model or year? Any suggestions as to why the switch would start smoking?

  #2  
Old 12-30-2020, 08:59 AM
chrisp chrisp is offline
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I have a 7 if in need.

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Old 12-31-2020, 09:50 AM
66sprint6 66sprint6 is offline
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Hi Chrisp, PM sent.

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Old 12-31-2020, 10:22 AM
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Smoke coming out of an electrical part doesn't necessarily point to the original problem. It just points to the weakest link in the circuit. Don't be surprised if you let the smoke out of the new switch when you put it in.

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Old 12-31-2020, 04:14 PM
66sprint6 66sprint6 is offline
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Well, I don’t know if this has anything to do with it, but there’s definitely some stuff going on. I can’t see everything because of the A/C ducts, but it’s enough to see that someone was fooling around. I don’t believe that the relay mounted to the e-brake bracket is original. It gets power from a wire off of a junction block on the other side of the firewall. That junction block is fed directly off of the battery connection on the alternator. I’m not sure where the thick red wire goes, but it appears to go up and back down with some other wiring behind the driver’s kick panel. The relay is triggered by some brown wire that comes down from the dash somewhere. Another brown wire is tapped from the fuse box and runs up somewhere. The other thin black wire coming out of the tap simply powers the under hood light. I also removed a wire that someone spliced into the ash tray lamp. They used lampcord. Geez. It didn’t go anywhere: whatever they hooked up to was gone.
Anyways, there sure is a lot more going on with an A/C car. It looks like some dismantling is in order. No big deal. Just harder to do in the cold.
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Old 12-31-2020, 04:42 PM
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Power windows or Seats?
The relay on the brake release may be for your power accessories and top.
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Old 12-31-2020, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 66sprint6 View Post
Well, I don’t know if this has anything to do with it, but there’s definitely some stuff going on. I can’t see everything because of the A/C ducts, but it’s enough to see that someone was fooling around. I don’t believe that the relay mounted to the e-brake bracket is original. It gets power from a wire off of a junction block on the other side of the firewall. That junction block is fed directly off of the battery connection on the alternator. I’m not sure where the thick red wire goes, but it appears to go up and back down with some other wiring behind the driver’s kick panel. The relay is triggered by some brown wire that comes down from the dash somewhere. Another brown wire is tapped from the fuse box and runs up somewhere. The other thin black wire coming out of the tap simply powers the under hood light. I also removed a wire that someone spliced into the ash tray lamp. They used lampcord. Geez. It didn’t go anywhere: whatever they hooked up to was gone.
Anyways, there sure is a lot more going on with an A/C car. It looks like some dismantling is in order. No big deal. Just harder to do in the cold.
That ain't factory! Let know what you find. PM me for cell # if you need.

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Old 01-01-2021, 03:44 PM
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A loose/poor connection of a wire terminal, on the back of the ignition switch, can get hot enough to melt the plastic connector. It doesn't take much to make smoke when current is consentrated to a small area. Ten amps running through a pin point can turn the brass terminals cherry red.

So might just need some maintenance work instead of a real problem like a short of some kind.

Clay

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Old 01-01-2021, 07:29 PM
66sprint6 66sprint6 is offline
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The fusebox does not exactly match the one shown in the chassis manual. Am I not missing some terminals to plug any accressories that I might want to add? To the right of the Radio/Inst/Tail lamp fuses.

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Old 01-02-2021, 01:15 AM
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I do believe what you have is correct from factory.
I added lugs to mine to reflect what the manual showed and I deemed necessary.

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Old 01-02-2021, 03:29 PM
66sprint6 66sprint6 is offline
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OK, I got that funky looking wiring figured out, thanks to the First Gen Firebird site. They have the '67 Chassis Manual and Body by Fisher manuals online. You need them both. Super helpful. The wiring is for the power windows and although not factory, it is functional. It just needs to be cleaned up. That relay is from a '68 and up from what I've seen. The wire that goes from the BAT side of the alternator directy to the circuit breaker under the hood should actually come from the battery. So I'll get that cleaned up as well. I don't know why people mess with these things.
That doesn't solve my smoking ignition switch problem, but I'm hoping that it's related to a loose or dirty connection as suggested. I'm going to pull the pigtail at the switch and check it out, along with any wiring.
I'm still looking for an A/C ignition switch. They're out there: a couple sold recently on ebay, but there's nothing listed right now. I've not seen one with the lamping provision like my existing one. 1116676 or D-1445 is the one for '66/67 A/C cars with the 7 prongs. I figure at the very least that I should keep a spare.
In the interim, what's the best way to clean up the pigtail and ignition switch? Should I use contact cleaner on the prongs and pigtail? Dielectric grease before plugging it back together?

  #12  
Old 01-03-2021, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 66sprint6 View Post
OK, I got that funky looking wiring figured out, thanks to the First Gen Firebird site. They have the '67 Chassis Manual and Body by Fisher manuals online. You need them both. Super helpful. The wiring is for the power windows and although not factory, it is functional. It just needs to be cleaned up. That relay is from a '68 and up from what I've seen. The wire that goes from the BAT side of the alternator directy to the circuit breaker under the hood should actually come from the battery. So I'll get that cleaned up as well. I don't know why people mess with these things.
That doesn't solve my smoking ignition switch problem, but I'm hoping that it's related to a loose or dirty connection as suggested. I'm going to pull the pigtail at the switch and check it out, along with any wiring.
I'm still looking for an A/C ignition switch. They're out there: a couple sold recently on ebay, but there's nothing listed right now. I've not seen one with the lamping provision like my existing one. 1116676 or D-1445 is the one for '66/67 A/C cars with the 7 prongs. I figure at the very least that I should keep a spare.
In the interim, what's the best way to clean up the pigtail and ignition switch? Should I use contact cleaner on the prongs and pigtail? Dielectric grease before plugging it back together?
These switches do not have 7 prongs, only 6.
I have both in my hands right now. The 1116676 is non lighted and the 1116679 is lighted.

Charles


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  #13  
Old 01-03-2021, 09:52 AM
66sprint6 66sprint6 is offline
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Thanks, Charles.
I did finally pull the one out of my car late last night. It was driving me crazy. I was going by a lot of other information on the internet and was convinced that an A/C car had 7 blades. But it is the 1116679. A bit of a relief after all that. So it's good to know that if mine fails, the worst case scenario would be having to install the more commonly available 1116676 which would not be lighted but will work.


Last edited by 66sprint6; 01-03-2021 at 10:19 AM.
  #14  
Old 01-03-2021, 07:13 PM
mgarblik mgarblik is offline
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As best you can, try to follow the resistance wire from the ignition switch to the coil. If the car still has points, this wire is used. If it has been converted to Petronix, HEI or most other aftermarket ignitions, it is not used. It can get very hot and smoke if used incorrectly and carrying too much amperage. Worth a check.

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Old 01-03-2021, 07:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgarblik View Post
As best you can, try to follow the resistance wire from the ignition switch to the coil. If the car still has points, this wire is used. If it has been converted to Petronix, HEI or most other aftermarket ignitions, it is not used. It can get very hot and smoke if used incorrectly and carrying too much amperage. Worth a check.
Mike,

Resistance wire is (should be) under the hood on this car.

Could have been key not all the way in run position and contacts just barely touching. Then got a tiny spot hot enough to vaporize old assembly lube.

Clay

  #16  
Old 01-03-2021, 11:23 PM
66sprint6 66sprint6 is offline
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Thanks, Guys. These discussions really help. I've taken a good look at the wiring, the connector, and the switch today and they don't appear damaged. The switch has a smell, though. Hopefully it's OK.
When I went to take the switch out, it was quite loose already. So maybe that was my problem all along? I didn't notice that when just turning the ignition on. But when I went to take it out, it was loose enough to sag and I could move it in all directions. The cylinder is well worn, too. Possibly contributing as mentioned, and certainly not helping the situation.
So I'm replacing both the switch and the cylinder with NOS. I'll have to suck it up and have a new proprietary key for the ignition, unless anyone knows someone that can code a NOS cylinder to the car.
Hopefully she'll be a reformed smoker after that. When I first saw the smoke, I was alarmed an bummed. When I was going to work a few weeks ago, I saw a guy on the side of the road with what was a really nice '69 Caprice and it was letting ALL the smoke out.

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