[Steve C.]

Go to the cam finder I mentioned previously here...

https://www.crower.com/cam-card-finder/

Type in 60919 and it provides what is presumed the current "cam card" for that grind from Crower. Again, presumed.


.

[scott70]

I remember ordering that cam and when my engine guy degreed it in,the LS was off...if I remember right it was over 115. They ordered another cam (60919) again and the LS was alot closer to the cam card but not perfect. At the time someone said that crower cams were known for being not spot on with the card.
Also at the time I think they called crower to ask them about the difference in #'s and crower said it wouldn't make any difference but they sent a replacement cam anyways.

[lust4speed]

Cams look exactly the same except for 1° consistent difference in all events. So no movement of only intake or exhaust events separately so can discount that. Basically then just a very slight shift of degreeing the cam.

I did notice they recommend about 20 pounds more spring pressure on the seat and over the nose now.

[Jay S]

In the last 2-3 years I have several 60919s and they all said installed at 109 ICL and 112 LSA with 120 lbs installed seat pressure. I do not recall what the pressure was over the nose. That 108 Icl and spring pressures is definitely a new change. 150 lbs seat and 350 lbs .469 lift....UGH? That is well over a 400 lbs (426) spring rate and starting from 150 lbs at the seat is solid FT cam territory. Someone at Crower get a file mixed up? Lol

I had one 60919 that had 308* at .006” tappet accross all the exh lobes, more what I would expect from Steve’s conversation with Crower. But it had a horrible core shift on the cam core and I never got to run that one, I returned it. The other 60919s that I have had lately the .006 tappet durations have been 283-286 on the intake and 292-294 on the exhaust. Well short of the advertise numbers, but who knows, maybe the changed it again.

I think that the one profile I had that had the big exhaust durations might be more representative of how Crower use to grind that cam years ago, more like a old RA4 with a bunch of seat timing. I think someone must have accidentally pulled a older master to grind it.

[ponchorob]

...so im in the new boat with 108 degree intake center....i reads also 150 lbs seat pressure didn know they change the pressure so much ...have already bought... comp...995 they have 115lbs with 1.7 installed height...so it seems im far off....

[Jay S]

150 seat and 350 @.469 almost has to be a clerical error. I could maybe understand the extra spring rate if it was a single spring with a dampener. But even there 150 seat seems way to high.

The 995 comp spring should be at the top end of spring pressure for that cam, and should work fine, I would shim the the intake so it has 120 seat, 130 max.

If in doubt call Crower and ask them, then ask why they made a change to the spring pressures from the old card. I would try to talk to Shane if you can get him.

[Jay S]

The last 60919 (two years ago) we did would start to float the valves at about 6700. It runs 120 lbs seat, lower 300s spring rate, dual spring w/dampener Erson set up. It has about 20K on it now. It has v max Rhoads super lubes on it. I think I have durations for that cam every .001 tappet for most of the profile.

[MidnightAuto]

Well I am in the middle of installing a 60919. For context - I am not a pro, so this all could be human error. From all the posts, it seems this cam usually needs 4 degrees of advance to get it to 108. In my case, I am calculating a 105.5 dot to dot so I initially retarded 4 degrees on crank. when i took my readings again, it was 112.5. which seems like too much. So for kicks I retarded it 2 degrees at the crank and my numbers came out to 105.5. Which I realize should be impossible if each of my readings are apples to apples and i started at 105.5 dot to dot. I spent about 3 hours fooling around with this and I'm at wits end. so I expect their is user error here.


Can the layman driver (street, with limited strip) really tell that much of a difference. I'd hate to give up and go dot to dot with all I am doing on this build, but I am a bit frustrated with the degreeing results.

What would you guys recommend I try to resolve this?

[Jay S]

Could just be off a tooth. It can help to rotate the engine over twice and see if the timing marks line up again. If it is off a tooth it won’t line up with the marks again on the second rotation.

A lot of guys are use to positioning the cam mark at 12 and the crank make at 12. Really easy to get off a tooth with the 9 way key sets like that, works better with the cam at 6 and crank mark at 12 with a multi key set. FWIW

Posting a pic of the marks at TDC might help.

[MidnightAuto]

Jay I think u might be in to something. I took timing chain off and re installed taking careful notice of teeth. You can see a pic here with black lines. After checking measurements again, I cam in at 109. Checked it twice. 109 both times. So I’ll chalk it up to off one tooth. Thanks for feedback. Surprised to see cam not need more adjustment based on all the posts about crower cams, but I guess I’ll take it…

[MidnightAuto]

yep - I was doing it at 6 and 12, that last time, so should be good. if I leave it at 6 and 12 then when i go to wire the distributor i start #1 plug at 6 oclock and point the rotor at #6 cylinder for start up?

[ponchorob]

So what does that mean installt dot to do and you are at 109.....or with 4 degree advance

[MidnightAuto]

As I understand it, it means crower 4 advance they out in cam mostly took. I measured dot to dot and got 109 off a 112lsa. So one short of the published 108. Close enough for me, and others say these run better at 109, and also with chain stretch coming I think I’m good.

That’s how I understand it.

[MidnightAuto]

Sorry lots of spell check. Crower “put”