[i4abuygto]

Please give your opinions and ideas
I have a 67 GTO HO convertible that has a stock AC system that hasn’t worked in 30 years and in the restoration I want to get the AC system working good.
Currently, the bezel, gauges and AC ducts are out so only the evaporator / heater / fan box are still mounted to the firewall.
I have been advised by some to retrofit the stock system to 134a and been told by others it won’t cool as good as Vintage Air or Classic
I will need to move forward acquiring the parts that I need to fix the stock system or purchasing aftermarket


This is what I have that is all untested
Everything from the POA valve back to behind the dash / I have all vacuum canisters and lines that may need to be replaced /
hoses were cut after POA valve going forward in engine bay
I have an NOS condenser for 67 in a box new
I have stock compressor used with unknown condition needs to be repaired replaced or upgraded
I have wiring through firewall to fixtures on air box and vacuum lines. Vacuum lines probably need to be replaced.
I have all stock duct work and vents behind dash

What I will need to get stock system working is new POA valve, drier and hose kit and new or refabbed compressor. Basically, everything forward to condenser.
Evaporator is still mounted with condition unknown.
New AC wiring harness for engine compartment to connect to AC controller and wiring harness under hood for 67 HO/Ram Air with AC
New heater core as the shape of existing is unknown

Questions for all of you

Am I better off spending for aftermarket like Vintage Air or Classic Air Then spending to fix stock?

If I purchase Vintage or Classic Can I use my NOS Condenser and eliminate it from a new aftermarket kit at purchase?

With an after market kit do I get a new heater core?

With aftermarket do I eliminate all stock electric and vacuum lines?


If I stay stock can I upgrade to a new higher volume compressor?
Recommendations on Compressor?

Do I need to test the stock evaporator or replace?


Cost is a concern but more “bang for the buck” is more important

I heard that with the aftermarket the new duct work takes up a lot of space behind the dash.

What am I missing?

Stock? Vintage Air? Classic Air?
Please give your opinions on all pros and Cons

This will be a driver and I want it to be cost effective, efficient, and comfortable

Please comment

Thank you
Mark

I also posted this in the 66-67 tech section

[bhill86]

I can’t answer all of your questions but I can attest to being somewhat unhappy with my classic auto air system in my 77 Trans Am. For the money I spent, I would’ve expected better, what I’d call, fit and finish.

Mods can delete if they don’t approve of a link to another forum but here is my write up on TAC

http://transamcountry.com/community/...?topic=83899.0

[i4abuygto]

Thanks Bhill86,
I hope the moderators dont delete this post because it is very helpful.
Ironically, I am also working on a 79 TA that needs the AC system restored or my wife won’t ride in it.
Very ironic to me that my TA is also missing everything after the evaporator core as yours and your write up is very helpful. Big difference is I am also missing the interior duct work and heater core is shot.
I have a new heater core and will be installing in the next several weeks.
The previous owner was a kid at the time that just eliminated many of the AC components. Now I need to build it all back as the TA is only summer driven now
I don’t think the system on my TA was capped and not sure I can test all in the car.
So both my 79 TA and 67 GTO need similar reconstruction on the AC system.
I will avoid the Classic Auto Air system per your experience. I am currently pricing stock components to try and get the AC system working.in the TA also.
Keep the advice coming.
Thank you
Mark

[i4abuygto]

Photos of 79 Trans Am current state of AC system and 67 GTO AC system

[gtospieg]

A couple of things I've learned messing with my AC on my 67 GTO. Do Not use the POA replacement(get your original POA recalibrated.,..not cheap), use R12 if staying with your original system(I could never get the 134 to cool properly...50*...not cool, pun intended). As long as your evaporator doesn't leak it should be reusable after a thorough cleaning. The current technology for condensers is "parallel flow" so I would replace your original. I used a "pro 6 ten" aftermarket compressor(less than half the weight and less HP to run), it doesn't look stock but not a concern for me....I'm doing another 67 now and it will get Vintage Air. The GTO was a factory AC car the 67 Tempest I'm doing now had no AC.

[tjs72lemans]

For my 72 Lemans, I went with classic air and bought their kit. I had no condenser, no idea what condition compressor was in (some say they leak oil again after rebuild), no idea of evaporator condition. The whole system was a direct fit. I've never messed with AC stuff before and I plumbed it all by myself. It would've taken at least two guys to install the old heavy compressor. I had it evacuated, charged and no leaks and blows cold. Very happy with it. I used all my original under dash components, so no messing around inside the cabin.
If there is anything in your old system (condenser, evaporator, etc.) and it gets in your new compressor, it will be voided of warranty. One reason to go all new and know what you have.

[bhill86]

I really wish I’d had a better experience. I believe others have in the past at least. I was really excited for that system. I still have hope I can get my pressure dialed in for better cooling. Don’t quote me but I believe Vintage air, which typically replaces everything, can be ordered to use with factory controls. That was one reason I chose the original air kit. I wanted to keep factory controls and ducting since mine was all intact

[ZeGermanHam]

Yes, the SureFit kits from Vintage Air utilize the factory controls. They get converted on the back to electronic, and there are no visible changes on the front side of the control panel.

[HWYSTR455]

I've done a combo of systems on a few cars.

On the 442, most of the OE stuff was in great shape, and figured I would update it, use a Sanden, and go to 134. Biggest issue I had was that the OE system uses vacuum switches/doors, and, are prone to issues. I did all Classic Auto Air stuff, they did great work, the system for the most part worked excellent, except for the blend doors etc. Uhg.

Only thing I didn't like was the Sanden bracket, which constantly would break. Anyway, I just like 2 mo ago switched to Vintage Air, and couldn't be happier.

My 70 GTO Vintage Air setup, love it, blows hard, cold, works excellent. Learned some stuff on the way to make the installation look very pro and clean, and now I know what and how to do a pro install on one. It takes planning, and there are some items that take time, it's not like you can do it in a weekend.

Have all the stuff for my '71 bird, Vintage Air, and will be doing that this spring. I think I will do an actual install thread for that, share what I've learned.

One thing that is a little bit of a frustration with the Vintage Air control panels, the dang lettering on the face doesn't light up. There's an 'illumination' wire, have installed it correctly on both the GTO and the 442, but the panel doesn't light. I've look at it hard, and I can't see how those letters can light up, they look like simple stencils right on the panel, but maybe it's just hard to see.

I looked at the panel for the 'bird, and it looks the same, like just black stenciled letters, but I'm going to play with that and see.


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[HoovDaddy]

Originally Posted by HWYSTR455

I looked at the panel for the 'bird, and it looks the same, like just black stenciled letters, but I'm going to play with that and see..

You might be able to adapt your control using parts from one of their Control Panel Conversion Kits. I didn't see one for '71 but I have one for my '69.

[HoovDaddy]

Originally Posted by i4abuygto

Am I better off spending for aftermarket like Vintage Air or Classic Air Then spending to fix stock?

If I purchase Vintage or Classic Can I use my NOS Condenser and eliminate it from a new aftermarket kit at purchase? I would not, the refrigerant capacity and oil capacity will be different. The compressor comes pre-oiled, Vintage advises not to mess with it.

With an after market kit do I get a new heater core? The Vintage unit has a new heater core with the evap core. It's all in one compact unit that bolts to the inside of the firewall.

With aftermarket do I eliminate all stock electric and vacuum lines? Yes, the Vintage unit is all electronic and a new harness is included.


If I stay stock can I upgrade to a new higher volume compressor?
Recommendations on Compressor? Yes, they are available. I don't have any recommendations. It will be expensive to get that system working.

Do I need to test the stock evaporator or replace? It will need to be tested. But the risk is failure down the road.


Cost is a concern but more “bang for the buck” is more important

I heard that with the aftermarket the new duct work takes up a lot of space behind the dash. Not sure on the A bodies. Yes on F bodies.

What am I missing?

One point that I heard was the loss of fresh air coming into the vehicle with these aftermarket systems. In most convertibles there are so many leaks it shouldn't be a concern (lol). Back in the day we always cracked the window anyway.

[ZeGermanHam]

Originally Posted by HoovDaddy

You might be able to adapt your control using parts from one of their Control Panel Conversion Kits. I didn't see one for '71 but I have one for my '69.

This was already answered above. The SureFit kits which are available for this year GTO convert the existing original control panel to electronic, so you don't need to use any sort of non-original HVAC control panel.

[i4abuygto]

Thanks all for your ideas

If I purchase Vintage or Classic Can I use my NOS Condenser and eliminate it from a new aftermarket kit at purchase? I would not, the refrigerant capacity and oil capacity will be different. The compressor comes pre-oiled, Vintage advises not to mess with it

I was asking about the new NOS condenser that I have - not compressor .
The stock compressor I have shape and condition is unknown. I will need to have it checked refurbished or replaced with new

Can I use an NOS condenser with aftermarket system?

[i4abuygto]

This is a tough decision as I want the system to work great and it will be costly with all options.

I would prefer stock if I can get it to blow cold air but I know it will be difficult to test and source all the stock components I would need to make it work

The toughest part of the decision is that I have all of the components as you see in the photo from the firewall back and stock would be ideal but finding all the stock under the hood components seams like a tough road to hoe.

Can I get all the needed parts at Classic Auto Air.?

[tjs72lemans]

I would call Classic Air and ask about your condenser and cost savings. You might find the whole kit cheaper and sell the condenser you have.

[HWYSTR455]

I think I paid $170 for my Vintage Air condensor kit. As long as it bolts up, and is a high efficiency design, it really doesn't matter who you get it from.

The evap case is the main item of consideration.

OE systems are big, bulky, and inefficiency.


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