Non Pontiac Motors in Pontiacs includes factory 403,305,350 Chevy, Buick V6,
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  #41  
Old 03-21-2008, 11:45 PM
jimmy-ny jimmy-ny is offline
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Andy - Great car - been watching your posts on LS1's into A bodies for a few years now. Never went that path because the Custom S I ended up purchasing works so well with all original parts it seemed like a crime to take a well running car and mess it up. Have a 2k camaro w a MN6 and 17000 miles on it. Tempted at one point to part swap the power train into the Pontiac but nixed that idea after getting a great education here at PY.

  #42  
Old 03-23-2008, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmy-ny
..... but nixed that idea after getting a great education here at PY.
Thanks for the compliment. I think it was a compliment...LOL...Not sure what you meant by the above statement. <shrug>

More progress over the weekend. I finished installing the Patriot Gold dual springs and hardened pushrods. I am pretty sure I went overkill on the springs, but I figure if I don't like this LS7 cam, I can just stab another one in it without having to worry about the springs.

Next I wanted to check the alignment of the Keisler bellhousing. I took the engine off the stand and placed the bellhousing against the block. Tick, tick, tick, tick...it was rocking back and forth. No good. I inspected it and it looks like someone dropped the bellhousing after it was machined. It put a slight dent on the corner and didn't allow the bellhousing to sit flat against the block. Little work with the file and it was good to go. This is a perfect example of why parts should be mocked up before installing them in the car. I may not have noticed this if I was on my back, under the car, trying to install it.

Next I wanted to check the alignment. I first measured the flatness. Very impressive, at .001".

Next I wanted to check the runout. I installed the dial indicator so it would ride on the inside of the bearing retainer register. This is what centers the transmission in the bellhousing. I set the indicator to zero.



Rotated the engine 90 degrees. Still zero. Good.



Rotated another 90 degrees. .005". Not bad.



Rotated another 90 degrees. .004". Great.



So the most the needle moved was .005". Divide that by 2 and you get total runout of .0025". Well under the recommended .005". Other than the minor issue with the bellhousing, I am pretty impressed.

Next it was time to see how the input shaft engages the pilot bearing. I am using a stock LS7 pilot bearing. I am happy with the engagement.



Then I wanted to install the clutch so that I can take some measurements for getting the right hydraulic throw out bearing. Everyone should have a nice clutch alignment took. This one is from Quarter Master and is way better than a plastic one.



There you have it, clutch and bellshousing installed. I am using a stock LS7 clutch on an LS2 flywheel. Heavy, but it will drive great. The distance from the clutch fingers to the outside of the bellhousing was 3.25". I will elaborate on why that's important later.



I used some high temp "cast aluminum" paint to add a little detail to the valve covers.



Time to start working on the car and get it ready for the engine. I want to redo some of the wiring as well as some of the fuel lines in the engine compartment.

Andrew

  #43  
Old 03-26-2008, 10:48 PM
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Today I got a few more pieces of the puzzle. I was exploring the Keisler website and I looked in the "clutch actuation" section. Their hydraulic kit seemed like exactly what I was looking for. I only got the partial kit that does not include the hydraulic throwout bearing. Keisler is in the market of selling Tremec transmissions, so the TOB is designed to mount on a TKO. I have a Richmond, so I will connect the dots from the MC. Looks like a quality piece and exactly what I need. The MC has a 3/4" bore and a travel of 1.5". That should make just about any hydraulic bearing puke its guts, so I will have to mock everything up and make sure that the bearing is not being over extended.



I also ordered a Quarter Master street throw out bearing.

http://www.racingclutches.com/produc...=53&cat_key=89

If anyone wants to convert the mechanical linkage to hydraulic, this setup should work great with a Muncie, T10, Saginaw, lots of transmissions.

Andrew

  #44  
Old 03-28-2008, 08:39 PM
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Today I got some more parts for the swap. I got a starter, power steering pump, and a bunch of little parts to complete my accessory drive system. What I have here is basically the C5/C6 layout.



I also received the GM Performance Parts harness and ECU package. Pretty good value when you consider that it is very complete. It comes with a big relay center and an auxiliary fuse panel that needs to be mounted somewhere. Its fairly ugly so I don't really know where I am going to put it yet.

Andrew

  #45  
Old 03-29-2008, 10:48 AM
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The benefits of being a bachelor and living alone include being able to have a bunch of car parts in the living room and not hearing "THE DISPOSAL IS CLOGGED!!!" LOL

Besides the engine swap I am doing some suspension mods. I already have some coilovers in the front. The springs in the front are 550 lb/inch. They were marginal with the big block. I think they will work very well with the L92, so for now I am not messing with them. In the rear I currently have some springs that I got way back in the day, from HO Racing.

Who remembers them? If you do, your old!!!

I wanted the ability to adjust the ride height in the rear and more importantly have the ability to properly set the corner weights once the car is done. There are all kinds of solutions to accomplish this, I chose a very nice product from Budzter:

https://www.budzter.com/index.html

Not cheap, but the quality is outstanding and it is a true bolt on. No hacking of the rear is required and its fully reversible. I like that. The spring is 9.5" tall, 175 lb/inch from the Coleman Racing catalog.



Andrew

  #46  
Old 03-31-2008, 12:20 PM
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I got my Vette regulator/filter combo the other day. There are many ways to make it work in custom applications. I chose to go to the local hydraulic supply store and get some fittings. The compression fittings were about $12 bucks for the pair. Steel, made by Eaton. Dorman and autoparts stores can officially kiss my ass. The little tube in the picture was 16 bucks. Grrr....



Andrew

  #47  
Old 03-31-2008, 08:02 PM
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It seems that just when you think something will only take a short time, the bottom falls out. I got the fittings this morning and got under the car. It's a good thing the rear end was out, because I am not sure if I could have done this with the rear end installed. That also makes me worried that it might be hard to get to the filter for maintenance, but I will cross that bridge when the time comes.

So here is the final installation. It was a little challenging because I didn't have quite enough room. There were some existing lines that I wanted to reuse and this is the best layout that I could come up with.



Andrew

  #48  
Old 03-31-2008, 09:36 PM
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Looks like your making progress!...that filter/regulator is what solved the fuel psi. problem on my friends street rod...runs great now. Only he paid big bucks for it from an online street/perfromance site...could have got the same filter/reg from napa for just over 20.00!
Where is the 16.00 Tube going?...up at the engine?

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  #49  
Old 03-31-2008, 11:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrenchmen
Looks like your making progress!...that filter/regulator is what solved the fuel psi. problem on my friends street rod...runs great now. Only he paid big bucks for it from an online street/perfromance site...could have got the same filter/reg from napa for just over 20.00!
Where is the 16.00 Tube going?...up at the engine?
I was thinking of getting the car done in time for Year One. We'll see how it goes. I got that filer/regulator from rockauto.com. It's an AC Delco and I think it was about $40. The $16 piece got cut down to about 2 inches and its in the outlet of the pump. On the left in the picture. It goes into a 3/8 x 1/2 compression union. I already a 1/2" stainless hard line going to the engine bay.

Andrew

  #50  
Old 03-31-2008, 11:34 PM
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I also got the got the Quarter Master "street" hydraulic bearing today. Remember how I said in a previous post that the clutch fingers are 3.25" away from the face of the bellhousing? We this is where that dimension is critical. The bearing has to be shimmed so that it is .100"-.150" from the clutch fingers. The shims go between the bearing retainer and the bearing and move it closer to the clutch fingers. I have mine set with a .090" gap. Tighter than what is recommended, but I am comfortable with it. The gap is needed because as the clutch wears, the spring fingers will move back towards the bearing. If there is no gap, the spring fingers will start to press against the bearing and there is the potential for clutch slippage due to decreased spring pressure.



Andrew

  #51  
Old 04-01-2008, 11:25 PM
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So tonight I tackled the installation of the Keisler clutch master kit. Overall I am pretty pleased with this setup. I had to clearance a small section of the mounting plate to clear the steering column, however that is no fault of the product. As I recall, my steering column is a hair over to the left. I did that so the steering shaft would clear the headers. The notch is minor as you can see in the picture:



The rod from the MC to the pedal makes a straight shot and fits well. I did have to remove the little bracket that held my backup light switch, so I will have to figure out something else for that.



Once everything was installed I wanted to test how far my throw out bearing would move with the full travel of the clutch pedal. This is important because moving the bearing past a certain point will cause it to leak and possibly get damaged. So I connected a long hard line to the MC and ran it to the outside of the car. Connected my Quarter Master release bearing, and bled the system.



It turned out that the bearing moved about .610" with the full stroke of the clutch pedal. This is perfect considering that the max travel on this bearing is about .650". The net step will be to see how well the bearing releases the clutch. Tomorrow I will bolt everything together and mock it up outside the car. This seems like a lot of work, but it sure beats taking everything apart after the fact.

Andrew

  #52  
Old 04-03-2008, 12:13 AM
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Today I wanted to finalize the clutch hydraulics and confirm that everything will work. So I bled the clutch. I know that there are numerous methods out there, as well as all kinds of tools. My favorite solo bleeding method is still the "clear bottle with a tube" method.



Remember that bleeding hydraulics is not about pressure. There is no need to pump the pedal as hard and fast as you can. The goal is to displace air and replace it with fluid. Gently moving fluid through the system does just that, without aerating the fluid.

Once the hydraulics were free of air I was able to press on the clutch pedal to see what was happening at the bearing. The nice thing about doing this outside of the car is that I am able to look through the clutch fork hole and see exactly what is happening inside the bellhousing. I discovered that the fittings on the side of the throw out bearing were touching the clutch pressure plate. The LS7 clutch spring fingers sit a good ways down when the pressure place is bolted to the flywheel. So the solution was to press the bearing off the piston and put some shims behind it. This way there is more space between the body of the bearing and the face of the bearing. Hard to imagine what I am talking about.

Here is the bearing at rest, with the shims already installed.



Here is the bearing at full release.



The pedal is firmer than I expected, but the release is super smooth. So much better than the mechanical bearing with the z-bar. I would recommend this mod to anyone, regardless of engine choice.

Andrew

  #53  
Old 04-06-2008, 10:57 PM
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Today I worked on the rear end. I degreased it and gave it a rattle can make over. Along with the cosmetic touch up I installed new upper control arm bushings and finished up the installation of the weight jacks.



If anyone else is using these weight jacks, I would highly recommend painting them. They are steel with a black oxide coating. I already saw signs of surface rust after sitting in the garage for only 2 weeks.





Tomorrow the rear end will get plugged back in and I will start on the wiring. With any luck, the engine will be going in next weekend.

Andrew

  #54  
Old 04-07-2008, 01:21 AM
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I have to ask, why not a Pontiac engine? You car is nice, but do you absolutely don't like Pontiac engines for some reason?

  #55  
Old 04-07-2008, 09:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goquick
I have to ask, why not a Pontiac engine? You car is nice, but do you absolutely don't like Pontiac engines for some reason?
It is my preference to have an engine that has:

An aluminum block and heads
Deep skirt block with 6 bolt main caps
Roller cam
Heads that flow over 300cfm unported
o-rings on every mating surface
Serpentine drive accessories
Composite intake manifold
EFI

The list of feature go on and on.

Andrew

  #56  
Old 04-07-2008, 10:28 AM
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Why didnt you use Keisler's release bearing? Just curious.

  #57  
Old 04-07-2008, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matrix
Why didnt you use Keisler's release bearing? Just curious.
The Keisler bearing is designed specifically for the TKO 500/600 transmission. It replaces the entire input shaft bearing retainer assembly. I am using the Richmond 6spd transmission so I needed something a little more universal.

Andrew

  #58  
Old 04-09-2008, 11:02 PM
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The rear end is back in the car and the spring adjusters work great. Here is what the spring looks like at the new ride height.



The old ride height was 28" to the top of the wheel well opening. The new rise height is 26". This is as low as I am going to go. As you can see there is not much room between the axle tubes and the exhaust. The 2" drop makes a huge impact in terms of looks. I have tall, 28", tires and now they are tucked up inside the wheel well.

Andrew

  #59  
Old 04-12-2008, 01:53 PM
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It is amazing what difference 2" in ride height makes. The rear seems to sit so much lower now. I am sure part of this is due to the fact that I have tall tires and now they looked tucked inside the wheel well.



Andrew

  #60  
Old 04-16-2008, 05:46 PM
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I have been working on getting the wiring sorted out. The GMPP harness has three huge connectors that go to the ECU. In order to fit them through the firewall I would need at least a 3" hole. There is already a 2" hole in the firewall so I wanted to see if I could somehow feed the harness through it. The only way to do that was to start feeding the harness from the inside. With some effort I was able to feed it through. However the huge relay center was not going to make it. So I cut the wires to the relay center. It's no big deal since I will most likely have to lengthen that harness anyway. I would like to mount the relay center on the radiator support so it will not be so visible.

I also fixed some wiring oddities that were done by a shop that did the wiring during the original build. Odd things, like having wires that went from the bulkhead connector fed through the firewall then back out through the firewall, and back to the backup switch. Who does that s**t?

Another thing that I will have to do is get a different pedal. The one that is included with the GMPP harness kit is just plain awful. It is big, and huge, and ugly, and pretty much looks like it's made for semi truck. I think a pedal from a Corvette or a Chevy Malibu might work much better. Maybe a quick trip to the dealership is in order. LOL

Andrew

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