[racerboy]

Not sure if this question belongs here or the Bodywork forum, but am I correct in my understanding that all the Norwood cars had a red-oxide underbody? And if so, is it possible to replicate that look in a car that is already finished?


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[keith k]

Yes. It was an electro-coat primer dip process, and the whole bodyshell was submerged in the tank. So everywhere on the car that didn't receive some other subsequent paint coat will be coated with it (inside the doors, bottom side of roof, inside of firewall, etc.). The bolt-on front end sheetmetal (hood, fenders, front valance, core support...) did not get dipped.

It would not be easy to correctly replicate the look without removing a lot of parts to do the painting, since the red oxide went on before any other external or interior parts were attached. You might be able to do some masking. But most of the time when people try to replicate it on an assembled car, it's fairly obvious. Like on this car:
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...rd-trans-am-5/

[racerboy]

Thanks Keith!


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[1965gp]

I still think it looks cool as it was done on that car. I painted the bottom of my 72 with Eastwood rust encapsulator and it was almost an exact match to the factory paint.

What makes it obvious on this blue 71 TA? Curious if I made the same mistakes.

Also mine did not come out as red or as glossy as the BAT car, but seemed to match what was already on the car

[Ramairnacho]

Those bottoms look good to me. Are you going to drive the car or hang in? If bottom coated and no rust great.im thinking of rust proof protection over the whole bottom. Primer wears out but matte red last longer or a red color rubber spray. I'm thinking beyond factory specs. Powder coating rear end too and possibly frame. A fellow member powder coated the doors before paint to protect them from the moister. It's difficult to imagine restoring this again in future. But dont get me wrong I like the red under coating

['ol Pinion head]

Originally Posted by keith k

?... It would not be easy to correctly replicate the look without removing a lot of parts to do the painting, since the red oxide went on before any other external or interior parts were attached. You might be able to do some masking. But most of the time when people try to replicate it on an assembled car, it's fairly obvious. Like on this car:
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...rd-trans-am-5/

One of first things I noticed on that auction. Been blessed to have taken apart enough original Norwood builds & taken a bunch of notes.

['ol Pinion head]

Originally Posted by Ramairnacho

Those bottoms look good to me. Are you going to drive the car or hang in? If bottom coated and no rust great.im thinking of rust proof protection over the whole bottom. Primer wears out but matte red last longer or a red color rubber spray. I'm thinking beyond factory specs. Powder coating rear end too and possibly frame. A fellow member powder coated the doors before paint to protect them from the moister. It's difficult to imagine restoring this again in future. But dont get me wrong I like the red under coating

Primer, as in original red oxide dip tank primer has held up for 5+ decades on the undersides of tons of F-body's & Novas. As Keith mentions, not the easiest finish to replicate. Too red, too shiny, crisp (taped off) rocker pinch welds, no overspray pattern of body color, often looks contrived/ poor execution. Only rubberized undercoating from factory was typically a stripe covering the seam sealer line in the rear wheel houses & occasionally splattered back onto the trunk drops. Not even going there on powdercoating.

[Formulabruce]

Having done a few, and tried a bunch of options, I offer this.
1. Lost a drive shaft in an original primer Formula. This scratched up the original primer. The Red Eastwood rust encapsulator is extremely close and would not hesitate to use it on a nice driver over a very clean surface. I used this product and I like it. You wash it and holds up well.
2. To correctly duplicate the original e coat lacquer I use
DP 74LF. this is a Ditzler Epoxy primer. For shade correction you need to consider the year of your Norwood car. As the years rolled by and even though new paint was added, the tank got dirty. And the paint got a bit darker.
Your 1970 are the brightest, and gets more red in 71, and stays that way till about 74, when it shows to be browner looking. By end of tank life in 1978 it was just about all brown.
To darken, mix in some DP90LF ( black) with the DP74, doesn't take much, do a spray out. Most All your 90+ point Birds are now done this way. This IS Fact.
The final product is much more durable than the factory and has a 90% to original shine.
I have clear coated over this on some cars for added durability.
You do NOT need undercoating.
If you see what looks like factory undercoating Inside your shell, its NOT, its sound deading..
All undercoating was done at dealer at extra cost.
Our Pontiac dealer used "Quaker Koat" .

[Ramairnacho]

Thanks I'm sending my car out for body work. Yes I need floor pans both front and trunk, plus dash vin pad and got little rust under vinyl top . I hope that can spray it if not I can do that at home. I like the idea like formula Bruce said about clear for extra protection

[jhein]

There are lots of elements to an authentic look but the overspray pattern of the body color is important. Otherwise it looks redone.

[Formulabruce]

While very true, many that spend money on the underside, want it backtapped at the rockers..

[dld]

i did my car in PPGLF74 epoxy and clearcoated with a urethane clear with a little flatting agent . Pictures make color off a little also the gloss is affected .

last pic is of o.e. color found under the chalk

as Forumalbruce said adding a little black my be necessary

[dld]

pic

[jhein]

Originally Posted by dld

i did my car in PPGLF74 epoxy and clearcoated with a urethane clear with a little flatting agent . Pictures make color off a little also the gloss is affected .

last pic is of o.e. color found under the chalk

as Forumalbruce said adding a little black my be necessary

Your pictures have given me exhaust-pipe-envy. Although my Pypes X-pipe system has been delivered.

[Ramairnacho]

What is the important of overspray on the underneath of the car is this for car that you probably will sell I don't get it

[keith k]

Originally Posted by dld

pic

Good reference pictures for the factory overspray of topcoat color on the underbody.

[jhein]

Originally Posted by Ramairnacho

What is the important of overspray on the underneath of the car is this for car that you probably will sell I don't get it

That was just the way they were originally. The bodies obviously had to be primed/dipped first.

Then, when they sprayed, the body color, especially the rockers, the overspray got on the underside.

As Formulabruce says, you'd have to intentionally take steps to make it not happen. I can understand someone wanting that look, but I don't prefer it.

[Formulabruce]

Here is a '70 Formula 4 speed shell I painted. Pretty much Red everywhere as dipped. yes it had side moldings I took off. DP74LF epoxy.
I did clear coat this with semi gloss later. My buddy Does want the rockers "Back-Taped" with NO overspray. Thats his preference.

[Formulabruce]

Here is another Formula ( automatic) I did, Dustless blasted first. This one got Gloss clear eventually, More DP74LF epoxy