[bird72]

At first I thought this was the black restored one that has been on this site. This is a driver grade one, as they say.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/12510867303...8AAOSwDUpgnqx6

['ol Pinion head]

Been listed on eBay for nearly the last 2 years. Heavy loaded car with interesting history.
Going to need expensive metal work in the rear frame rails. How extensive the rust (?)

[johnta1]

Originally silver exterior.

[njsteve]

This is a very important car in terms of Firebird lore. It is THE car that saved the Firebird from cancellation. Pontiac General manager Jim McDonanld had his mind made up to cancel the Firebird in 1972. No one could convince him otherwise.

That was until his conspiratorial underlings pulled a car off the line (that was coded to be Revere Silver) and then had it painted black and made with a ton of options. McDonald was known to only drive black cars and when he was "stuck" with this car as his new company car in January 1972 he actually liked it so much he decided not to cancel the Firebird.

If any second gen Firebird desrves a full restoration to factory original, this would be it. It's a piece of history.


BTW, the "other" black car was a Canada sold car and was my old one that I sold to BentwheelBob in 2013 who then restored it beyond all imagining, into a piece of historical art. In a new owner's hands, it eventually sold for $165,000 at Mecum 2020 as lot# S104 but for some reason is not on the site anymore. Here's the "other" black car when I owned it in 2012 and when BentwheelBob took it over in 2013 and went crazy on the restoration. When I had it, I had the frame repairs done to start things off. The ebay car needs all the work that was done to "our" Canada black car and then some. But it does have its original born-with drivetrain (though the trans VIN is one digit higher - "172" instead of "171" - obviously a factory oops)

My thread: http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=695444

BentwheelBob's thread: http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=736820

[71GP76TA]

Whole back half looks like a bondo sculpture... Super nice cool car otherwise..

[tininjun68]

Originally Posted by njsteve

This is a very important car in terms of Firebird lore. It is THE car that saved the Firebird from cancellation. Pontiac General manager Jim McDonanld had his mind made up to cancel the Firebird in 1972. No one could convince him otherwise.

That was until his conspiratorial underlings pulled a car off the line (that was coded to be Revere Silver) and then had it painted black and made with a ton of options. McDonald was known to only drive black cars and when he was "stuck" with this car as his new company car in January 1972 he actually liked it so much he decided not to cancel the Firebird.

If any second gen Firebird desrves a full restoration to factory original, this would be it. It's a piece of history.


BTW, the "other" black car was a Canada sold car and was my old one that I sold to BentwheelBob in 2013 who then restored it beyond all imagining, into a piece of historical art. In a new owner's hands, it eventually sold for $165,000 at Mecum 2020 as lot# S104 but for some reason is not on the site anymore. Here's the "other" black car when I owned it in 2012 and when BentwheelBob took it over in 2013 and went crazy on the restoration. When I had it, I had the frame repairs done to start things off. The ebay car needs all the work that was done to "our" Canada black car and then some. But it does have its original born-with drivetrain (though the trans VIN is one digit higher - "172" instead of "171" - obviously a factory oops)

My thread: http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=695444

BentwheelBob's thread: http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=736820

WOW, that is such a great story that I've never heard before even though I've read about McDonald's 'notorious' instincts on how to 'improve' PMD, like downgrading base engine sizes.

[RicksGTO]

Here's a screen capture combining Steve and Bob's black 455HO car and a Mecum Indy 2020 Formula 400.

[Formulabruce]

Originally Posted by RicksGTO

Here's a screen capture combining Steve and Bob's black 455HO car and a Mecum Indy 2020 Formula 400.

That 400 car is from NH /Mass and I know the guy who finished it.
The "black" car on ebay will need a good 80K + of work if sent out, if the body was all solid maybe 50K would get it where it should be, Plus assembly. But what then, send it to the museum with the other black Formula ( 1970)? I am glad mine is up on a lift. If I had to see it every day and was scared to drive it, it would be Gone, like Bobs.
since we are posting pics... , And its Wintah" Mine isn't worth much either, before the gasping , but It is from Escondido.

[chuckies76ta]

Beautiful car..

[bird72]

I enjoyed Bobs thread on resto. He went to nth degree and it paid off on concours rating if I remember right. Since I choose real estate as an investment, I look at these cars as ROI also. I can't help but wonder, at a 165K sale, what payoff there is, even on the super rare ones like his, for the zillion hours and I believe Bob contracted out a lot of work also. It makes me sad to see one done and beautiful and then poof, gone to a new future of non use, or just disappear. I think Bob even said the process is his joy, so not dissing him. It was a fantasy watching his process. But I am feeling ever strongly these cars are not a great investment. It is about loving them.

[nas t eh]

The only people making money restoring cars are the guys who charge by the hour .

[njsteve]

Originally Posted by bird72

I enjoyed Bobs thread on resto. He went to nth degree and it paid off on concours rating if I remember right. Since I choose real estate as an investment, I look at these cars as ROI also. I can't help but wonder, at a 165K sale, what payoff there is, even on the super rare ones like his, for the zillion hours and I believe Bob contracted out a lot of work also. It makes me sad to see one done and beautiful and then poof, gone to a new future of non use, or just disappear. I think Bob even said the process is his joy, so not dissing him. It was a fantasy watching his process. But I am feeling ever strongly these cars are not a great investment. It is about loving them.

Between what Bob had in his ultimate restoration and what I had in the initial phase of the restoration (drivetrain refurbishment and rear frame rail replacement) that $165K auction price wouldn't even cover half of the total amount of money invested in the Canadian Black car.

I enjoy doing my own work, and like Bob, I enjoy the journey more than the destination.

I did all the greasy stuff myself but contracted out the rear frame rail replacement...at an hourly rate/body shop prison type place. That was why I never went the full distance and had the body and paint done - I just could not find anyone I trusted in my area. I will never use a restoration shop that I can't drive to and pop in for a progress inspection. If it's more than an hour or so away, I won't risk it.