[marauder]

Now that I look very closely I see that the rear left of the car is sitting just a little lower than the right and the opposite holds true in the front. Being concerned I checked with a body shop and they said the car doesn't show any signs of being hit and that the frame and everything looks just fine.....

What else could cause this?

[mchell]

Welcome to the Pontiac coil spring shuffle. I went thru the same thing on my 71. Installed a new set of moogs, car sat to high like yours. Let them settle in for two years, no change. Put a new set of car quest brand springs, same thing, to high. Took those out. Cut one full coil off the first set of moogs, car sits perfect. I always had a 1/4" to 1/2" ride height difference from left to right which I could never get rid of. I will eventually put a spacer in one side to cure this.

I can do a set of front coils with my eyes closed now........practice makes perfect.

[mchell]

Oh, check out the 14x7 rally post, shows my cars stance.

good luck

[marauder]

Gotta admit, I was rather worried when I could not get the car to sit right from front to back/side to side so I decided to have the frame checked out at a local Pontiac dealer.

They put it on the rack (2 Hrs) and then wanted another 3 hours to inspect it. This sounds like a rather long inspection to me but I wanted it checked out and compared to factory specs so I ante'd up the $200.

The news I got was good. The frame is within 5mm of spec at the most, and more commonly 2 to 3 mm. They explained to me that back in '69 it was acceptable to be within 12mm. The frame was never tweaked or re-straighted.

The problem they said is that the right front spring is not seated properly.

Now I can handle that! Don't know if this will be legible however here are the frame specs and measurements.

[marauder]

I ordered the Hotchkis 1916F springs for the front. These are their "big block" springs which they tell me will lower the front of my Goat 1".

I'll post pics in a couple days.

[Ken K]

When you get those springs, Can you measure the wire diameter with some calipers and measure the spring height before they are installed?

[marauder]

I don't have calipers but I might be able to improvise.

Are you building a database?!

[Ken K]

Yes, I need the 1916F springs for my data base. Can you also see if it appears the coils are spaced the same as the front springs that came out of your car?

[JamesR913]

Ok I am kinda new to classic car tech talk but i know a little bit about cars. I have always heard that it is not good to cut springs because it will change the spring rate if not done right etc... That it will give you a very bouncy ride if the springs are cut. I have always heard that about smaller car like Honda's and Toyota's. When I was lowering my Lexus IS300 everyone said not to cut so I am just curious is this something that would be "ok" for my 66 GTO??

[Ken K]

The spring rate does change. The shorter the spring, the higher the rate if they use the same wire diameter. You can also go to a smaller wire diamter and cut a coil and end up with about the same rate as a taller spring with a larger wire diameter.

[marauder]

The front springs take some work to replace unlike the rear ones so I decided not to mess around by cutting or heating the existing springs to alter thier characteristics. Some of they other guys might be able to elaborate on the effects of that.

I guess I just hate doing things more than once

When I was younger I bought a used TH350 tranny from a junkyard for $65 and spent money on seals, filter, etc as well as entire day to find out that the tranny didn't have a 2nd gear once it was installed so I had to do it again. I just hate that.

[Ken K]

This is an example of 2 different springs with the same rate....The #5400 is a common 68-72 GTO spring, it has a .660 wire diameter, has a free standing height of 17.004 inches and is rated at 360 psi...The #5398 spring has a .650 wire diamter, has a free standing height of 16.127 inches and is rated at 362 psi.

[mchell]

My experience is this: I expect to do things twice with many aftermarket parts I buy for my GTO. Fact of life when working on an old car that someone is trying to repo parts for. Few vendors put the time and effort into the R&D required to get the parts to fit perfectly, and who can blame them as many would not be as willing to spend the dollars needed to get that perfect fit. So we plod along doing things once, twice and sometimes three times to get our cars together right. Frustrating at times. I for one would be willing to spend more on a part knowing it would fit correctly the first time.

[marauder]

Car looks great! Any issues with the 245/60-15s rubbing during sharp, hard turns?

[mchell]

nope, no problems with the tires. I run a 4.5" backspace in the front and a 5" backspace on the rear.......perfect fit, in my opinion.

Oh, and a little note on the rims and doing things twice. I order the rims, they ship 3 with the proper bolt circle, the 4th one has a 5" bolt circle which doesnt fit. Called Wheel Specialties and they plead insanity and send me the correct 4 3/4" pattern. Get the new one, mount the tire again and find that the new one has a pin hole in the rim and leaks air....sh@$. Take the tire off, find the hole, call back, they are done producing that rim. I spot weld the pin hole and grind down, remount the tire and it works. Problem is that while taking the tire off for the third time the bead breaker slips and hits the chrome on the rim and puts a small ding in it. I call and try to explain this. To wheel specialtis credit they say they will rechrome the rim at no cost but I will have to send to them at my expense.

anyways, another example of doing things thrice.

[marauder]

I received the front springs today and borrowed a micrometer and measured the thickness to be .714" and the height is 15".

They are rated at 500 lb/in.

The springs are powdercoated gray which may add to the thickness.

I'm installing them tomorrow and will let you know how it goes and post a pic. Hopefully this will end my ride height saga!

Ken - do those measurements make sense to you?

[marauder]

Hey, whats the deal with that rating column? 4 checks, I guess that means some people are finding this helpful...

[Ken K]

If you go back to the first page of this thread. You will see one of the first springs I mentioned was the #5536, it's rated at 488 psi and and has a 15.063 free standing height. If that spring drops your front end too low then the #5450 is the spring. A big block weighs more than a Pontiac engine so your front end will sit higher than it would using a big block.

[marauder]

Yeah I bet I could have saved a few bucks if I selected the proper Moog springs. These were $149 however the guy at Hotchkis seemed fairly certian that this "big block" spring would drop it 1" and said the the small block/Pontiac 400 spring would drop it closer to 2".

I was willing to pay the extra mula based on his experience, besides these are powder coated!

At least the rear springs were like $50.

[Ken K]

Now everyone knows which springs will work. Can you measure the distance between the wheel openings and the tires, before and after?....That combination can now be reproduced for about $110-120.00.