[400 4spd.]

Originally Posted by Ccass

It's totally OK that these posts are being made. That's what this forum area is for.

I find it very interesting to see the different perspectives readers have on our marketing efforts. Many times we adjust after reading the comments. Its all good. :)

I have looked at both sets through the online catalog. IMO, the Cragars look pretty good. I wouldn't mind a set of those on my Grand Prix. One thing that jumped out at me in the $2100+ Hurst Wheel ad was the tag at the bottom about the wheels being on indefinite back order as of 3/16/05. Is that still true 8 years later?

[Jim Zeek]

69 gto

[Ram4king]

Imo These wheels I have are much closer to the hurst design. Company named Intro made them and the cap decals are custom..I love these wheels...Look at them next to my originals.

[rohrt]

Originally Posted by Ram4king

Imo These wheels I have are much closer to the hurst design. Company named Intro made them and the cap decals are custom..I love these wheels...Look at them next to my originals.

These Hurst (style) wheels are really starting to grow on me. That wheel in the second pic looks very nice. What is the name of that one? Vista?

[Ccass]

That is a nice looking wheel. A lot of their wheels are really nice. We'll look into a price point and ability to use the original Hurst center cap.

[The Boss]

Originally Posted by rohrt

These Hurst (style) wheels are really starting to grow on me. That wheel in the second pic looks very nice. What is the name of that one? Vista?

Made by Intro http://www.introwheels.com/ but to Chris's point they are within a $100 or $200 of the Hurst reproductions in the catalog.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Not that Cragar isn't an excellent company from wayyyyy back-
but these wheels having CRAGAR engraved on the exterior is a deal breaker.

Deal breaker as in if going for a Hurst look-a-like and using Hurst Caps on them.
..... for most enthusiasts .
Lots of wheel options today in the $900 range or less.
Fakes are Fakes - but you don't want it spelled out in plain view. lol

Even on the CRAGAR web site , can barely see the markings.
Would be easy to miss it in their picture if you weren't expecting.

i too would be Terribly disappointed when i opened the first box , if i had no idea to expect the bold engraving to be there in a visible location.
No matter where they came from.

Not saying no other wheel does this now , just haven't seen it before.
None of the other look-a-likes do it tho.
Would never have any idea to expect that.
Otherwise they do look good.

If not for the Logo issue - these would be a really big hit.
And would need no apology if the name brand appeared any where else besides where they put it.

The Logo is going to block about 65-75% of potential market from making the purchase of the PY package. *imo*

i understand the marketing protocol about keeping Cragar out of the ad campaign.
And even then , by the time a guy bought new Hurst caps and hardware - then paid himself or someone to make the mods for them to fit - he'd probably be in the same price point as he would if he just ordered them from PY ready to install.

If PY could make a deal with them for exclusive distributorship rights of the same wheels made without the Logo - they would be a Super Hot item .
And it wouldn't matter if you disclosed the manufacturer after that - that disclosure would actually be a benefit - Cragar is a trusted known brand from way back .

Win / Win / Win

Would look even better if the insets of side spokes were painted like the McCoys .

[The Boss]

IDK Todd, Jim's Dad's car looks pretty sweet and considering the money saved probably paid for the paint they used on it I'd say it's an excellent choice for those without an extra G to spend and who have already decided they aren't going with the originals.

[Ccass]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

Not that Cragar isn't an excellent company from wayyyyy back-
but these wheels having CRAGAR engraved on the exterior is a deal breaker.

The Logo is going to block about 65-75% of potential market from making the purchase of the PY package. *imo*


Would look even better if the insets of side spokes were painted like the McCoys .

Wow, if you are right about the percentage, then I really missed the boat on this one. Up close, without the logo, yo can clearly see it is NOT a Hurst wheel. So I fail to see why that small logo would matter although I personally just don't like logos on products in general.

I like the idea of painting or brushing or bead blasting the side spokes

Here's a question.....what if the little logo had said HURST instead of CRAGAR?

[GT182]

Originally Posted by Ccass

Here's a question.....what if the little logo had said HURST instead of CRAGAR?

That would be much better all the way around. But.. would Hurst approve that seeing they don't make the wheel? If the wheels were really made by Hurst then you would probably would sell more of them.

My thought is Baron VZ pretty much hit the nail on the head. You think you're getting a Hurst, by Hurst, wheel but you ain't. That's like buying a Rembrant painting thinking it's the real deal by him, only to find out it was done by Grandma Moses. Not kosher at all.

Truth in advertising counts big time. It makes or brakes a business.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by GT182

My thought is Baron VZ pretty much hit the nail on the head. You think you're getting a Hurst, by Hurst, wheel but you ain't.

noooo

Fully aware they are not Hurst products - and ad says they are aftermarket.
No problem with that part .

I'm just agreeing with original poster Wtabi about the shock factor when opening the box. Deal Breaker for me completely - especially if i had ordered them online without any clue they would boldly say CRAGAR on the exterior.

i'd be asking for full refund and expect shipping both ways to be refunded.
bum deal
Or driving down to Charlotte for a full refund including shipping.
another bum deal - because i dont have plans to go there.
And Chris probably wouldn't be thrilled about eating any of the shipping - or maybe even wouldn't do it.
Nobody would be happy .
Just being completely honest here.

Without that clue - i think these wheels are going to cause a lot of problems to the unsuspecting , and this thread has its merits.

Originally Posted by Ccass

Wow, if you are right about the percentage, then I really missed the boat on this one.

I like the idea of painting or brushing or bead blasting the side spokes

Not saying the boat is missed - completely .
But i do agree with Htabi about this detail .
Guys who just want a chrome wheel will buy about anything .
And those probably don't even care so much about a Hurst center cap on these or not.
Seasoned shoppers are going to hunt that wheel out for comparison anyway - sooner or later the cat is coming out of the bag .
Likely sooner , than later.
Well ... its already loose .

Guys who want a Hurst look-a-like , with a Hurst cap , and pay extra for all that - are going to be deeply saddened by the CRAGAR logo on the exterior.
Due to pre-emptive image , and not being advised otherwise.
Online with these , as they are pictured , i see a problem.

In person purchases- all is well and good .

And i realize stating " these are aftermarket - the aftermarket manufacturers Logo appears visibly on the exterior and is not easily removable "
-- will lead to --
" Hello PY , what is the Logo , send me a picture of it , etc ... "
and the cat is out of the bag again , per se' .

i do see strong market potential for these wheels - even at 200-300-400 more per set than currently advertised. But the Logo has to disappear - and do the insets and lug webs in contrast like the McCoys .

i think they would sell like crazy in that condition at that price level.

IF you can test your market - at minimum - by doing a set or singles somehow without the Logo . That would tell .
And i don't mean just putting a sticker or emblem over the Logo .
Talking about them being right .

Take them and display at the upcoming shows .

CRAGAR style

Non-Logo style

Non-Logo style , with insets and webs done in contrast

and price each level accordingly.

Bet that you'll get 10 : 1 orders for Non-Logo versions - versus Cragar Logo .
Maybe even 10 : 0

IF you happen to ever decide to try this - let me know first, please.
i'd like a chance to sell my McCoys first.
Thanks :)

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by The Boss

IDK .... car looks

i can't give rebuttal on that because i'm too much of a gentleman - on the internet. :)

lol

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by Ccass

Here's a question.....what if the little logo had said HURST instead of CRAGAR?

If they could , or had to , emboss HURST right there .... then they could be called "new release / re-introduction / official Hurst II " and would probably sell like ice cream in the summer time.
With year round sales.

Does Cragar own the rights to Hurst ?

[Jim Zeek]

Originally Posted by The Boss

considering the money saved probably paid for the paint they used on it.

paint was paid for before the wheels. price wasn't a concern. have had numerous people comment on the wheels and how they resemble a hurst wheel and how good they look on the car. if you want hurst wheels then buck up and spend the $$$ for hurst wheels.

[goatless]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

If they could , or had to , emboss HURST right there .... then they could be called "new release / re-introduction / official Hurst II " and would probably sell like ice cream in the summer time.
With year round sales.

Does Cragar own the rights to Hurst ?

I take it you haven't seen these yet?

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Nope.

They look nice - other than i don't dig the painted spokes .
The Black ones look cheap done that way .

Deal Breaker - they're missing the boat and riding on the anchor.
No Paint on the Spoke Faces !

Price looks real fair tho.
But no 14"

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

My fault Goatless , i had seen those when all they had was a poorly simulated artist rendition .

They looked so hoaky in that drawing or whatever it was - i thought they were fake, or cheap shet, or just plain goofy.

Also didn't realize they were licensed/approved by Hurst either.
Your picture is a much better looking product.
They have better detail on the spoke than the Cragars too.

Wrong sizes and wrong colors for my money tho.
Still no deal.

Those in polished spoke 14" or maybe 15" - i would buy.
After selling what i already have .

[1beautifuldaughter]

All else aside,, I would just say the big name on the rim like that would also make me very sad upon opening a box, Bad idea on someones part. I bought some chrome lug nuts and they had a name and /or part number stamped into the side of every one, My exact words "Are You F'n Kidding Me?" And every time I wipe them off I say the same thing. They should have put there name in the inner rim,

[Ccass]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

If they could , or had to , emboss HURST right there .... then they could be called "new release / re-introduction / official Hurst II " and would probably sell like ice cream in the summer time.
With year round sales.

Does Cragar own the rights to Hurst ?

No, that was just a rhetorical question. But your answer tells me what I need to know about your priorities. You have placed a VERY high value on the Hurst name because when you pictured that same 'aftermarket' wheel with the Hurst logo in the same incorrect place as the Cragar logo was and the wheel appealed to you. I tend to think there would be a bunch that would agree with you. I personally would like that myself. Unfortunately, that isn't the case. So we're left with some limited options.

btw, that new Hurst wheel is also a very nice looking wheel imo and has that classic Hurst feel to it but with a modern flare. Very nice! But if I remember correctly, pretty expensive.

[Ccass]

[QUOTE=Baron Von Zeppelin;4889829]noooo

I'm just agreeing with original poster Wtabi about the shock factor when opening the box. Deal Breaker for me completely - especially if i had ordered them online without any clue they would boldly say CRAGAR on the exterior.

I can clearly now see that you and Wtabi are VERY loyal to the Hurst brand name and therefore, in a way, are offended that another company is copying, counterfeiting etc. these wheels. I can see how that makes it a deal breaker for each of you. I'll bet you also cringe and get pretty annoyed every time you read about a GTO clone as well. ;). That's certainly your opinion and you are not alone. But I checked sales history and we've sold 20 sets of these wheels since we put the kit together about 20 months ago. Not a single complaint or return. Even still, I'd bet that every one of those owners would have preferred to have there be no logo or the Hurst logo even though it still wouldn't make the wheel pass for a real Hurst wheel. That's a testimony to the Hurst brand name. But it appears that there are plenty of owners that are willing to look past the visible Cragar logo in favor of the classic Hurst look with the updated sizes and technology they offer. That's the very reason why we put together the package. Anyway, we're going to change our descriptions for these wheels to 'Hurst Style' wheels and we'll be including information about the CRAGAR logo. This way, there will be no chance of offending an unsuspecting Hurst fanatic.