[tom s]

Ken,would need to be custom,too narrow.That is what I wanted but trying to do on the cheap.Dont have the final deck yet.I need to fit the shim and check the clearance for the counter weights next.It will be in the 9.2ish range.Tom

[tom s]

I think Dave matched the flanges too his 260 CNC port job,maybe that helped with all the matching?Im sure you could contact him.Whne I get a chance I will take a pic of a gasket on the head and then on the intake.Tom

[twinturrbo406]

[QUOTE=77 TRASHCAN;4789688]Weak compared to a 400, 455, not knocking your incredible effort.

I was underwhelmed, finding out here, the the main webbing had been compromised also, to make this "transportaion" engine lighter...


... i'm afraid i disagree with that part, the 301T blocks are considerably more beefy than the std. 301 blocks, which is why they stopped making the std. blocks, too many issues ...

... as you can see, these blocks were in fact very nice castings, and my stroker 434/301T project has very thick mains, and is right with the thickest blocks Pontiac had made, at least the ones we've measured over the years, not saying its the thickest, but surely not the smallest ...

[tom s]

here are pics of intake and head port openings with std gasket and the RAIV gasket.Tom

[tom s]

few more

[KEN CROCIE]

looks like a 6" rodwill give a street worthy pin height. whats the big end width on a 301 rod?

[tom s]

I need stock pontiac rod width.BBC will work and 6.135 is the shortest I can find without a custom rod.I wanted a 6in like we used in the RA V build but have to compremise.Tom

[81TTA]

Thanks for the pictures of the manifold ports. Looks like some smoothing was done after the flanges were reattached?

I'm not sure if the Torker II came in versions without the exhaust crossover. It appears from one of your pictures that it's been milled off? I think it makes life a lot easier when the flange only needs to match up to the runners instead of trying to match up to the runners *and* the exhaust crossover.

Anyway, that manifold is sweet. Very nice work!

[tom s]

anything not needed was removed to make it easyer to do.Tom

[Tom Vaught]

Your engine should like that 950 3 BBL vacuum carb for the initial dyno runs.

Tom Vaught

[tom s]

Joe has a dyno Quickfuel he virtually always uses.Tom

[Dave Bisschop]

Tom let me know about this thread, when it comes to the intake I set up the intake in the CNC and separated the flanges by using a 3/4" end mill. I then milled them perfectly flat. I had Tom's block and bolted on a mock up set of heads with head gaskets and bolted the flanges to the heads without the intake gaskets which would give me about .060" to mill the flanges perfectly flat once all the welding was done.

From there I milled each side of the intake (or what was left of it!!). I tried using math, but basically it came down to trial and error fitting to get it where I was happy with it. The outside runners line up pretty reasonable but the inners required extensive welding to build up the material. It was definitely more time consuming than I had anticipated but part of the problem was dealing with the impurities that had been absorbed by the intake since it was used, anyone who's welded used cast aluminum will know what I'm talking about. Getting the exhaust crossover to work would have been difficult so Tom was ok with me removing it. Beyond all the welding there was a ton of diegrinding and sanding, but I'm kind of use to that!!

I think the end product turned out well and almost looks like it was cast that way.

Hopefully this answers some of the questions people have on what it took to modify the intake. It's not as simple as cutting the flanges off, removing about and inch worth of runner and welding it back together.

[tom s]

I did get some info on welding used castiron.I was told in the aircraft industry they dip the part to be welded in liquid nitrogine to clean clean it.FWIW,Tom

[BruceWilkie]

Originally Posted by 81TTA

Thanks for the pictures of the manifold ports. Looks like some smoothing was done after the flanges were reattached?

I'm not sure if the Torker II came in versions without the exhaust crossover. It appears from one of your pictures that it's been milled off? I think it makes life a lot easier when the flange only needs to match up to the runners instead of trying to match up to the runners *and* the exhaust crossover.

Anyway, that manifold is sweet. Very nice work!

All T2's come with ex crossover. You can eliminate it. you could also block exhaust (fill) and plumb the heat crossover for water if you really want/need heat in your manifold. If it dont clear the valley tray shrink it. Its not terribly difficult to cut the entire heated section off a t1, performer, rpm, t2, HSD etc.. Wouldnt be hard to make a new manifold heater with aluminum tubing if you really felt you had to have one.

The harder part is what Dave said ^^^^!!!

[J.C.you]

Originally Posted by Dave Bisschop

Tom let me know about this thread, when it comes to the intake I set up the intake in the CNC and separated the flanges by using a 3/4" end mill. I then milled them perfectly flat. I had Tom's block and bolted on a mock up set of heads with head gaskets and bolted the flanges to the heads without the intake gaskets which would give me about .060" to mill the flanges perfectly flat once all the welding was done.

From there I milled each side of the intake (or what was left of it!!). I tried using math, but basically it came down to trial and error fitting to get it where I was happy with it. The outside runners line up pretty reasonable but the inners required extensive welding to build up the material. It was definitely more time consuming than I had anticipated but part of the problem was dealing with the impurities that had been absorbed by the intake since it was used, anyone who's welded used cast aluminum will know what I'm talking about. Getting the exhaust crossover to work would have been difficult so Tom was ok with me removing it. Beyond all the welding there was a ton of diegrinding and sanding, but I'm kind of use to that!!

I think the end product turned out well and almost looks like it was cast that way.

Hopefully this answers some of the questions people have on what it took to modify the intake. It's not as simple as cutting the flanges off, removing about and inch worth of runner and welding it back together.

Dave, did you look into brand x manifolds as a possible easier way to fab an intake?

[65 tri-pwr]

Originally Posted by KEN CROCIE

looks like a 6" rodwill give a street worthy pin height. whats the big end width on a 301 rod?

I was also looking into doing this for my 1981 TTA. I have a 1977 350 crank and the counter weights look to clear the block with no problems. I gave up after seeing the issues with the thrust bearing and needing a shorter rod (I wanted to keep the stock heads and turbo set up). But I am starting to look at this again after seeing what Tom is doing.

Ken, you mention a shorter rod. Yes it is tough finding a rod under 6" with at least a .980" width big end. So far I found aftermarket rods for the Ford 2300 4cyl. (sportsman rods?) They come in different lengths. Another is AMC 290-360 rods. They have a 1.06" width big end and a bearing diameter of 2.095". The length of the AMC rods is 5.858" and a .930" pin diameter. Not sure if a stock Pontiac crank can be ground to a 2.095 rod journal safely.

[tom s]

there can be a issue with turning too small as to what happens to the oil holes.I have taken them to 2.10.Tom

[Dave Bisschop]

Originally Posted by J.C.you

Dave, did you look into brand x manifolds as a possible easier way to fab an intake?

J.C. I never really considered it since #2 cylinder is ahead of #1 to start with on a Pontiac and bore spacing and flange angles are all different as well, so I don't see any of them being an easier mod. then starting with a Pontiac "tall deck" intake.

[81TTA]

Originally Posted by Dave Bisschop

Tom let me know about this thread, when it comes to the intake I set up the intake in the CNC and separated the flanges by using a 3/4" end mill. I then milled them perfectly flat. I had Tom's block and bolted on a mock up set of heads with head gaskets and bolted the flanges to the heads without the intake gaskets which would give me about .060" to mill the flanges perfectly flat once all the welding was done.

From there I milled each side of the intake (or what was left of it!!). I tried using math, but basically it came down to trial and error fitting to get it where I was happy with it. The outside runners line up pretty reasonable but the inners required extensive welding to build up the material. It was definitely more time consuming than I had anticipated but part of the problem was dealing with the impurities that had been absorbed by the intake since it was used, anyone who's welded used cast aluminum will know what I'm talking about. Getting the exhaust crossover to work would have been difficult so Tom was ok with me removing it. Beyond all the welding there was a ton of diegrinding and sanding, but I'm kind of use to that!!

I think the end product turned out well and almost looks like it was cast that way.

Hopefully this answers some of the questions people have on what it took to modify the intake. It's not as simple as cutting the flanges off, removing about and inch worth of runner and welding it back together.

I guess part of the "problem" with making it look like it was originally cast that way is the fact it masks all the work you put into it! From the work I'd done on those manifolds, I thought there had to be quite a bit of effort put into getting the final product together. There just don't seem to be any manifolds with runners straight enough to allow the amount of material to be removed as is needed. By the time the material is removed, the cross section of the runner has changed enough the flanges no longer line up. I know what you mean about trying to weld the cast aluminum that's seen about every engine fluid in addition to paints/waxes/etc. Just tacking the flanges in a few spots was a nightmare.....

Again, very nice work! Thanks for the additional info.

[GregonVI]

Originally Posted by tom s

I need stock pontiac rod width.BBC will work and 6.135 is the shortest I can find without a custom rod.I wanted a 6in like we used in the RA V build but have to compremise.Tom

Would a rod from a 409 Chevy work? That engine has a 2.20" rod journal size and I believe the rod is 6.0" long.

http://www.show-cars.com/NewParts.htm

Greg