[steve]

Originally Posted by lust4speed

German Shepherds were originally herding dogs - or more generally working dogs. It takes a high degree of intelligence for a breed to do certain tasks, and these tasks can be anything from protection dogs to seeing eye dogs (never saw a Beagle as a seeing eye dog). No question that there are big lovable dogs around that are very low key and playful, and some are very intelligent. These are also the ones that are not only harmless, but will want to play ball with the bad guys.

Which brings up a story I have to tell. I had a customer that had a beautiful house up in the hills. He was robbed twice while he and his wife worked at their family business down in the city. He purchased two fully trained adult Dobermans and installed a 6' high security fence around the perimeter. One night a couple of months later they returned home and the gate was open, the front door of their house was open -- and every stick of furniture and clothing and wall coverings were gone - including the two dogs. So he was also out $10,000 worth of doggy protection. Locks and dogs only keep honest (or slightly dishonest) people away.

this just proves my point. the dog isnt going to keep you from getting robbed in many situations. MANY owners (not the ones in this thread) fail to properly train their "working" dogs correctly and they can be a time bomb. a lot of these owners (and their neighbors) would have been better off with a more docile breed.

which brings up a story of mine. i live in a quiet community in the suburbs. many dog owners. one house down the street owns two shepherds and im sure they are quite friendly to family members but because the a-hole who owns them dosent know how to train them they will often terrorize passers by. if this jerk had bought a dachsund we would all be safer. if one of those dogs bites my kid im going over there with a gun.

sure the owner is a fault not the dog...(thats why id shoot the owner not the dog) BUT if someone had asked that jackoff if he intended to train the dogs correctly, or even checked that he had after the purchase, no one would have to fear a simple walk on the sidewalk !

[Mr Twister]

Updated picture of Dutch. It was his first Holloween.

[carcrazy]

Great looking dog! What is his bloodline?

I've owned GSD's for many, many years. Both American and German bloodlines. They can be just about anything you want them to be! Unfortunately there are a lot of poorly bred dogs with bad nerves and temperment. A well-bred shepherd is without a doubt the best all-around dog you can have. (sure to raise and argument) A poorly bred one is a disaster waiting to happen!
My current shepherd is a very high drive, solid black DDR "working" dog and as such she has been raised differently than someone who just wants a pet. This type of dog is a handfull and not suitable for a novice owner. She is very highly trained-I spend about an hour a day-every day. It is her job to guard the premises. She does not socialize with people or other animals only me. I don't let anyone else pet the dog or give it praise. She is a joy to be around and knows when to turn it on and turn it off!

If you want a lot of great information go to Leerburg.com

By the way, there are very few lines of good "working" Dobermans left. Very hard to find good ones. (my daughter used to breed them for years)

[mskrom]

Originally Posted by My442

And, breeding plays a major role in temperment and health.

Do yourself a favor an do your homework on the breeder. Having any type of working dog is a major commitment.

These are outstanding points that should not be overlooked or underestimated if buying from a breeder. That said, kudos to all of you adopting shelter and rescued animals.

[69gp400]

nice looking shepherd good luck and glad you found the one.

[TinInjun]

That is a great looking GSD. He looks just like my last black and tan did at the same age. I love those ears at that age. Sadly I had to put mine down in August. He had Degenerative Myelopathy, DM for short. It is a nasty auto-immune disease that slowly paralyzes the dog, starting at the rear and slowly progresses forward. There is no cure but there is now a genetic test that can identify it. I was surprised that no one had talked about this being a problem in this breed. It is misdiagnosed in most GSD's as arthritis or hip dysplasia because the vets just are not very familiar with it. Its onset is generally around 8 years and can vary by 2 or so years. It doesn't matter where you get the dog be it a professional breeder or a novice backyard breeder, the chances are about the same. Its genetic and until all the breeders stop looking at the almighty dollar and start looking at what is best for the breed it will just get worse. Unfortunately I know about this from first hand experience as my past two GSD's had to be put down from this. Two of the greatest dogs I have ever owned. The first saved my oldest daughters life when she was an infant by waking me up in the middle of the night and dragging me upstairs. She was on her back and had thrown up in her sleep and was unable to breathe. Toughest thing I ever had to do was say goodbye to him.

[lust4speed]

TinInjun, how fast did the desease progress? We're still trying to pinpoint whether our male had DM or something else. From onset until we had to put him down was less than a month. He was 8-1/2 years old. I didn't think that the desease spread that fast.

[TinInjun]

On average it will take about a year from first onset, but there are many factors that can slow it down or speed it up. First indication of DM is the dog will start to have problems with one rear leg. Usually dragging it causing abnormal wear on the nails. You will also notice that the dog can no longer run all out in a normal Shepard gait. They tend to start to "bunny hopping" as they lose control of the leg. Then it will progress to the other leg to the point that the dog will no longer be able to walk without help. Incontinence will follow and then other complications such as pneumonia, and the vital organs start to shut down. Its a hard thing to watch happen.
There are some good web sites out there on the subject. Dr Clemmons from the University of Florida has done some great work on the subject.

[lust4speed]

I apologize for casting a dark shadow on the thread, but most all breeds can have DM, and some breeds are more prone than German Shepherds, so I'll continue the discussion. On the positive side, I went all these years without seeing a case of DM, and have owned over two dozen adult shepherds with no DM present.

I still believe that our boy didn't have DM after reading your description. I did do a bunch of reading on it at the time, and had disagreed with the vet's call. I went to a total of four vets and the first two diagnosed DM, but when I took the dog to a DM specialist she didn't agree. We finally had to put him down when he couldn't move his back quarters and we couldn't find help for him.

The time on the ordeal was only three weeks. He started by lousing control of one back leg and it would buckle out from under him when he walked. Then he would recover and walk fine for awhile. I am very good at spotting dogs with dysplasia (even mild) just by their walk, and our male didn't show any signs of it. He continued to get worse with more accidental drops. It seemed he didn't know the leg wasn't working. Within another week it was tough to coax him to get up and we had to help him. It was tough since he would lay out in the yard with his head up just like he was ready to jump up and come, but he wouldn't even try to get up.

The DM specialist found a large open sore on the inside of his leg that was draining. My thought immediately went to a rattlesnake bite since we have every western species and are located in the boonies. The dogs alert on the snakes and will lunge and taunt at them trying to get a bite in - which definitely pisses off the snakes. One year I killed 26 rattlesnakes on my property so we are infested. I'm of the opinion that a snake caught him in the inner flank and the venom slowly ate away at the muscle mass. I went to the vets and they disagreed with the idea of any snake or spider bite. The dog's timing was terrible - my daughter and her husband are good friends with Sean Bush the doctor from Loma Linda that was on the TV show Venom ER treating snake bites, and he is an expert on identifying different bites and stings. At that time, he was in Africa for several months training doctors on treatments.

It's coming up on two years since we lost him, and I kick myself now for not having an autopsy done at the time. My family and I were upset with the loss and I just didn't think of it.

[SergeF]

Please don't compare GS to pit bulls. Here you can't even get an insurance for a pit or rot. GS no problems. Pits are always on the local news for attacking somebody.

[Mr Twister]

At 12 weeks for his vet visit "Dutch" weighed 32.2 pounds. He is doing well. As far as the question above about his bloodline, I really don't know. I just want a pet/companion, which he is.

[Held for Ransom]

It didn't stop me from getting myself an early Christmas present.

[Mr Twister]

That is one nice looking Puppy, with HUGE feet. How big were his parents? Name?

[Held for Ransom]

The dam was a little above average for a female, while the male was of average size. The kids seem to like Kasey.

[Jim Moshier]

Shepherds are very good family pets, very loyal and very protective. We just put our 16 year old shepherd husky mix down, we got her when we had kids so they grew up together. No one messed with my kids when she was around. They have a great personality and I always get them from the pound.

[Held for Ransom]

How's Dutch doing?

Kasey Casey (KC, for short) is getting excited about Christmas, as I think he can smell the presents.

[77GP]

Years ago when I was in elementary school, bacj when kids walked, we had a GS female mix. She was so smart that she knew what time school was out and would go to meet us. My mother worked at a pizza place on the corner with a stoplight on a 4 lane rd. The dog would stop and sit till the light turned green for her. My mother would witness this. Very loyal girl but had a problem with other dogs and Cats. Mean as hell, didn't care if it was male or female. Never hurt any people, realyy only one other dog. She was rescued also but this was back in the 70's. Hated it when she was gone. Great looking dogs in thread. We wanted a GS recently and my wife works at a vet clinic. Someone had pups to sell and mother was full blooded Husky. We were given one of them and so disappointed now. Who knows what the father was, but she is a beautiful dog, just not very sizable. Would be if she was bigger. We wanted an outside dog to roam inside our fenced in yard. But when she sees a stranger waqalking doown the fence, she runs out (if she does) and lays down so they can pet her. Not much of a scare. Not looking for a killer dog, Our GS mix that we had always roamed the fence line and barked at passerbys but wasn't viscious. Lost him last year after having him 15 years. Ruptured spleen. He had arthritus but wife had medicine called liquid health. It is a glucoamine product. Had no probelm getting around. Put your older dogs on that and see the difference. $15.00 for 8 oz. 2 tablespoons a day is what we gave him 75lb. dog.

[Mr Twister]

I will post an updated pic of Dutch soon. He is a pretty good dog, but at times a handful..

[T A 70]

Originally Posted by Mr Twister

Updated picture of Dutch. It was his first Holloween.

Beautiful dog....hope that ear stands up when he's older. I've had several GC dogs and only one of them had a lazy ear that never went away.