[wagon master]

Anybody know if you can jack the engine up far enough to get the oil pan off by clearing the crossmember without removing the engine, on a 64 catalina V8 stick shift?

Thanks in advance for your personal experiences!

[61-63]

I do not know for sure but having removed and replaced engines in '61-'63 big cars (same car for what you are asking) a number of times I would just go ahead and pull the engine. You'd have to remove the transmission, or trans and bell housing both if std. trans, exhaust manifolds, and starter, in order to get it high enough to get the oil pan off and then out. Or at least I would. And frankly I would not feel comfortable rooting around the underside of the engine getting the oil pan bolts off with it just hanging there slightly above the cross member.

[stevep]

I have done it on a 1966 2+2 421 4 speed, but it is much easier to just remove the motor out of the car.

[Deadhead]

Chilton claims you can do it if you just raise the front of the engine, but you'd still have to disconnect the motor mounts.

[wagon master]

Thank you gents for opinions and experience. After spending an hour late last night inspecting the scenario, it looks like Mr. 61-63 experience is spot on. By the time you remove everything to give clearance for the trans tunnel hump, firewall, radiator and exhaust, you're only maybe 30 minutes from complete removal anyway. I was just trying to make this a simple fix in my mind and not a project, but better to do it right the first time, so I will remove it after all.

Thanks again for your help!

[pfilean]

I think the process involves loosening the pan so it will drop enough to remove the front main cap. Then the pan can be slid back down and out. That and blocking the engine up some (how you do that with no weight on the pan might take some thinking). If you are not working on a hoist that can be a chore. I agree with the pull the engine approach.

[Sirrotica]

The front cap must be removed as well as having the crank at the correct orientation to get the pan out. I've done it before, but you will not save any time or labor doing it in chassis. Aside from that the oil will drip on you continually as you work.

It is much easier to pull the pan on an engine stand eliminating the oil running on you as well as it's much easier to seal the pan upon replacement more effectively on an engine stand than working over your head. Keeping the gaskets in place while wiggling the pan back into place is another drawback.

The Pontiac pan is wider and more massive than all the other GM V8 engines. The large crankshaft with larger than average main caps is the reason it is so challenging. All the mass below the bottom of the block hanging down in the way of getting the pan by them is the reason for all the extra labor involved to remove the pan in chassis. The things that make the stout bottom end. also become obstacles when trying to remove the pan in chassis.

[Willshire]

When in doubt, take it out!

[geeteeohguy]

Pulling the engine will save time, aggrivation, your sanity, and will make for a much neater job that's much less likely to leak when done.

[Deadhead]

For '66 they claim it can only be done on 2 bolt mains. Chilton says must remove for the 4 style. FWTW.

You'll find plenty of other fun stuff to do with it out!

[Goatracer1]

The dealers were given a special lifting fixure for removing the pan. It attached to the timing cover and ran across the engine compartment and pulled the engine up. Nothing was in the way under the car and the engine couldn't fall on you. Job still sucked.

[428goat]

My buddy did it on a 67 without raising the engine way back when. I guess he changed the bearings. Funny story. I got there when he was buttoning up the pan. Just about all done. I looked at the bottom of the radiator support and guess what was laying there. The front main bearing cap. A lot of swearing. Really pissed off.