[stevep]

If you can get the stock motor to run, you could run regular fuel.

[MOJO Catalina]

That would be great..
It should still have plenty of power shouldn't it? I may still want to put the 3x2 setup on there.. Wouldn't hurt anything would it? I know it wouldn't be optimum but I probably wouldn't be into the secondaries much.

[cuz68]

Great find. I will be keeping up with the wagon also.

[Teej]

Great save. She's a great looking wagon!

[MOJO Catalina]

Thanks! I see you have a few of your own.
Yep, I'm now a proud member of the "Longroofers Society."
We need t-shirts and dash plaques of our own now...
Remember where you heard it first!

[60 SHARK]

I HAD A CHANCE TO STOP BACK TO THIS THREAD, AND SEE THAT YOU HAVE A GOOD FOLLOWING. I THOUGHT OF YOU, DO YOU HAVE THIS ADD? IT IS FROM A LARGE MAG SO THE SCANNER CUT SOME OF IT OFF, BUT IT IS STILL COOL. ENJOY!!!

[MOJO Catalina]

Thanks, that's cool.. It's the same color as the Catalina I have.. Sierra Copper I think it's called.

[RussellinNC]

Cool find Mojo...Where do you find jewels like these?...ha ha Lookin good!!!

Russell

[MOJO Catalina]

..With a little help from my friends.. Thanks for the redirect Russ.. I hope you don't regret it..
Now I need a 4 dr sedan parts car for cheeeep!

Anybody know if a four speed will swap right in to this car with no mods? If so, which one would be the best to use?
Man, this linkage and shifter on the column SUX and gets bound up more times than not.

If I'm going to put a shifter on the floor it might as well be a four speed..

[RussellinNC]

No problem Mojo...Saw your ad lookin for one on Craigslist & glad to help a fellow Pontiac lover. Plus I hated to see it go to the crusher. I cant buy everything...ha ha

Last Kannapolis Cruise in is Saturday...Get there around 3pm.

Later
Russell

[Teej]

I'm just going through the same thing with my '58 so I'll tell you that the general consensus is that most 4 spds will bolt up without a problem. Muncies, Saginaws, etc. Probably have to put a new clutch disc and will need to do something about the overall length. (Driveshaft and yoke.) But it should all be pretty straightforward. I'm hoping so anyway, as I haven't yet started. Just picked up an M20 yesterday so maybe in the next few weeks I'll have some more info..

[MOJO Catalina]

Thanks, I look forward to the info about the swap...

I haven't been able to get the engine popping yet (even though there's compression and spark) so I suspected the valves aren't opening. I pulled the intake and valley pan off yesterday... I had hoped the engine only had 84,000 miles but it looks more like 284,000 miles... Without an oil change...

First, I unbolted a rocker arm because I was going to shoot some trans fluid down into the lifter via the pushrod but the hole in the rod was plugged. I tried pulling the pushrod out and it was stuck in place... I had to wiggle it loose, then twist and yank it out.. I mean, I could feel the crud scraping off it and falling back into the valley as I pulled it out.. I then had to take a metal scraper and carve the crap off the side of it and stick a wire down through it to get it to where I could see daylight through it.. I can't believe the amount of dried sludge build-up on the lifters and pushrods! This old gal must have died of a heart attack!... I can't even image what's in the oil pan.. It appears that the breather caps weren't breathing and the road draft tube is bound up tighter than Elvis on barbituates..



Come to think of it now, the old woman that had this car looked the same way..

I took some photos so I could share the horror..

Any risk of lead poisoning if I decide to try and clean this toilet?

[Safari Larry]

UGLY SLUDGE but I don't think that explains why it wouldn't start. If you are getting gas, spark, rockers are all going up & down when cranking -- and timing is set up correctly (valves and ignition) then it should have started.

Regarding transmission interchange, I agree with Teej. See http://www.pontiacsafari.com/L1Garag...lTransmissions. I just updated that page a week ago with transmission info. That is a 1955-58 Pontiac web site but since 1958-60 use the same bell housing then interchange info will apply to your '60.

Do you know if you now have the light duty or heavy duty 3-speed? If not, count the bolts on trans side cover, light duty has 4 bolts, heavy duty has 8 bolts.

[RussellinNC]

I bought my 1st 65 GTO in 87 when I was 16. Factory tripower automatic car...Gave $600 and drove it home. Someone had swapped the intake with a 2 barrel intake so i was sticking a 4 barrel on it and I pulled the valley pan too & sludge was LEVEL with the valley pan...16 & no money so a putty knife & a shop vac & I was going again...Later on when the engine finally died I got to see in the pan & it was clean...Oil slinging from the crank around in it kept it clean.

I would think the wagon maybe suffered from grandmas short trips & few oil changes?...I would also bet since its a wagon its got the heavy duty 3 speed...Just a guess.

I will have to get down and check it out soon!!!

Russell

[MOJO Catalina]

Originally Posted by RussellinNC

I will have to get down and check it out soon!!!

Yeah Man! I'll buy the beer..

I guess this one aint so bad compared to the '65 GTO you had..
I suppose I'm going to lay some rags down over the cam openings, pull the rockers and push rods and start scraping...
The voices say "duct tape the scraper to the shop vac".. yeah that's the ticket..

While I'm at it I guess I should try to pop the timing cover off and see what's in there..

As far as checking the trans cover, that won't be hard. The floor's gone so I don't even have to get under the car. I can stick my head through the hole and have a look... wish I'd thought of that yesterday..



Always wanted one of those "swiss cheese' cars.. got me one now!

[Bull]

The lines on that car are beautiful. I wish I had the skill and other resources to be able to bring one like that back from the edge of death.

[Bill Eveland]

Nice project. Outside of the wheels, I wouldn't change a thing on the outside of the car...

[MOJO Catalina]

Thanks for the encouragement fellers..

Originally Posted by 61 vent

My wagon started up after 30 years Mojo, my biggest problem was resetting the timing and dwell after I pulled the distributor to pre oil the engine.

I've been vacuuming and scraping today.. Got most of the gunk cleaned out of the valley.. I have too much regular job work for a couple of days to mess with the wagon, but ASAP I'm going pull all the rockers, pushrods and lifters and clean them all up real good too. I want to see if there are any cupped lifters or worn cam lobes... If all goes well I'll slap the valley pan and intake back on, Swap the carb with something I know has worked in the past 3 years at least, check the timing and dwell as suggested above and hope she fires up...

On a different note, the insulators on the wires of the tailgate harness have crumbled to dust... I'm going to need a new pigtail from the tailgate to up inside the fender.. The window was stuck about an inch above where it should have been to get the tailgate to close.. I removed the tailgate, cleaned all the rodent turds and rust out of it, lubed it all up and figured out which wires worked the UP and DOWN functions... Got it to roll up and down with the electric motor.. Sluggish at first but then she started going real well.. Up and down about 10 times was enough.. I got it back on the car and closed/latched it for the first time in probably 34 years...

Sad thing is that the 3rd seat is shot.. Totally rotted and the floor under it is completely gone.. Gas tank is ready to fall out since there are no straps anymore.. It's just wedged in here now... I'm supposing this car may never be brought back to be even "real good" because the back end and tailgate jambs are so wasted, but I intend to fix it up decent enough to drive and park in the lot at the car shows at least...

I wonder how many of these 3 on the tree 60 wagons are left out there?

[Teej]

Originally Posted by RussellinNC

I would think the wagon maybe suffered from grandmas short trips & few oil changes?...I would also bet since its a wagon its got the heavy duty 3 speed...Just a guess.
Russell

My '58 was a 3 on the tree and only had the light duty 3 speed.

And if you're gate harness was that crumbly, you need to be careful of the rest of it. I'd hate to see an electrical fire shut you down after you get things going. At the very least, go wiggle all the wires you can and replace any that the insulation comes off of...

[Engine-Ear]

Great find and worthy of making some sort of driver out of it, IMO.

With all the rust-thru, I would probably pull out the whole interior and replace missing floor with generic tin; I would also leave the doors. There is rust and there's RUST...I think your rust levels are manageable.

Also, '60 thru '62 (maybe '63, too, not sure) use an iron cam gear, unlike the '64-'67 stuff I have dealt with. These 389s also have rocker-stud-oiling, not pushrod-oiling. With all of the other positives going for the engine, you may still have sticky / hangin'-open valves but I blame the carb at this moment. Swap in a known-good one as you said earlier and see what comes of it. Also, these engines will start even setting the timing to 0 deg ("straight up"). If you have a known-good distributor, I would sub that in, too.

Please keep us posted, MOJO!