[zippy]

Originally Posted by wh33lman

Picked up a set of HyLift Johnson 0951 lifters today after dissatisfaction with 2 sets of Crower lifters.

The Crowers sounded awful in the 455. I tried 1/2 turn from zero lash and 3/4 turn from zero lash, and they still sounded awful. (HarlanSharp 1.5 rockers, round port Eheads)

Fortunately TopLineAuto had a distribution center just 40 mins. away and these were in stock so no waiting for shipping.
I was in the middle of pulling the motor for an oil pan leak, so the time was right for a change.

The HyLifts were about 2X the price of the Crowers.

The most obvious difference between the Crower and the HyLift is that ridge just below the oil hole.
Crowers do not have that ridge.
It does not extend to the full diameter of the lifter, but I am not sure of it's affect.

Were they the Crower Cam Saver lifters? With the flat ground on one side?

[shifty]

Originally Posted by sdbob

Thank you for the information. I like reading your insights.

Me, too.

[wh33lman]

No. These were the regular Crower lifters.
I can get you the part number tomorrow.

[Shiny]

Are these Topline/Hylift-Johnson?

I think so based on wh33lman's photo.

If not, can you ID them?

I found them while rummaging yesterday and reminded me of this thread. I bought them off eBay many years ago and forgot about them..

[wh33lman]

The lifter in my picture are the Johnson HyLifts I just purchased. They are easily identified as they have the raised band just below the oil hole, and the groove below that.
The Crower's do not have either of these.

Now comes the embarrassing part... The Crower's that went bad, were entirely due to me not setting the valve lash correctly.

[77 TRASHCAN]

Originally Posted by wh33lman

The lifter in my picture are the Johnson HyLifts I just purchased. They are easily identified as they have the raised band just below the oil hole, and the groove below that.
The Crower's do not have either of these.

Now comes the embarrassing part... The Crower's that went bad, were entirely due to me not setting the valve lash correctly.

Stuff happens...

[Shiny]

Originally Posted by wh33lman

The lifter in my picture are the Johnson HyLifts I just purchased. They are easily identified as they have the raised band just below the oil hole, and the groove below that.
The Crower's do not have either of these.

Now comes the embarrassing part... The Crower's that went bad, were entirely due to me not setting the valve lash correctly.

Glad you figured it out!

Originally Posted by Shiny

Are these Topline/Hylift-Johnson?

I think so based on wh33lman's photo.

If not, can you ID them?

I found them while rummaging yesterday and reminded me of this thread. I bought them off eBay many years ago and forgot about them..

Here's what I failed to get uploaded... they do look like wh33lman's.

[64speed]

I just dropped off my engine parts to be checked and all the cam parts to be checked for spec. My machinist said the Crower Cam Savers usually tend to be within spen but his caveat was be prepared to call them and get them to swap 2 or 3. I will report back.

[64-3Deuces]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

That depends on the state they are in. Different states have different laws about that.

Some states allow "Made In USA" claims if the part is simply modified or assembled in some way in the state, even though the main body can come from China.

Other states only allow the "Made In USA" claim if the entire part from start to finish is done in the USA.

The same thing happens with cylinder heads. Many of them are cast in China now (Except Brodix that I'm aware of) But since machine work is done here in the states by most other head manufactures, as long as they live in one of those lenient states, they can claim "Made In The USA"

Labeling is controlled by the Federal Trade Commission.

Under its general authority to act against deceptive acts and practices, the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) controls ‘Made in America’, ‘Made in the USA’, or any claims of U.S. origin for all products sold or advertised in the United States.

The FTC Act, § 45a Labels on products, states that a product advertised or offered for sale with a ‘Made in USA’, “Made in America’, or equivalent label must have domestic origins that are consistent with orders and decision of the FTC. FTC has provided a policy statement requiring that ‘all or virtually all’ of a product be made in the United States to make the unqualified claim. Any product labeled with an unqualified ‘Made in the USA’ claim or similar must be able to have that claim substantiated.

As with gov. regulations there are always exceptions: If the U.S. Custom Service determines that a good is not of foreign origin (i.e., the good undergoes its last substantial transformation in the United States) there is no requirement for labeling with the country of origin.

All of the mumbo jumbo at https://www.nist.gov/standardsgov/co...-faqs-made-usa

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by 64-3Deuces

Labeling is controlled by the Federal Trade Commission.

Under its general authority to act against deceptive acts and practices, the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) controls ‘Made in America’, ‘Made in the USA’, or any claims of U.S. origin for all products sold or advertised in the United States.

The FTC Act, § 45a Labels on products, states that a product advertised or offered for sale with a ‘Made in USA’, “Made in America’, or equivalent label must have domestic origins that are consistent with orders and decision of the FTC. FTC has provided a policy statement requiring that ‘all or virtually all’ of a product be made in the United States to make the unqualified claim. Any product labeled with an unqualified ‘Made in the USA’ claim or similar must be able to have that claim substantiated.

As with gov. regulations there are always exceptions: If the U.S. Custom Service determines that a good is not of foreign origin (i.e., the good undergoes its last substantial transformation in the United States) there is no requirement for labeling with the country of origin.

All of the mumbo jumbo at https://www.nist.gov/standardsgov/co...-faqs-made-usa

Thanks for the link, I hope more people read that and understand what I've been trying to say. I love how it leaves itself loop holes with terms like "virtually all"

This quote explaining what they take into consideration to claim "made in the USA" is most telling, which applies to most of the overseas parts that are cast and then finished here.

"Foreign content incorporated early in the manufacturing process will often be less significant than content that is a direct part of the finished product."

How it also states automobiles are not addressed here. Wish it went into more detail there.

USA made just doesn't mean what it used to.

[64-3Deuces]

To Formulajones,

Yep, terms like "virtually all" and "substantial" are pretty much wide open terms. I used to work for the government and if you asked two people to define "virtually all" you would get three different definitions and maybe more!...

Almost everything I buy in some manner says Made in the USA with globally sourced materials. You're correct--USA made just doesn't mean what it used to.

[Jim Moshier]

Sorry to hear about the lifters not being adjusted properly I am Curious about How you can attribute the adjusted lifter lash to the problem. Rotating the engine by hand or starter there should be some loose rockers. NO? Not hear to judge just asking for my reference to look out for.

[wh33lman]

Aw..you are going to make me admit what a dumbass move it was.

I first set the lash while the motor was out and the valley pan sealed. Only when I set the distributor to TDS on #1, I was 180° out.

When I tried to start it I realized it was out and with the help of a friend, corrected it, but did not immediately think to correct the lash. It ran for a few miles before I reset the lash.
Usually I am overly careful about such things, but after almost 18 months of delays my head was thinking of using all that torque.

Working alone, I would use the paper towels plug in the #1 spark plug hole, and bump the starter to find the #1 compression stroke. From now on I am going to watch the #1 rockers and/or keep the valley pan off.

[Tom Vaught]

I used to buy trays of the Johnson Lifters made in Muskegon Michigan.
The roller lifters made in the Detroit area are not the same company.
I have posted about this in the past.
For a while the "Detroit area based company only made the Roller Lifter Version of the Lifters.
Not sure what they are selling today.

They were renting space in the back of another business in the Detroit area.

Now the Lifters made in Muskegon Michigan and sold to Rhoads Lifters and modified by them (groove)
have always been high quality Hydraulic FLAT TAPPET lifters.
And they were made in Muskegon and used parts from other MICHIGAN companies in the area.

I have all of the lifters I need for my 455 cid street car but agree lifters like many things made offshore are a flip of the coin deal.

Sorry to hear about your issue with the lifter.

Tom V.

[wh33lman]

Originally Posted by Tom Vaught

Now the Lifters made in Muskegon Michigan and sold to Rhoads Lifters and modified by them (groove)
have always been high quality Hydraulic FLAT TAPPET lifters.
And they were made in Muskegon and used parts from other MICHIGAN companies in the area.

Sorry to hear about your issue with the lifter.

Tom V.

Well, at least I only ruined a spare set of Crower's I had lying around and not the new set of the good Johnson HyLifts from Muskegon.

Lessons learned the hard way are the one's you never forget.

[P@blo]

Originally Posted by wh33lman

Well, at least I only ruined a spare set of Crower's I had lying around and not the new set of the good Johnson HyLifts from Muskegon.

Lessons learned the hard way are the one's you never forget.

Great attitude! That will carry you a long way in life Wheelman. You are in the 5-10% of people who actually work on their own cars. Probably 1-2% in reality.

[geeteeohguy]

I miss the good old days 30 years ago and further back when you just slid the cam in, fired it up, and never, ever had an issue. Not even a thought. The SIg Erson cam and lifters are still mint in my '65 50k miles and 42 years after I installed them, and the Melling stuff I installed 35 years ago and 90k miles ago in my '67 still works fine. Buy new parts, install them, and don't destroy a brand new engine. What a concept!

[taktikian]

Originally Posted by P@blo

Great attitude! That will carry you a long way in life Wheelman. You are in the 5-10% of people who actually work on their own cars. Probably 1-2% in reality.

Pablo Lots of us are now physically unable to work on our Pontiacs anymore. No one escapes father time, Just saying

[Dragncar]

Originally Posted by P@blo

Great attitude! That will carry you a long way in life Wheelman. You are in the 5-10% of people who actually work on their own cars. Probably 1-2% in reality.

I have to believe that more than 5-10% of members work on their old Pontiacs.
Myself, I have only paid for one oil change in my life. Only pay for things like machine work, body shop, wheel aliments ect.
The rest I do myself.

[P@blo]

I was not talking about this forum Dragncar. Hopefully we are batting 1000 on that one. And yes one day we will all be too old to work on cars but personally feel at that point we speak from experience.