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Old 05-13-2021, 07:45 AM
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Default KRE D-Ports on 350P

Anyone running KRE D-Ports on a Pontiac 350?

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Old 05-13-2021, 11:21 AM
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You mean in terms of street / performance driving, or flat out race?

If the latter and in terms of running a aftermarket head on that cid motor then yes, the KRE or Edelbrock D- port heads are your best pick for the sake of port volume.

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Old 05-13-2021, 11:30 AM
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Yep. For the street. No interest in Edelbrock. For clarity’s sake, these would be 65cc with 2.02-ish intake valves and 1.66 exhaust.

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Old 05-13-2021, 11:43 AM
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Usually if someone springs the cash for aluminum heads, they add some cubes/stroke to the humble 350 to reap the benefits of the improved head performance. But yeah the heads will work! Great choice for most any Pontiac build.


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Old 05-13-2021, 01:01 PM
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The KRE heads come out of the box with 2.11" intakes, but I guess if you where willing to wait out a addiction order time possibly, and maybe a increased labor charge they could set you up a pair fitted with with 2.02" intakes.

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Wernher Von Braun warned before his retirement from NASA back in 1972, that the next world war would be against the ETs!
And he was not talking about 1/8 or 1/4 mile ETs!

1) 1940s 100% silver 4 cup tea server set.

Two dry rotted 14 x 10 Micky Thompson slicks.

1) un-mailed in gift coupon from a 1972 box of corn flakes.
Two pairs of brown leather flip flops, never seen more then 2 mph.

Education is what your left with once you forget things!
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Old 05-13-2021, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve25 View Post
The KRE heads come out of the box with 2.11" intakes, but I guess if you where willing to wait out a addiction order time possibly, and maybe a increased labor charge they could set you up a pair fitted with with 2.02" intakes.
Yessir. I spoke with the KRE folks a year or so ago (pre-COVID) and they said it was no big deal to do the smaller intake valve. Not sure what their stance is nowadays.

"By the numbers" it seems a logical upgrade. Really, I'm just curious if anybody here has practical experience with these heads on a 350.

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Old 05-13-2021, 02:54 PM
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Ive run the EDL RPM (72cc) heads (2.11/1.66) on my 350... was a very strong running engine.

SPEED SAFE, NICK

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Old 05-13-2021, 03:15 PM
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If nobody speaks up then allow me to make a comparison that will be well in the ball park of what to expect.

Let’s look at a SBC and the common head port volumes that are run on built 350 and 383 cid motors, looking at this you find that in non race set ups the most common port volumes used are from 180 to 195CCs.
Note that a 350 SBC has a 3.48” stroke and the intake port is longer in lenght then our Pontiacs.

The Pontiac 350 ( actually 354 cid stock ) has a 3.750” stroke and near a 1/2” shorter intake port length.

What this means is that if we where to compare a SBC 180 CC port to a Pontiac 180 CC port then the Pontiac would have a larger minimum port area or choke point as some call it.

This is all well and good since the Pontiac has that longer stroke spoke of before as compared to a SBC.

The KRE heads are some 185 CCs out of the box, so a .030” 350 Pontiac at 360 cid could make good use of these heads if the motor was built to make peak hp at maybe 5800 to 6000 and hold together to be shifted at 6500 on the street, which can certainly be done these days with the parts we have!

Of course stroking the motor is a option also if the funds are there for it.

I have found that in stock form when tested on my flow bench that the KRE heads out of the box with there 2.11” valve pass 255 intake cfm
@28”

Fitted with a 2.02” valve you should have a solid 230 cfm at .550” lift which could churn out up to 430 to 450 hp depending on how hot of a street Cam you run!

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Wernher Von Braun warned before his retirement from NASA back in 1972, that the next world war would be against the ETs!
And he was not talking about 1/8 or 1/4 mile ETs!

1) 1940s 100% silver 4 cup tea server set.

Two dry rotted 14 x 10 Micky Thompson slicks.

1) un-mailed in gift coupon from a 1972 box of corn flakes.
Two pairs of brown leather flip flops, never seen more then 2 mph.

Education is what your left with once you forget things!
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Old 05-13-2021, 05:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve25 View Post
If nobody speaks up then allow me to make a comparison that will be well in the ball park of what to expect.

Let’s look at a SBC and the common head port volumes that are run on built 350 and 383 cid motors, looking at this you find that in non race set ups the most common port volumes used are from 180 to 195CCs.
Note that a 350 SBC has a 3.48” stroke and the intake port is longer in lenght then our Pontiacs.

The Pontiac 350 ( actually 354 cid stock ) has a 3.750” stroke and near a 1/2” shorter intake port length.

What this means is that if we where to compare a SBC 180 CC port to a Pontiac 180 CC port then the Pontiac would have a larger minimum port area or choke point as some call it.

This is all well and good since the Pontiac has that longer stroke spoke of before as compared to a SBC.

The KRE heads are some 185 CCs out of the box, so a .030” 350 Pontiac at 360 cid could make good use of these heads if the motor was built to make peak hp at maybe 5800 to 6000 and hold together to be shifted at 6500 on the street, which can certainly be done these days with the parts we have!

Of course stroking the motor is a option also if the funds are there for it.

I have found that in stock form when tested on my flow bench that the KRE heads out of the box with there 2.11” valve pass 255 intake cfm
@28”

Fitted with a 2.02” valve you should have a solid 230 cfm at .550” lift which could churn out up to 430 to 450 hp depending on how hot of a street Cam you run!
Thank you Steve, for taking the time to write all that out! It certainly helps paint a better picture. I've been jokingly calling this idea a "Jurassic LS" build. Short of catastrophic failure, the short block will stay as it is (.030 over, eagle 6.625 rods and stock crank) and I'll focus on what I can get with heads, cam, exhaust, and induction. Certainly not going to happen all at once, but I'm saving for the biggest expense right out of the gate. I'd guess my very mild cam with 1.65 rockers would yield stock F-Body, LS1 numbers.

Ain't science fun?

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Old 05-13-2021, 05:29 PM
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Please also confirm that this motor has the needed 60 psi oil pump and a new hardened oil pump drive shaft, as the stock 40 psi pump will get you to catastrophic failure real quick!

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Wernher Von Braun warned before his retirement from NASA back in 1972, that the next world war would be against the ETs!
And he was not talking about 1/8 or 1/4 mile ETs!

1) 1940s 100% silver 4 cup tea server set.

Two dry rotted 14 x 10 Micky Thompson slicks.

1) un-mailed in gift coupon from a 1972 box of corn flakes.
Two pairs of brown leather flip flops, never seen more then 2 mph.

Education is what your left with once you forget things!
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Old 05-13-2021, 06:16 PM
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Yessir, she’s got a new Meling, 60 psi oil pump.

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Old 05-13-2021, 06:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve25 View Post
If nobody speaks up then allow me to make a comparison that will be well in the ball park of what to expect.

Let’s look at a SBC and the common head port volumes that are run on built 350 and 383 cid motors, looking at this you find that in non race set ups the most common port volumes used are from 180 to 195CCs.
Note that a 350 SBC has a 3.48” stroke and the intake port is longer in lenght then our Pontiacs.

The Pontiac 350 ( actually 354 cid stock ) has a 3.750” stroke and near a 1/2” shorter intake port length.

What this means is that if we where to compare a SBC 180 CC port to a Pontiac 180 CC port then the Pontiac would have a larger minimum port area or choke point as some call it.

This is all well and good since the Pontiac has that longer stroke spoke of before as compared to a SBC.

The KRE heads are some 185 CCs out of the box, so a .030” 350 Pontiac at 360 cid could make good use of these heads if the motor was built to make peak hp at maybe 5800 to 6000 and hold together to be shifted at 6500 on the street, which can certainly be done these days with the parts we have!

Of course stroking the motor is a option also if the funds are there for it.

I have found that in stock form when tested on my flow bench that the KRE heads out of the box with there 2.11” valve pass 255 intake cfm
@28”

Fitted with a 2.02” valve you should have a solid 230 cfm at .550” lift which could churn out up to 430 to 450 hp depending on how hot of a street Cam you run!
I know a guy that ran a S-10 truck with a 350, vortec heads, 170 cc. Small solid roller cam.10.80`s 1/4.


He wanted to go faster. So he wanted to buy the GMPP 200 cc runner heads. I told him not to. His truck. He buys em. Doesn`t change the cam, converter or gears. Truck runs mostly the same et, BUT, 60 ft. and 330 suffered. So, lesson to be taught to most.

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Old 05-13-2021, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyJS41 View Post
Yessir. I spoke with the KRE folks a year or so ago (pre-COVID) and they said it was no big deal to do the smaller intake valve. Not sure what their stance is nowadays.

"By the numbers" it seems a logical upgrade. Really, I'm just curious if anybody here has practical experience with these heads on a 350.
I say run em. I like a good running 350P. Build a good bottom end. Run the 65cc chamber and 2.02 valve. Pick a good cam, 3.90 gears and a good converter. You will suprise some.

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Old 05-13-2021, 11:01 PM
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Following up on Steve’s point on the oil pump. Why is that needed for a head change like this? I ask cause I have my own top end head swap coming too and just running a stock pump.

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Old 05-14-2021, 05:42 AM
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I mentioned it just in case because it's needed for anything but a grocery getter type usage

The only 350 4 bbl type motor to get the 60 psi pump with its 3/4" pick up was the short lived 350 ho motor,and none of any of the 2 bbl motors got the 60 psi pump.

All other motors hot the 40 psi pump with its far more restrictive 5/8" pick up tube.

Rpm's above 5000 with the 40 psi pump are sure to cause problems!

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Wernher Von Braun warned before his retirement from NASA back in 1972, that the next world war would be against the ETs!
And he was not talking about 1/8 or 1/4 mile ETs!

1) 1940s 100% silver 4 cup tea server set.

Two dry rotted 14 x 10 Micky Thompson slicks.

1) un-mailed in gift coupon from a 1972 box of corn flakes.
Two pairs of brown leather flip flops, never seen more then 2 mph.

Education is what your left with once you forget things!
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Old 06-08-2021, 10:28 AM
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Follow on question: Is there any issue with running cast iron, RA/HO type manifolds with aluminum heads?

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Old 06-08-2021, 10:44 AM
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I have never had a 350 Pontiac that ran 40 psi of oil pressure I had a 71 lemans wagon and a 71 gt-37 both had 350 2 barrels and both ran 50-60 psi driving down the road and both where bone stock with lots of miles on them. Does the OP have a oil pressure gauge in his car maybe he can shed some light on that one?

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Old 06-08-2021, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
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I have never had a 350 Pontiac that ran 40 psi of oil pressure I had a 71 lemans wagon and a 71 gt-37 both had 350 2 barrels and both ran 50-60 psi driving down the road and both where bone stock with lots of miles on them. Does the OP have a oil pressure gauge in his car maybe he can shed some light on that one?
I’ve got the factory gauge, so take it for what it’s worth, but it shows 60 psi (+\- 10). However, it’s a new manufacture Melling pump, so not really a good comparison.

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Old 06-08-2021, 11:41 AM
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No issue with the RA exhaust on alu heads.Tom

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Old 06-08-2021, 12:37 PM
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No issue with the RA exhaust on alu heads.Tom
Thank you sir!

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