[cnc]

White for a blue car gotta be the only way to go

[keith k]

Polar white on the stripe for me. The color has much more impact than Cameo.

[165th]

Originally Posted by njsteve

I vote blue (for the white car owners) :-)

There's hope for white car owners too. I'm also proceeding with the gradient (dot fade) design. If that can be perfected, then it can be integrated into the design to create blue stripes for a white car.

And, just as the white, I will need a pantone color number for the blue. I'm sure there are questions there too such as should the blue be Lucerne blue, or blue to match a NOS stripe.

The NOS hood stripe I'm using as a pattern for the hood is a blue stripe, so I have a starting point at least.

I'll keep the white car owners posted if the gradient design is successful.

[Norwood]

Greg, We all hope for your success on this project, THIS IS ONE FOR THE LITTLE GUY......vs the arrogance of people that think we have no other choice. GOOD LUCK

[Formulabruce]

Originally Posted by Formulabruce

I have a 72 factory bird for a white TA #481953 and the box the whole kit came in if this helps anyone

long ago my 72 got paint remover spilled on it ,at a dealership, so they bought a kit in 78, used all but the nose bird.

I will Donate my '72 Bird to this project and will be sending it to Texas to be copied.
That said, a good friend, who deals mostly in 3rd gen cars had a guy make his IROC and FORMULA big door decals and seemed like no big deal.. should I inquire on this process? they were about 1/4 the price of the GM decals at the time, maybe they were more like vinyl stickers? just a thought

[165th]

Originally Posted by Formulabruce

I will Donate my '72 Bird to this project and will be sending it to Texas to be copied.
That said, a good friend, who deals mostly in 3rd gen cars had a guy make his IROC and FORMULA big door decals and seemed like no big deal.. should I inquire on this process? they were about 1/4 the price of the GM decals at the time, maybe they were more like vinyl stickers? just a thought

Hi Bruce, Thank you. I have an NOS rear spoiler Trans AM and a couple of NOS fender Trans Am decals, so with the bird added, I'll go ahead and add those to the scope.

Regarding decals in general, digitally printed vinyl decals are easy squeezy in today's graphics/marketing world. It's fun and easy to have custom graphics made for cars these days. There's just one hitch, those decals are almost exclusively printed on white vinyl with colors added. The Trans Am stripes are printed on clear vinyl to achieve the clear reveal on either side of the black pin stripe on the edge which changes the game significantly.

I'll visit with the printers to see if the Trans Am and bird would be best printed on white, or if they should be included in the screen print runs with the stripes. I know the bird reproductions on the market today are screen printed.

[Rack776]

My 2 cents is to duplicate exactly what GM did, screen print ALL the the graphics on
high quality 3M clear vinyl.

As a guy who works in a shop that does vinyl graphics, I have seen many paint jobs ruined on a work van with cheap lettering wre had to remove because it failed early.

I'd hate to see this project jinxed by using correct art work on cheap materials
to save cost.

Rember some one out there has to have the equipment to do the large format screen printing its not exactly a new or mysterious process.

I'd try to find a shop that does prints for artists etc, and stay away from shops that only run cheap & dirty projects like political signs or corrugated boxes.


I think its ironic that Phoenix Graphics started its business because the owner could not find quality replacement stripes for his own personal T/A...........maybee some one needs to remind him his quality is slipping.

[njsteve]

Originally Posted by Rack776

I think its ironic that Phoenix Graphics started its business because the owner could not find quality replacement stripes for his own personal T/A...........maybee some one needs to remind him his quality is slipping.

I did just that when i was going back and forth with the salesman there after receiving their crappily cut hood stripe. He mentioned that the owners wouldnt spend the money to get a new template made just for a small market like ours. He also refused to give me the owner's email address or phone extension to bring it up directly with him.

[Norwood]

THEY DON'T CARE.........My car would go birdless before I spend a dime with PG direct or indirect.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

My votes would be :

Stripe for Blue car - White color to be Polar - with dot fade grahics.
(instruct owners to paint shaker 70 Polar White - its only thing exterior they have to paint white anyway.)

Stripe for White car - Blue to be Lucerne (or closest possible match) - with dot fade.

I was too young to be all over these cars when they were Day 1 new.

But to me its always looked like quack sh|t on todays restorations with stripe blue zone clashing with shaker and interior. It doesn't match anything. Maybe thats how they were back at day 1. Idunno.

But i seriously doubt the designers and stylists hoped for anything less than color uniformity/blend when they developed these things. Maybe the standard was never achieved. Or the standard was compromised/corrupted as later printings were made.

[165th]

Time for an update on the stripes development. First the hood stripe:

I measured up the NOS hood stripe this morning. The overall length is 50 3/4" and the width at it's widest spot at the rear of the shaker is 17 3/4".

Attached are some pictures, and the assembly manual stripe layout

The stripe is set at 7/8" from the front lip of the hood.
I outlined the stripe location with a silver sharpie.
The shaker opening fit perfectly around the hood opening.

The poor quality reproduction stripe has some issues I won't even bother going into.

[165th]

The width of the stripe is spot on with a Ccie3611 original paint car. Here's a pic of Brent's hood measurement and the NOS stripe. I cut one inch on the NOS stripe for a more accurate measurement.

[165th]

As far as the front bird and Trans Am letters, Formulabruce loaned his NOS bird and I have a set of NOS fender Trans Am's and a blue and white rear spoiler Trans Am.

The quality of the artwork on the front bird is awesome. I'm going to be sure the repro that is made is exactly the same.

A few interesting details:
- The hood bird is on the clear vinyl with the same 1/8" all around.
- The Trans Am letters however are silk screened on white vinyl.
- The blue on the bird and the Blue Trans Am letters is slightly different. I've reached out to the owner of the hood stripe to see if he will let me peel the transfer paper away so we can have another blue data point.
- Also, if you look closely, the letters are pretty wild, in that the tops and bottoms of the letters are not squared off, but instead arched, giving the letters much more sweeping strokes than what first appears. That really gives the letters character.

The 455 H.O. will also be added to the mix.

I will have the artwork for the hood and letters completed over the next couple of weeks. I've gotten some preliminary pricing, and by the time an entire set is considered, they won't be cheap, but they should be less than the current reproductions pricing.

I'll get a fresh count from everyone for a first run count.

[Norwood]

This is very EXCITING........and I want to say THANK YOU and a BIG OLD FU to our friends at PG and S&S. I'm ready to tear the PG CRAP off my car right now.

[RAJ7395]

I am tired of the run around from S&S and look forward to getting a couple sets of these when they are finished.

[njsteve]

Ill take a set for my white 72, please.

[Formula8]

Let me know if you get around to red letters!!!!

[Formulabruce]

Now that you mention the Color differences.. When mine were put on, in 78 I think, the guy the dealer hired to do decals and stripes did it( salesmen loved to sell pinstripes and "ralley" stripes), and he mentioned that the colors may look brighter because the material seemed different to him. he suggested that parts of my GM kit were made in different places. Sure nice to see this come together. I passed on doing a 72 TA 10 years ago for just this reason.
PS will the Vinyl "dry out" and shrink without its paper on it? If so I would get the width measured soon, and height?

[165th]

Originally Posted by Formulabruce

PS will the Vinyl "dry out" and shrink without its paper on it? If so I would get the width measured soon, and height?

Hi Bruce, good question. From what I've found handling these NOS decals, the decal is much better off without the transfer paper on top of it. The decal will not dry out. For the stripes the decal is a clear film. It’s very tough, and, well tougher for instance than the white vinyl that the letters are made from. Typically film doesn’t stretch or tear near as easily as vinyl.

The problem with all NOS decals is the transfer paper and the 'backing paper' under the decal that is preserving the adhesive are much different in type and quality. The result is differences in shrinkage and deterioration of the transfer paper over the years causes damage to the decal and the propensity of the transfer paper to glue itself to the decal.
Transfer paper is typically a low adhesive, cheap paper, whereas the backing paper is high quality to hold the decal on the paper until it's ready to be applied.

In post 53 take a look at the picture of the bird and Trans Am decals before removing the transfer paper and after. The transfer paper was deteriorated, and often times 'glued' to the decals, whereas the backing paper remains stout and holding the decal and it's remaining adhesive.

Here's a pic of the hood bird before the paper was removed. You can see the transfer paper was actually causing the decal to double up in a couple of areas because it's not the same quality as the decal or the backing paper. After removal of transfer paper, the decal took it's normal shape again on the backing paper. The other pictures depict the impact old transfer paper is having on an otherwise quality decal and backer paper.

When and if any NOS decals ever get used, the original transfer paper will have to be removed prior to application and a new transfer paper can be applied to the decal prior to mounting the decal on the car.

I hope this is helpful.

[Formulabruce]

Interesting, Great stuff, thxs for the time your putting into this!