#1  
Old 06-29-2013, 04:12 PM
ronstory ronstory is offline
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Default Newbie looking for info on 1964 Catalina

All--

First post, I'm in the process of buying a 1964 Catalina convertible, but I'm having a heck of time trying get info on the Catalina mechanical specifics. I helped a friend rebuild his 1964 Impala convertible, (rebuilt engine, 700R4, new rear-end, paint, SS brakes), but from what I can gather, the Cat is a much different animal.

I've done the normal web searches and can't seem to find info on the mechanicals like frame design, suspension parts, etc. Any pointers would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Ron
Portland, OR

  #2  
Old 06-29-2013, 05:35 PM
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64catdroptop 64catdroptop is offline
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Some parts from an Impala are interchangeable with the Catalina, but not much - cosmetic only tho. Mechanically, the Impala and Catalina are two different beasts.

Your best bet is to locate a service manual for the Catalina (1963 with 1964 supplement) and start there.

First, before you buy the car, make sure it's complete especially the side trim moldings (and make sure they are useable) as those are extremely hard to find and very costly if you do find a set (like $1500 for a decent set of the 6 pieces)

Check the rear trunk body mounts (PY has them) and frame rot under the doors is the first thing you need to check.

This is the right place to post your questions for you '64 Catalina - best forum for Pontiacs on the web.

It would likely be a 389cid engine, 2bbl carb, with the roto-hydromatic transmission (a.k.a. "slim jim"), which is a POS - but can easily be replaced by a TH400.

Performance Years has a great list of reproduction parts for the car, but some you will have to acquire via "good used" (www.indianapontiacs.com)

Ron

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  #3  
Old 06-29-2013, 06:33 PM
ronstory ronstory is offline
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Ron--

Thanks for the pointers! I'll check out the points you mentioned when looking at the car. As I continue to search the web, it becoming really clear that I have a lot to learn about Pontiacs. Now I need figure out what a 'slim jim' is...

I appreciate the help and hopefully will be Cat owner in a week.

Thanks,
Ron
Portland, OR

  #4  
Old 06-29-2013, 08:24 PM
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it is a transmission without a torque converter. that is all I know. Stevep is our resident tranny guy.
www.rareparts.com will have all your suspension parts. You can get them at Carquest as well. Warning they are expensive but peace of mind is well worth the price.
Now all you need to do is post some pictures.

patrick

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  #5  
Old 06-30-2013, 02:48 AM
ronstory ronstory is offline
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Patrick--

Thanks for the addition parts source... now I just need to work on balancing the price to title ratio.

I'm now reading up on the 389...

Stay tuned. ;^)

Thanks,
Ron

  #6  
Old 06-30-2013, 03:32 AM
tharkun8 tharkun8 is offline
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Firstly,

Welcome to the Darkside as we say..

fans of the B bodies call ourselves DARKSIDERS.. as in
once you go to the dark side etc..

Secondly, we have to see pics as soon as you have some.

Thirdly, as a fellow owner of a 64.. be ready for a little frustration..
only because it seems that 64 was a big transition year in certain respects.
Pontiac made some changes in the 64 model year that can
make some parts less common meaning its a little bigger PITA to find.

Pontiac made changes to starter mounts between 63 and 64 so you have
to look at where the starter mounts. 61-64 the starters are not mounted
to the engine block. 65 and later they are mounted to the block. From
what Ive read most 64 blocks are setup for block mounted starters (mine is)
but Im not sure ALL blocks are.

Also, Pontiac changed the intake/head setup between 64 and 65.. meaning
61-64 intakes and heads and 65-later intakes and heads are not interchangeable.
There are threads that show the differences. The result is that there is a lot of
add ons for 65-later heads/intakes but 61-64 there is not a lot.

All in all, I love my 64 but sometimes things are a little harder to find and/or
unavailable. Body panels and some trim parts (as prev mentioned) can be a
real PITA to find. Welcome to the world of B bodies.

My Bonneville does not have the slim jim trans so I cant tell you about that.
The shorter wheelbase models came with a slimjim auto in that year but the
longer wheelbase models like my Bonneville came with a diff automatic trans.
There are threads that document a change to a TH400 for the shorter wheelbase
models but I believe some minor tunnel mods are required for the change.

There are a lot of folks here who can help you with whatever you need.

Good luck and good hunting.

John

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1964 Starchief 4 Dr Sedan - 389 4Bbl - Auto - Pinehurst Green/ Gold cloth

1964 Grand Prix - 389 4 BBl w SupHyd auto

1964 Catalina Safari - 63 389 200r4 auto.. 2.69 POSI rear

1964 Bonneville Vert - 389 4bbl - Auto - Ext Color - Saddle/Saddle int

1965 2+2 - WG 421 4Bbl - 4 spd - Bluemist Slate w White/black int

1966 Ventura 4 dr Sdn - 389 4Bbl - Auto -Orig Color - Barrier Blue
  #7  
Old 06-30-2013, 07:32 AM
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The transmission in a 61-64 Catalina is the Roto Hydramatic 375 AKA Slim-Jim.

The Bonneville and Star Chief got the Dual Coupling Hydra Matic, which was far better.

This will help you to understand a little about it. BTW, it looked GREAT on paper!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_Roto...c_transmission

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  #8  
Old 06-30-2013, 10:11 PM
ronstory ronstory is offline
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All--

Thanks for the guidance and help. I think I can handle the "uniqueness" since i also own a 76 International Scout and 1995 Range Rover LWB. Weird models seems to be in my blood... the number of time when I'm trying to fix something an looking for a part the subtle manta of "... if I only had bought a Jeep", starts to cross one's mind.

OK... I bought it and pick it up on the 10th. Let the adventure begin.

Thanks,
Ron


Last edited by ronstory; 06-30-2013 at 10:26 PM. Reason: spelling
  #9  
Old 07-01-2013, 02:43 PM
AZ64GP AZ64GP is offline
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Congrats on your purchase, Ron! Let's see some pics!

I purchased a '64 Grand Prix, which sat in a dirt lot for 15+ years, about two years ago. My car is a work in progress and will be for a while. I'm on this forum all the time. As others have said in this thread, you have come to the right place to find info about your car. The members in this forum and their knowledge is invaluable. You name the topic or the question, and there's probably a thread for it in this forum. Use the search button at the top of this forum on the topic you are inquiring about, and if you can't find what you are looking for, ask away.

Good luck!

Chris

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Old 07-01-2013, 03:16 PM
ronstory ronstory is offline
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All--

Here you go... Ron


  #11  
Old 07-01-2013, 07:32 PM
mike nixon mike nixon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronstory View Post
All--

Thanks for the guidance and help. I think I can handle the "uniqueness" since i also own a 76 International Scout and 1995 Range Rover LWB. Weird models seems to be in my blood... the number of time when I'm trying to fix something an looking for a part the subtle manta of "... if I only had bought a Jeep", starts to cross one's mind.

OK... I bought it and pick it up on the 10th. Let the adventure begin.

Thanks,
Ron
F&$% the Jeeps, Scouts are the COOL 4x4 compact!
You'll enjoy your Pontiac once you get to put some miles on it. That's what these cars are all about
Welcome to the forums.

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  #12  
Old 07-01-2013, 09:52 PM
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Welcome aboard!!

Your droptop represents the DarkSide very nicely!

  #13  
Old 07-02-2013, 01:01 AM
ronstory ronstory is offline
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Thanks! I just ordered the 1964 Pontiac service manuals from ebay... so I've got some reading to do.

Apparently there is a some seeping occasionally at the radiator and it's missing the fan shroud plus there oil leak on the front of the engine. BTW, anything is better than fighting a rear main leak on an IH V8. That is one of my many definitions of "inconveniently located".

Also, while I'm in there I'll like drop a Aluminum radiator and since the shroud is missing anyways I'll probably install an electric fan and a SPAL controller... been happy with the combo on several vehicles.

Are all early water pumps (1964) 11 bolts water pumps created equal? I normally look for a 'high-flow' version, but can seem to find anything for the early 389.

Thanks,
Ron
'64 Cat Convertible (soon - July 10th)


Last edited by ronstory; 07-02-2013 at 01:01 AM. Reason: spelling
  #14  
Old 07-02-2013, 01:07 AM
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64 should be an 8 bolt pump, it it still has the timing cover it was born with.

if you have to pull the harmonic balancer, it's a slip fit on a Pontiac so the bolt is tight (160 ft lbs iicr)

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  #15  
Old 07-02-2013, 01:25 AM
ronstory ronstory is offline
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(sigh) Yes, you are correct... I looked at the engine photo from 3 angles and there only 5 bolts visible on the top half. So I have a 8 bolt, but most of the pages (like Butler Perf) seem to refer anything performance as something like "8-Bolt 1965-68 Pontiac Hi Volume Cast Iron Water Pump". Will a 1965 work or is there some other change?

Thanks for the warning on the harmonic balancer. I need to get in there to check since I may not have a roller timing chain. Unless the dark-side is immune to need such technology.

Boy, do I have a lot to learn....

Thanks,
Ron
'64 Cat Convertible (soon - July 10th)

  #16  
Old 07-02-2013, 01:43 AM
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63 1/2 to 65 was the same water pump, p/n changed in 66 but I am pretty sure they are the same also.

required reading about the water pumps...and divider plates.
http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=411256

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  #17  
Old 07-02-2013, 07:29 AM
gregneun gregneun is offline
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Default Really nice car

Welcome, nice car ya got there, probably Marimba Red for 1964. The data plate, located on the firewall will provide the factory color code, as well as other info.

The engine code is located below the head mating surface on the passenger, front side. It is a two digit number combined with a letter. Something like 26K, this will help ID the factory specs.

Fan shrouds only came on AC cars, they're stamped steel and you can certainly install one when you find one.

Welcome again,
Greg

  #18  
Old 07-04-2013, 12:41 PM
ronstory ronstory is offline
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OK... I'm not smarter on darkside water pumps. I'll start a new thread on the adventure that begins early July 10th with a flight to pick up the Cat 300 miles away. I'll also be looking for opinions & suggestions for improvements needed for it fit into the garage with the rest of it's roommates.

The roommates have three categories, comfort, cool, crazy. The cat will slide into the 'cool' category.

Thanks,
Ron

  #19  
Old 07-04-2013, 01:41 PM
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Greg Reid Greg Reid is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronstory View Post
All--

Here you go... Ron



I was not expecting to see a car that nice. That's a beauty!
By the way, happened to notice this in the classifieds...Not sure if it's applicable-
http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=731551

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Last edited by Greg Reid; 07-04-2013 at 01:58 PM.
  #20  
Old 07-04-2013, 04:28 PM
ronstory ronstory is offline
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Ahh... if only I was closer. I would want to take a look at the AC unit. ;^)

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