[android 211]

My fresh 455 is smoking like a worn out engine, need advice. Its pretty basic, .030 over, 068 cam with 1.65 rockers, cast iron intake and '96' heads. It has 1 and 5/8ths headers. Cast rings. Last fall it suffered bearing failure after about 1,000 miles so I removed it and had it rebuilt, different shop. It was dynoed at 367hp (4500 rpm) and 524 torque (3000 rpm) then it was installed. Once it was in I was pretty happy with how it ran and I checked the oil after a few days and it was really high. The shop must have put in 8 or 9 quarts. I just had abdominal surgery so I wasn't crawling around under the car so I went to a oil change shop and he drained it and put in synthetic. I never would of done that if I knew. I drained it a few days later and put in regular oil.
Now it seems as though the rings aren't seating. The plugs are dark brown not oily. Sometimes I start it when cold and it smokes a lot but not always. When it is fully warmed up and I have to sit in traffic a long time it smokes blue smoke an embarrassing amount. I doesn't smoke cruising down the highway at speed. It has plenty of power. The oil usage actually seems low for how much it smokes. It idles smooth. I haven't done a compression check yet.
I doubt its sucking ATF, the smoke has a blue tinge. The trans level is fine. If I drive it enough will the rings seat eventually?

[steve25]

Is it smoking out of both tail pipes as seen when someone drives behind you?
If so something might be up with intake valve seals .

[mgarblik]

From your description, I just wonder if some oil is making it into the combustion area around valve cover bolts that may break into intake ports? You didn't say what it has for heads. Also, possibly the exhaust system and mufflers have oil in them from running the extremely high oil level for a while. It can take a long time to get oil out of the exhaust system. Point being it may not be a mechanical issue. Just a left over too much oil issue. Hope that's the case. I see now that you have #96 iron heads. The valve cover bolt holes should be blind. Unless someone has been messing around in there.

[android 211]

It smokes out of both tailpipes the same. Valve stem seals has occurred to me; the smoke isn't bad under full acceleration. I guess that's something that could be fixed with engine still in car.

[android 211]

The longer it idles the more it smokes. Disconnecting the PCV valve makes no difference and nothing comes out of the grommet hole when I pull the PCV valve out. It isn't stuck, the check ball is loose inside.

["QUICK-SILVER"]

What does it have for valve stem seals?

Clay

[Ben M.]

Sounds like valve seals. I had teflon on a set of heads that I got redone years ago, smoked pretty good after a few thousand miles just like that.

[mgarblik]

Valve seals are certainly a possibility. If they used the little square cut O-ring seals and for some reason decided not to use the sheet metal shields, it will smoke badly. Also those little O-ring seals MUST be installed after the spring is compressed or they just get pushed down the valve stem and do nothing. Seals that snap on the guides or umbrella seals generally will not smoke like this when new unless the wrong size or cut during installation.

[android 211]

What valve stem seals should I use, can they be installed with the heads still on the engine?

[steve25]

Please post the best close up pictures you can of the valve seal in side one of the valve springs with the valve closed.

This assumes that when the heads where rebuilt that positive seals where installed on the tops of at least the intake guides.

The info of what seals where used in this case should be on your bill for the machine work.

If you do not see any seals on the top of at least the intake valve guides the the heads are still running the stock type O ring that resides in the bottom of the spring retainer, and many times even packaged up new ones that come in gasket sets are junk.

When there junk and after there used a while and the motor sits for a few months they dry rot like made and then just fall apart.

Also if the heads are still stock in this way the springs must still be assembled with the cup like oil splash shield on them, other wise you will burn oil even if the valve stem O rings are good.

A buddy of mind a few years ago bough aftermarket heads that where assembled with the wrong seals and one the motor got up to operating temp and the oil started to get close the coolant temp then at idle with every cylinder that fired a light puff of blue smoke would come out the tail pipes.

Also to answer your question, yes the seals can be changed out with the heads on the motor , but you will need a specific spring compressor to do that.

[android 211]

I'll take some pictures in a couple days when I'm off. Thanks

[chiphead]

Had the same thing happen on a fresh Chevy six. The shop didn't install seals on the exhaust. New motor and it smoked like hell, esp at idle or pulling away from a stop. Installing vitons solved it

[TCSGTO]

I’m pretty sure if you use the o-ring seals you have to use factory spring retainers. The aftermarket retainers aren’t long enough to capture the oring.
So if the shop replaced the retainers and used stock seals that may be the problem.

[lust4speed]

Just a clarification on the PCV valve. It can shake and rattle and sound fine and still be a piece of junk. Leave it out and go for at least a 10 mile spirited drive and see if the smoke decreases. Once the oil coats everything from intake to exhaust pipes it takes some time to purge it.

It will be interesting to see the photos of what the shop actually used for oil control. Could be anything right now including insufficient seal to retainer clearance and the seals have been beaten to death.

[77 TRASHCAN]

Originally Posted by lust4speed

Just a clarification on the PCV valve. It can shake and rattle and sound fine and still be a piece of junk. Leave it out and go for at least a 10 mile spirited drive and see if the smoke decreases. Once the oil coats everything from intake to exhaust pipes it takes some time to purge it.

It will be interesting to see the photos of what the shop actually used for oil control. Could be anything right now including insufficient seal to retainer clearance and the seals have been beaten to death.

X2, and are you using a stock type valley pan?

[android 211]

I'm using a stock valley pan. If I went from 1.5 ratio rockers to 1.6 ratio rockers, could the retainers be hitting the seal and damaging it?

[steve25]

Bingo!

[android 211]

I can't see that adding .04" to total lift made the retainer crush the valve stem seal and damage it. The machinist is a big Pontiac guy and was aware I was adding the 1.65 ratio rockers. He checked for bind. I tried to take a picture but it has dual springs and the factory splash shields. You can't see anything. I'm going to take it out for a 500 mile round trip and see if it begins to make any difference.

[steve25]

Even a 50 mile long highway drive at 2500 rpm will be enough to burn out any oil from the overfill that’s May be coating the exhaust system!

[1969400HO]

Following here.
Not sure vlv stem seals on EXH will smoke as they have NEG pressure form Exhaust blowing , intake draws in vacuum so they might be part but not the exhaust side.

Changing RR to 1.65 likely isn't the culprit here IMO.
Possibly wrong intake gasket fit leaking. Yet that woudindice a air fuel ratio issue too.
Both side possibly oil is getting by int intake.
I Hate to een mention rings did not seal or end gap wrong etc.
I would think he did check end gap properly as std procedure.
I had a bad set of rings once in my 428 Ford that smoked lightly. easy oil consumption sound like gaskets failing.