#81  
Old 03-24-2011, 12:00 AM
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Joe,
I bet you and your son could never guess why my favorite part of "Glory Days" is in "Introduction Chapter" at the top. In the introduction, opening, paragraph where Jim talks about Woodward Ave.
Eric
Very cool. We really enjoy reading his book. Jeffrey reads it to me as it has become quite difficult for me to read type in general. At least on the computer I can enlarge the fonts etc.

  #82  
Old 03-24-2011, 11:01 AM
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This is a great poster isn't it? Very well done. If you look closely there is a hood tac on the bird which it never had.
AND the Blackbird is the only car in the print without a license plate on it. The car always had a front plate.
In local ads for the poster it states, "Mechanic & driver Addison is racing and beating a well known 1968 black Pontiac, Firebird".
Hmmm, a hood tac, no license plate and no owner name.....editorial license!
LOL After all Sullivan did pay for the posters to be made.
Harold is going to have this poster painted on the back wall of one of his garages that is 65' wide and approximately 30' deep. Harold does have a very beautiful home with that is flanked by two of these 65' garages facing each other and attached to the home. The home and garages make up a court yard with pavers that is behind a high brick wall with metal entrance gates.

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Last edited by Dr. Eric M. Schiffer; 03-24-2011 at 11:12 AM.
  #83  
Old 03-24-2011, 11:13 AM
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Joe,
So you figured out why I liked the introduction?
Eric

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  #84  
Old 03-24-2011, 11:46 AM
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This is a great thread, Thanks a lot DR. Schiffer for all the stories that have not been told. I just recently moved to Toledo, OH. Moving here from San Diego, Ca. where I had the great oppurtunity to meet Jim Wangers and spending quality time picking his brain and spending time at his shop in Oceanside also got to see some of his cars street race a few years back. Pontiac's are my 1st love and Mopar my 2nd, I own samples of both, the "SIlver Bullet" story has always intrigued me, I had always heard about the Firebird and GTX story but reading your post has made it more clear.
It was always fun in San Diego when going to the only 2 clubs I belonged to, Pontiac and Mopar, club meetings and stirring the pot about this subject, the funny thing was that no less than 4 guys were like me both Pontiac and Mopar fans, the disscussion would get very heated in both venues. Jim would come to some of the Pontiac meetings, I would of like to invite him to the Mopar meeting one day so he could say how and what really happened on Woodward.
Hope to meet you one day and see the "Blackbird" now that I live so close to the Detroit area.
Thanks for the good read.
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  #85  
Old 03-24-2011, 04:07 PM
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Joe,
So you figured out why I liked the introduction?
Eric
My son is looking for the book so we can re-read the opening. It's been a while since he had read the book to me so now that this has been brought up looks like we are going to do it again. My son can't get enough of this stuff anyway so he is looking forward to nightly readings once again.

It is great to read your posts on here as well. The facts, info and stories are interesting to all of us and much appreciated.

We are getting ready to redo Jeffrey's room and we are going to do so in a Pontiac theme. His passion for Pontiacs and specifically the Fiero is nice to see in a young person Jeffrey's age so we want to encourage his passion and support it in every way...

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Old 03-24-2011, 07:08 PM
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NavyChief: welcome to Ohio Why didn't you bring that San Diego weather with you?

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Old 03-25-2011, 09:21 AM
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NavyChief: welcome to Ohio Why didn't you bring that San Diego weather with you?
I did and it lasted about a month I guess it decided to go back to San Diego
I tell you I am having a hard time seeing my cars sit in the garage 4 months, I am going crazy.
Thanks for the welcome.

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Old 03-28-2011, 01:37 PM
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Question was asked if the 10.70 Mopar Super Stocker was Addison's '67 GTX "Silver Bullet". The answer is NO! The Hemi Super Stocker that the Blackbird raced was a lettered race car and not the "Sliver Bullet". The Blackbird raced that Super Stocker on two different occations in an industrail park off Telegraph Rd near Plymouth Rd.

The Blackbird beat the Hemi Super Stocker in first race without having to go all out. It was realized that the bird had plenty more horse power then the Mopar and beat him just enough to make it look close. The Mopar wanted a re- match in a few weeks because he didn't feel his car was running right. (Not unusual feeling after losing)

At the second race a Mopar engine development engineer, but a Pontiac fan, Greg Douglas used his Hemi Cuda as the finish line. Greg had Jim Wangers on board and they used Greg's headlights as the finish line. This time the Blackbird used all most all of its power and crossed Greg's headlight beams several car lengths a head of the lettered Hemi Mopar Super Stocker. The owner of the Hemi Super Stocker did not want another rematch. He was convinced that Pontiacs could run.

Greg Douglas told me that he used to make a lot of money betting on the Blackbird back then. As usual, some people thought Pontiacs could not run. They would think it had a Chevy under the hood. They lost on that bet too.

A few years ago I ran across a gentleman by the name of Pat Moran at a local automotive/Hot Rod place called Motor City Steel. I had the Blackbird on Display in their showroom next to a silver '67 GTX called "The Orginal Bullet". (This is not Addison's GTX, long Story) Pat said he remembered back in the day seeing a very fast black Firebird that looked like my car. It had been owned by Jim Wangers. Pat said he watched the Firebird baddly beat a lettered Hemi Mopar Super Stocker off Telegraph Rd. I told him that this is that car. For the next several minutes Pat just kept walking around the Bird and smiling as if he had come across a long lost friend.
Wow, another great story about the history of the Blackbird. I would love to hear more, or even some good street racing stories about other Royal prepared cars.

  #89  
Old 03-29-2011, 08:43 PM
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So I guess the real king of Woodward was the blackbird?

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Old 03-30-2011, 02:33 PM
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Chief, Go to our Royal Pontiac Of America Club site and lear about our activites. www.Royalpontiac.org. There is an application there also. We have several Ohio members. You will ba able to attend the Dream Cruise with the Club on Woodward Ave at Jim Fresard Buick. Jim Fresard bought Royal Pontiac when it was in Royal Oak in 1971. The moved the Dealership onto Woodward just a few years ago. We will meet some of Jim Wangers' old drivers and Royal employees. You'll get a real history lesson from people who were there.
I've been to Jim Wangers Ocean Side and the old Vista offices when I've been in town. I was at Jim's 80th and hope to attend his 85th birthday in June.

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Last edited by Dr. Eric M. Schiffer; 03-30-2011 at 03:17 PM.
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Old 03-30-2011, 02:38 PM
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Model J...as I stated in the very begining of this thread....There was a new Fastest car every night of the week. The Blackbird got beat and so did just about every car who raced around the Detroit area. These cars where constantly being improved with the lastest equiptment out of all GM divisions, Chrysler and Ford. Not to mention, out of Booth and Aaron's, Total Performance, Gapp and Rousch etc....

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Old 03-30-2011, 06:11 PM
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I was friends with and went to school for one of the mechanics that restored cars for Harold. He rebuilt the engine in the Silver Bullet when it was being restored. He now works for Chrysler. Always had wicked fast Mopars in High school, his dad has a 67GTX and a lime green 71 GTX. His name is Jeff Reif, and is mentioned several times in many Mopar publications.

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Old 03-30-2011, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
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Model J...as I stated in the very begining of this thread....There was a new Fastest car every night of the week. The Blackbird got beat and so did just about every car who raced around the Detroit area. These cars where constantly being improved with the lastest equiptment out of all GM divisions, Chrysler and Ford. Not to mention, out of Booth and Aaron's, Total Performance, Gapp and Rousch etc....
Thank's for coming back on that Dr. Schiffer. I have a love for all American muscle cars. Back in the late 70's I raced my cuda in mass. and the car probably won 90% of it's races. I still have it and I'm restoring it. Its a 440-6 dana 4 spd. car. I never blew it up and even overrevved the hell out of it when the clutch rod bent. It just seemed like the thread was headed towards Mopars are dogs and that isn't true. The Blackbird is a VERY impressive car. It had great torque and hooked up! I want to go to Woodward too! O.K. everybody can dog me now cause I have a Cuda. For big cars though nothing finer than a 69-72 G.P. Mike

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Old 03-31-2011, 09:10 PM
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You have to understand the "Fastest Cars", and there were many of them, in the Detroit area were running in the low 10's high 9's in the early-mid 70's. You will find a great article about our Thursday Night "High End Club" gatherings, that began in the '50's, on I-696 in the October 1976 issue of "Car and Driver". There are several pictures of some of the cars that would run with us.
Well worth the search on e-bay. This will give you a lot better understanding of the difference of Detroit's street racing and the rest of the country's main street action.....

Don't get me wrong we had many cars running that where 15 second cars to 12 seconds would also meet on Thursday night, too.

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Last edited by Dr. Eric M. Schiffer; 03-31-2011 at 09:18 PM.
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Old 04-01-2011, 06:03 AM
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You have to understand the "Fastest Cars", and there were many of them, in the Detroit area were running in the low 10's high 9's in the early-mid 70's. You will find a great article about our Thursday Night "High End Club" gatherings, that began in the '50's, on I-696 in the October 1976 issue of "Car and Driver". There are several pictures of some of the cars that would run with us.
Well worth the search on e-bay. This will give you a lot better understanding of the difference of Detroit's street racing and the rest of the country's main street action.....

Don't get me wrong we had many cars running that where 15 second cars to 12 seconds would also meet on Thursday night, too.
Our cars in Mass. and N.H. weren't quite that fast but there were a couple of real quick Baldwin Motion cars.I.ll research that article. Thank's for the tip Dr. Schiffer.

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Old 04-01-2011, 12:38 PM
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You will find a great article about our Thursday Night "High End Club" gatherings, that began in the '50's, on I-696 in the October 1976 issue of "Car and Driver". There are several pictures of some of the cars that would run with us.
...
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Old 04-01-2011, 12:40 PM
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  #98  
Old 04-01-2011, 06:18 PM
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Tenny,
Thank you for saving every one time looking for the article. I believe I told you that Joe left the Ford camp and now has a CTSV coupe built by Ligenfelter pushing round 800 HP. Joe always hated it when Jim Wangers would beat him. Fredie Foreman drove Jim Wangers red '75 Monza against Joe's Gapp and Roush built Mustang II pictured in this "Car and Driver" article. Joe used to say " what is it going to take to beat you Wangers?" Ahhh the old days.

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Old 04-01-2011, 06:32 PM
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Bet that V Coupe's fun, Eric! The C&D protagonists/antagonists are still around (a drivetrain, or so, later) ...
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  #100  
Old 04-02-2011, 03:12 AM
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I spotted the '67 GTX, Silver Bullett up for sale in the Classifieds one Sunday, approximately 1975, for around $3,000-$3,500 minus engine.
It was about this time I spotted an acid dipped Dodge Demon body inside Addison's Sunoco station on Woodward. The car never came out. Addison later told people that was to be the next Silver Bullet. But the body was weakened by the dipping and Chrysler Corp. was no longer interested in the street racing project. Addison didn't have the money to continue the project and scraped the Dodge Demon. So ended Addison's street racing.
The cars that appeared in the October 1976 "Car and Driver" were better engineered then both the Silver Bullet and the Blackbird. Besides after all the racing action these two cars had seen with the twisting of their body's and frames these two cars were worn out. Metal fatigue slows these cars down as well.
Fred Foreman, driver of Wangers 1975 Monza, calculated that the Monza ran in the low 9's high 8's at it's peak. This was much faster then either the Blackbird or the Silver Bullet ever went.
The Monza, minus engine and trans, ended up with Ed Dufrene about 10 years ago after sitting for years in Wangers Detroit shop. Ed never drove the car he just took it as severance pay when he left Jim Wangers employment in California. He headed from California to Detroit. Picked up the car and took it to his new home in Florida never to be heard from again.
To say Fred Foreman was upset about Ed snatching the Monza would be an understatement. After all the work he put into the car he would have loved to have bought it from Jim if he knew it was for sale.

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Last edited by Dr. Eric M. Schiffer; 04-02-2011 at 03:24 AM.
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