[dpoltzer]

I have a water pump pulley # 4810 40XT and a crank pulley #4810 38YB. These came with my 1969 V-8 FB with PS, PB and AC but I need to know if they are correct.. I am not going to run AC going forward. Can anyone tell me if these pulleys are correct for my car and will they work or will I need different pulleys. Thanks much.

['ol Pinion head]

Both are '71 & later usage, A/C usage pullies designed to line up with '71 & later traditional Pontiac V8 Alt- P/S pump bracketry & pump pulleys.

[Bird_collector]

Proper water pump pulley will also be determined by if you are still running the original style 1969 4" water pump (original casting number# 9796351) or if your engine has the revised 4-1/2" water pump from 1970 (originally cast as 9799124). There was a Service Bulletin relating to this. Sorry, I don't have pulley part numbers available off hand.


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['ol Pinion head]

Style of brackets & pullies go hand in hand. Mixing & matching various pieces from one style to another does not work.

If the brackets, AC pulleys, & Alt/PS setup in your '70 T/A are original '70 V8 pieces, & you want to to replicate the '70 V8 Bird set, you will need the '70 Bird non AC wp & crank pulley.

[Bird_collector]

Deleted duplicate response

[dpoltzer]

The W.P. Is an 11 bolt reman unit. I believe it is a 4.0" but not sure where to measure it? Should I measure from the back edge of the casting to the front edge of the casting or do I include the impellor hub that the pulley bolts to? Dave

[Bird_collector]

You would measure from back edge of casting to pulley mounting surface. It helps to lay a straight edge on the pulley surface to measure accurately. What is the engine date code? You mentioned that the pulleys came with your 69 Firebird, but not necessarily that the engine is from a 69.


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[dpoltzer]

Took the measurement and it is 4.5 inches. Motor is a 1970 WS. The pulleys came with the car but they are 1971 or newer so I will source correct pulleys soon. Dave

[Bird_collector]

On my 70 WS non-A/C T/A the water pump pulley is marked 480511 XW and the power steering pulley is 480513 YM. 4-1/2" is correct for 70. Hope this helps.


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[dpoltzer]

Thanks Bird Collector. I wonder if those Pulley #s will work with my 1969 Alternator and PS pump and brackets?

['ol Pinion head]

The '70 only V8 Bird WP & PS pulleys are designed to only lne up with the '70 Firebird V8 Alt/PS setup.

Put first correct setup together for a 70 YZ T/A engine near 40 years ago. Have pieced near a dozen '70 Bird sets together since then. Assembling that first '70 Bird accessory set in the early 80's is what set me on a mission learning all of the '67-68, 69, 70, & '71 & later pulley & bracket set ups.

[dpoltzer]

Got correct original GM, WP Pulley and Crank Pulley installed along with all brackets! Alternator pulley/belts lines up perfectly with other two pulleys. The last issue is that the reproduction PS pump pulley does not not line up properly. The PS pulley is 3/8" too close to the engine side so the belt does not line up true with the other two pulleys. I don't think you can properly shim the pulley outward, based on the design of the components. Is anyone aware of a way to shim the pulley or could this be a flaw in the design of the aftermarket PS pulleys? Thanks.

['ol Pinion head]

With correct '70 Firebird V8 only pulleys, reads like you have a mismatch on the alt/PS side.
The brackets are 70 V8 Bird only?
along with the 70 V8 Bird PS pulley 480513?

[dpoltzer]

Thx OPH, The motor is a 1970 WS but the brackets, pulleys, PS pump etc. are now all 1969 parts. The PS Pump pulley is aftermarket and I suspect to be the issue? If anyone has a pulley for a 1969 PS pump , maybe they could measure the thickness or "off set" of the pulley and post it as this may be my issue? Thanks

['ol Pinion head]

AAAH, not a '70, gotcha. With a '69 Bird, with non AC & PS, you'll need a "900" PS pulley. Have several still on original pumps. Will PM you when get out into the shop.

[Cammer-6]

This would be right up there with wonders of the world as to why
they changed this crap every year.
As stated unless the car is unmolested or built by someone with knowledge
and patience ,it could be a mess trying to figure out . Assembly manual is your friend here.

['ol Pinion head]

Parts like pulleys & bracket sets changed as there was an evolution of improvements, that's it.
Few examples of engine accessory packaging changes:
-Pulley grooves became wider & deeper for '67 Pontiac V8 models.
-The damper design changed to a more modern design which in the end created less cost, less room to storealive rent versions & less labor to install. Result, the first 4 bolt style crank pulleys (which were interchangeable for several years).
-Cooling improvements brought the 11 bolt timing cover/water pump for '69 models, a new stagger of wp pulleys was required; the "059-062's"

Body style constraints & packaging:
-'69 Pontiac V8 engines were originally built with the 4" hub height "351" casting water pump. It was realized that there a tight fit issue in the late '69 production V8 Firebirds if the 1970 wp was factory installed OR later used as a service procedure. This is esp noticeable in the performance applications with the 5 blade flex fan & the very short (& tough to find) fan spacer. Simply put, if the 1/2" taller '70 water pump & correponding '70 A-BG series wp pulley is substituted, it jambs the fan into the shroud that much further & creates a clearance issue.

-Another example of specific body style packaging of engine accessories can be noted with the low hood line of the '70 Birds. This required an alternator that sat lower. As a result, the '70 F V8 Alt/PS set-up came to be for that short 8 month time frame. In planning the new '71 models, a new Alt/PS setup was introduced which fit all chassis with a Pontiac V8

In respect to the '69 model Pontiac V8 cooling systems, would like to again, note there is no such thing as a "1969 1/2 water pump". The first tall 11 bolt water pumps, "124" castings, were introduced in August of 1969 for 1970 Pontiac V8's, period. Ames & Butler & any other company attempting to serve folks with repro parts should fess up & delete any misleading "69 1/2" terminology. These companys could also note 69 Firebird V8's continued to use the 4" hub height "351" casting water pump up through the end of '69 Firebird production.

[rdl]

Ames lists a few reproduction water pumps for '69 Firebirds depending on application and dates. I currently have what I believe is a replacement pump that was installed in the early 80's, being casting #9796351 with date code E059 "F" (with the dreaded stamped steel impeller). My car was built in January of '69. Ames offers #9796351 - H158 "A"; or, 9799124 - A249 [which seems wrong as this casting was seemingly introduced in mid-69] "8"; or, 9799124 - H249 "8". Ideally, I think the #9796351 with an A249 date would be the most correct combination. Failing that being available, is the H158 date the closest combination I should use?

Also, is the correct reading of the example date codes: E=month; 05=day; 9=year?