[Greg Reid]

I plugged in 2000 square feet. It was right at $2 and change per sq. ft. I used Atlanta as a location since it's the closest to me on that list. If you play with the calculator, you'll see that price varies by location even within a given state.

[Ed Fitzgerald]

Greg your estimate calculator seems on the low side. (to me). I've done quite a few re and re's over the years and while I haven't done any as of the last few years I will chime in my 2 cents worth for what it's worth. The bare minimum base I would use over that Georgia clay is 1 foot of granulars. From your picture is that limestone/dolomite or calcite in your drive. They may make bricks from that Georgia mud but not without adding binding agents and baking it. The base needs to be compacted to a procter density of 97/98% super modified. Basically a 10 ton vibrating roller being used as the driveway is wet down. Then I would add a couple of inches of A gravel (5/8") over that 3" that you have now. Up here Frost is our biggest cocern, for you it is rain. When the clay gets saturated it loses it's elasticity/plasticity and will give way. That is why it is so crucial for the base not to move. Pavement afterall is much like the old linoleum flooring. If you installed it (linoleum) over worn pine boards and you didn't lay new subfloor in several years all the creases would show through. If the base moves then the pavement will crack and open up even under minimal loads. I am always more concerned about the depth and compaction of the subbase then I am the thickness of the pavement to a point. I also specify a minimum of 2" rolled with a dual ride on flat drum 2 ton roller. Another thing to ask is if they are using HL-2 or HL-3 mixture. One is commercial grade with more stone/less sand and the other vice a versa. If you want to bust there balls some more ask them about the % tar in their bitumen (the black tar in the pavement) I just recently learned a major player up here is cutting theirs with diesel fuel--- I never liked their work and I was told the other day from a recently retired supervisor this info. Make sure they use the paver to lay the pavement in the driveway as it is harder for them to cheat the depth then if they do it by hand. Check the edges for the depth and don't go by the 45* edge they put on because it will look like 2-3" and the middle could be as little as an inch. FYI,,,I was getting 2 bucks a sq/ft back in the nineties ('91-'92) so it seems a little suspect to me. Then again at that time there were guys doing it for $.80 sq/ft. I loved it when they did a laneway on the same street. Their customer would tell mine what a job they got for less than half the money. I always told them to save that extra money to buy a new lawnmower because they would need it to cut the weeds off the drive next spring. Sure enough one winter (freeze/thaw cycle) and it would be starting to ripple and crack. Within that summer I would get 3-4 calls from neighbours on that street wanting theirs done no questions asked. As they say when the sweetness of the low price has worn off the bitterness of poor quality remains forever. Ed

[Greg Reid]

Thanks Ed. That's good info. I'm not worried about the clay. You'd have to use a pickax and go down at least 12 inches to get to it under this 25 years worth of gravel and crusher run. I know. I've done it when I buried a wire. It's incredibly hard to go more than 3 or 4 inches down.
I don't know what the gravel is made from. It's pea sized.
Just as a point of interest, there is a LOT of granite in this area. Almost impossible to dig a hole here without having to remove huge granite boulders. When you hit one, you don't know if it's as large as a basketball or a Volkswagen....literally. There are spots right here on my road, where single slabs of granite show at the ground's surface for 1000 square feet. It gives well-diggers fits around here.
The grass and weeds do worry me....but to be honest, I could live with that although I'd prefer to avoid it.

As for pricing, we'll see how that goes. If the prices are as steep as you predict, I'll just keep living with the dirt. I think the prices here are quite a bit cheaper than in Canada.....and probably cheaper than most places in the continental U.S. outside of the southeastern part.

[PonchoV8]

Stone Mountain. I thought it was a lifestyle.

[Greg Reid]

Yeah, that Stone Mtn. vein runs deep and wide.

[sdbob]

The only concern I would have (my stone driveway is the same as yours-12" thick but has many yrs of dirt leaves etc.)would be the drainage of any h20 that might get into the base then expand when the temp falls and possibly 'heave the new driveway.I've talked to guys about paving mine general consenus is leave the sub-base in place and level the existing. If you can get 'millings' or 'rap' same product(recycled asphalt pavement) as someone said that would work. Sometimes contractors look for places to dump this product. In this day and age here in Pa. almost all rap goes back to the plant ot be added to new asphalt in proportion. I've never used rap but couple of friends-farmers say it does work. Generally-1 yd of concrete will cover 80 sq ft at 4" thick. I've never estmated asphalt. I would think 3" plus 1-1/2 top would work. There is in Pa. asphalt types-9.5 mm (the max stone size is 1/2"),19mm max stone size of 1",25mm-max stone size of 1-1/2". I know 1 guy who used 4" of 19mm for his drive and it is working(he is an aspahlt tech at a plant). One plant here the price for a ton of 25mm is 53.50,19mm is 50.50,9.5mm is 60.50. Coverage I'm not sure / ton.

[ho428]

I would think being in Georgia you could get the gravel graded smooth, compacted and paved right over it with asphalt as is.
We did my grandparents driveway many years back that was gravel for decades, about 100 yards total as well. Paved probably about 1 1/2-2" thick, it's still there 30 years later. Only issues have been tree roots making speed bumps in it over 3 decades. We also sealed any cracks as they appeared over time.

Not a lot of frost heave issues in our SE area to worry about.

[Greg Reid]

You guys have given me some good basics so I'll at least seem to speak English when I talk to someone.
I walked it off today and my rough estimate was close...It's about 150' around my roundabout. It's about 15' wide but I don't have a problem leaving a couple of feet either side and just do 12' feet width.
I'm going to wait until after T'giving at least before I get serious about having someone out. I'll probably put the job off until it starts getting a bit hotter.
Yeah, cold weather is of little concern here. We only have a couple of months that really see cold weather and usually even that is mild by Northern standards...Rarely drops below 20 degrees F.

[rexs73gto]

Gerg when I did my driveway I had about 15' wide & total of 40 long' long & it cast me $ 1250.00, & that was in 91. I had checked to see what haveing cement put in the same place by a local guy that is an aquaintence & a car guy to. He gave me an est. of $ 5300.00 to do the same job. I thought he was way out of line so I got 2 more est.'s for ther cement & the other 2 were within a couple hundred dollors of each. 1 was higher & 1 was lower. So be perpared for a BIG difference in price for cement va blacktop. Of course I went with the blacktop . The only thing depending on the weather you will have to recoat it about every 3-7 years. I 've used the expensive top coatiny & the less expensive top coating to. I've found very little difference in the syuff you buy at Lowes or home depot, or menards. They all seem to be the same in quality , just different in price.

[Greg Reid]

rexs73gto,
I know about the difference in price. As I mentioned in one of the earlier posts, I had a guy give me an estimate many years ago for concrete and it was into 5 figures. I put that out of my head right then.
Your price for the asphalt seems in the ballpark for my estimates. In other words, a little more than 3 times what you paid for what I want done.

[Stuckinda60s]

A question for Ed.

Would there be any advantage to rolling a layer of modified, an inch or so, over blacktop? It might make a surface which would allow you to jack on it and also possibly keep vehicles from sinking into it during hot weather. I've wondered about that in the past. I don't really see any reason for installing a driveway that way, but have wondered about doing it over an existing driveway. A good modified isn't really unattractive.

My upper driveway is modified over gravel. I had a tri-axle of GOOD, no dirt modified delivered and I graded it, myself, with a 4-wheeler and farm tractor. There was already a good base of gravel and I just dumped the modified over it. It's the same level as our lawn.

Within a year it was as if it had been paved. It's level and doesn't wash in heavy rains, doesn't rut, vehicles don't sink into it and you can jack on it or put a vehicle on jack stands. It also doesn't track into the house and there's no maintenance. It's been in for at least 10-years and I've done nothing to it. It's not as attractive as blacktop, but that and washout on a slope are the only problems I see with it. It's also very cheap. If I remember, it was less than $400.

It needed to be weathered before it packed down but, after it did, it was like iron. I did it in the fall and it was a well-packed surface for the next spring. We had a pretty hard winter, and it survived being plowed. Gravel would have become part of our lawn if it had been plowed without shoes on the plow.

[Greg Reid]

I meant to ask this after reading Ed's post... explain to me what is meant by the term 'modified' in this context?

[Stuckinda60s]

Modified is crushed rock. It's used on "dirt" roads in the country, lower scale development roads, driveways and for shoulders. The good stuff has no dirt in it, it's pure rock dust. Some crushers will add dirt to the process. That stuff doesn't last.

What Ed was talking about was a density compaction test. It's basically how hard a soil sample can be compressed and determines how much load it will support.

[Greg Reid]

Thanks. I know what you're talking about now. They do that on my road to an extent. You can see crap in it sometimes...sticks, NAILS, etc. My driveway is all crushed stone though...Looks like coarse mortar mix...and a lot of mixed pea sized and up gravel on top that we've had applied over the years.

[The Boss]

Around here Greg we call it 3/4 minus. It's the small stones and stone dust that falls through the final screen with 3/4" holes in it. It's the balance of the crushing process. The top 4" of my driveway (probably less now) is made of that with coarser material below for drainage and bite.

I like the crunching noise it makes when you drive over it - reminds me of an old country road sort of. Only problem is that weeds will grow through it and when we get heavy rain here it ruts out and I have to plow or shovel it back into place.

[Greg Reid]

Originally Posted by The Boss

Around here Greg we call it 3/4 minus. It's the small stones and stone dust that falls through the final screen with 3/4" holes in it. It's the balance of the crushing process. The top 4" of my driveway (probably less now) is made of that with coarser material below for drainage and bite.

I like the crunching noise it makes when you drive over it - reminds me of an old country road sort of. Only problem is that weeds will grow through it and when we get heavy rain here it ruts out and I have to plow or shovel it back into place.

Yeah Chris, I have the old country road so I don't need the old country driveway....lol
Regarding the road, I don't mind the crunching sound- it let's me know from a quarter mile away every time someone's driving down my road...but it's that 'yadayadayadayadabrrrrrrrrr' you get on the washboard portions that I don't like. Over a period of time, it'll shake your car to pieces..and the dust gets into every nook and cranny in the car. It's like lapping compound.
I also don't like it when you've just pulled your very clean car out the garage, drive it up the road at 4mph to keep the dust down and the mail truck meets you coming the other way at 50mph, throwing dust, dirt, gravel and sticks up in the air....and being in a friendly rural area, they wave at you when they blow by you.


Still though, I do like living out in the sticks....I sure would love some pavement though....somewhere

[Ed Fitzgerald]

I was going to ask you what "modified" was in your neck of the woods. But I see it got answered. Up here we call the base "B" gravel and the top coat "A" gravel. I crush pit run (sand/granite boulders) into "B" gravel and "A" gravel. I just completed 2800' of roadway for a cottage association that compaction tested at > 102%. From what I read here from you 2 other concerns arise for me. I would make sure that you put a couple of inches of 5/8 gravel over the granite rock outcrops. The granite is part of the earths crust and is constantly moving so when you put some 5/8's over it, it allows the granite to move under the pavement and act as a roller bearing. I do this also when I put in footings on rock, it tends to lessen if not guarantee no cracks in the block/poured wall. It was a trick that was passed on to me by an old italian friend. The other thing that jumps out at me is that you made the laneway level with the lawn. I always like to see the laneway at least 6" higher than the lawn if there is no ditch. Afterall if the water lies on the edge of the road it soaks into the roadbase and with the traffic it works like a mixing bowl with flour and water in it. The more you mix it the soupier the road becomes. This is why you inevitably have potholes. A few years ago the county hired a superduper road superintendent that was going to show us all how it was done. He decided to have the road grader take the crown of the road and flatten the road for the winter. In his infinite wisdom he said it would make safer roads as the cars would be on a level road and not fighting the 2% crossfall.This equates to 2 feet in a 100. So on a 16 foot road with a 2% crown you are looking at roughly 8 ft width of 2%. 8 ft into 100= 12. 12 into 24 = 2". There was 2" of cross fall on the road and I told him and the mayor that they were going to have problems the next spring when the frost started coming out of the road. Sure enough the road was full of ruts and pot holes. I told the mayor "What did you expect bringing in a inexperienced guy and retiring off the high priced help. My father always said, You pay peanuts and you'll get monkeys. Ed

[Greg Reid]

Thanks Ed. That's good to know about how to treat surfaces over the granite outcrops.
As for the drive being level with the lawn (if you want to call it that) that's the way it's been as long as we've lived here. We didn't build the house by the way, but we've been here 17 years or so. Now that you've explained why, I could always add some drainage along the edge when and if this ever happens. I don't think it'll be much of a problem actually though. It's not visible in the pics but the yard slopes down at a pretty good grade from the driveway. The driveway is the highest point on the property.
This sidewalk leads away from the drive, so you can see the downgrade there..



As to our road, we've had a variety of folks in charge of grading and maintaining it over the years. They usually do very little grading down to the hard surface. They add the modified on top of the potholes and washboards and just 'grade' that.
Of course, after the mail lady and a few others come down the road, they just knock it out of the holes. They also seem to have a remarkable tendency to add the modified right before a hard rain.
The drainage ditches are redone occasionally and sometimes they actually work the way they are supposed to. Sometimes the path of least resistance is across the road and we get the washouts.

[Stuckinda60s]

As I said, my drive doesn't make dust, rut or wash. A good portion of the reason for it not washing is that it's flat. But, at the end of the drive where it meets the road, the water will run. There is a slight slope to it, but I've never done any maintenance to it, at all.

It's not gravel, and as I stated, you have to get the good stuff. It's almost like pavement and it definitely doesn't crunch.

[Stuckinda60s]

I did the same thing around my shop as I had done around the house, and the week that it was done we had torrential rains. I was really worried about it because there areas where I had sloped it and it slopes away from the doors in the back to keep water from running into the shop. The drive slopes toward the shop and the majority of it is gravel because of the degree of the slope. That area would wash because the water would run at a pretty good pace.

Anyway, the stuff help up quite well after having had nothing to compact it but the JD450 dozer, and having a good portion of it having nothing but some back-blading.