[455Grandville]

Hmmm, saving 750 lbs. Some of these new cars are really portly in the weight department. Wonder if other companies will start doing this ? Land Rovers have used aluminum bodies since they debuted in the late 40s, but more for the corrosion issues in the UK.

http://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoram...1lBHB0A3BtaA--

This is the next version of the Ford F-150 pickup, the most profitable vehicle Ford sells and the most popular automobile in America. While it looks new, the biggest changes lie under the paint, where the body has been made from aluminum instead of steel — a costly yet revolutionary change that helps the new model shed 700 lbs. over the previous versions, and could give Ford years of dominance among truck buyers.

Think of it as "The Biggest Loser," pickup edition.

Under development for six years, Ford started almost from scratch in its designs — driven by a desire to future-proof its bellweather model against ever-increasing demands for fuel efficiency. And by making a radical switch to aluminum, Ford can then make other changes, like smaller engines, without weakening the F-150 or upsetting its loyal owners — at least in theory.



First, a bit about why aluminum's such a big deal: Many luxury cars use aluminum frames for lighter weight and more stiffness, including Jaguar, Audi and Land Rover. And a few mainstream models, including the current F-150, have aluminum hoods to shed a few pounds. But despite its rust-proof advantages, aluminum has never been the chief metal for vehicles because of its relatively higher cost versus steel and the different methods needed to form it (unlike steel that can be welded, aluminum melts at a lower temperature, and typically needs to be riveted or glued in most vehicles.)

Ford has tinkered with building aluminum vehicles for more than two decades, but the F-150 will likely outsell all other aluminum-heavy models in a single month, with more than 750,000 sold in the United States every year. To test its ideas about aluminum bodies, Ford arranged to give six F-150s with aluminum beds to customers at construction sites and mining companies — without their knowledge. After four rounds of testing, Ford struck on the combination of aluminum alloys and thicknesses it believes can be tougher than the current model.



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The weight savings — which equal roughly 12 percent on a Super-Duty variant — drive other changes. The engine lineup gets shuffled, with the current 6.2-liter V-8 dropped. The base engine will be a smaller 3.5-liter non-turbocharged V-6, with a 5-liter V-8 and 3.5-liter Ecoboost twin-turbo as the top models. The new in-between option: a 2.7-liter V-6 Ecoboost turbo that Ford claims will offer as much power as buyers used to expect from a small V-8.

From a styling standpoint, the F-150's aluminum body brings a 21st-century update, from LED headlamps to a sculpted tailgate that can be lowered remotely from the key fob. Ford promises a heavy dose of new technology throughout the truck: 360-degree camera systems, moveable LED spotlights in the rearview mirrors and even hidden ramps underneath the bed that can be pulled out to load ATVs and motorcycles.

Ford will start selling the new F-150 later this year; it didn't release several key details, such as expected fuel economy or prices, but says the new truck will haul, tow and go farther on a tank of gas than the current model while within range of today's sticker prices. Pickup buyers tend to be conservative, and there will be some who doubt that an aluminum body can ever be as durable as a steel one. Given how much weight it's shed, the aluminum F-150 should give Ford dominance in truck fuel economy for years to come. It's radical, and a bit risky, but being the biggest loser may keep the F-150 a winner.

[marxjunk]

im in the collision busines..i'm wondering about repairs...no real welding approved in the fireld except spool gun...cant fix a lot..all special refinsh proceedures...high strenght steel frames are gonna be special proceedures for it...

I have 3 FOrd dealers in my territory...and they have a boat load of my equip...Im nervous..


I havent heard a darn thing thru our networks either...feel sorry for the tech repairing them..its gonna be a mess for a while

I remeber when the Alum BMWs showed up..wow..what a freaking mess ofr over a year...those where $85,000 cars..these are trucks..get ready for them to total like crazy for a while til the industry shifts..crazy

[keith k]

Aluminum use on vehicles is increasing very quickly because of the more stringent fuel economy standards.

And if the new F150 is making the switch, you can bet other high volume products won't be too far behind.

I'm sure there will be those in the collision industry who will adapt, and be able to handle it.

As a rust belt resident, I'm looking forward to reduced corrosion worries (and improved fuel economy, acceleration, etc.) with my next F150!

[David Jones]

I read body AND frame of aluminum and there was no mention of a V8.

[Motor Daddy]

I watched an interview on one of the morning shows with Ford's CEO. He was there to talk about the new F150, mainly about the new aluminum body. He said they were starting with the larger vehicle with the aluminum body because that is where the weight savings can be larger, equating to larger savings at the pump. He said that when the technology grabs hold in the truck market they will use the technology on the rest of the lineup of Ford's vehicles, and he imagines that the other vehicle manufacturers will all move in the aluminum body direction soon.

[indymanjoe]

watch the scrappers start stealing trucks now..

[Alvin]

...let them get the bugs and support networks worked out 1st yr or 2.

Interesting read here:
http://reviews.cnet.com/suv/2015-for...-35834114.html

Says the v-8 5.0 will be offered. Also:

"Ford started by making prototype aluminum bodies that were visually identical to the current truck. One was sent to a Utah gold mine, it's drivers told to treat it like any other truck. They did and the 1.4mm-thick aluminum used in the bed proved even more durable than the steel in the current model."

Perhaps the 700lbs weight savings will aid in bringing the overall Ford fleet within the new Fed fuel standards.

[69goatboy]

I'm curious to see the frame construction and how it was designed to handle chassis flex, since aluminum doesn't like to flex as much as steel.

Young's modulus for AL is about 70 GPa, Steel is about 200 GPa.

[MikeNoun]

I wonder why they aren't using plastic type panels that have been used for ages on various American cars (like the 4th Gen Birds)? No rust issues, no dents, lightweight.

My guess is that Ford discovered they can get aluminum cheap over in China or Taiwan.

I also wonder why they aren't focusing more on carbon fiber. Seems like if they could get a major auto manufacturer to begin using carbon fiber bodies, the cost would come down.

[Alvin]

Originally Posted by MikeNoun

I wonder why they aren't using plastic type panels that have been used for ages on various American cars (like the 4th Gen Birds)? No rust issues, no dents, lightweight.

My guess is that Ford discovered they can get aluminum cheap over in China or Taiwan.

I also wonder why they aren't focusing more on carbon fiber. Seems like if they could get a major auto manufacturer to begin using carbon fiber bodies, the cost would come down.

IMO I'm more comfortable with Aluminum use over plastic panels, especially on a truck. I believe there is also a BIG cost savings w aluminum due to recycling and abundant availability of "used beer cans" etc.

They can melt down their aluminum and - IIRC - reuse 95% in new mfg. Not so much w Carbon & Fiero body panels...

[MikeNoun]

Originally Posted by Alvin

IMO I'm more comfortable with Aluminum use over plastic panels, especially on a truck. I believe there is also a BIG cost savings w aluminum due to recycling and abundant availability of "used beer cans" etc.

They can melt down their aluminum and - IIRC - reuse 95% in new mfg. Not so much w Carbon & Fiero body panels...

Great points! But I thought they could recycle plastic too. Seems there are more plastic bottles in the ol' recycling bin these days, including 2-liter pop bottles, quarts of oil, etc. Not sure what the Saturn body panels were made of...

[Alvin]

Originally Posted by MikeNoun

Great points! But I thought they could recycle plastic too. Seems there are more plastic bottles in the ol' recycling bin these days, including 2-liter pop bottles, quarts of oil, etc. Not sure what the Saturn body panels were made of...

Yep. Great counterpoint re Plasitque.

Mountains of bumper cover recyclers in a few areas of town here too, which I forgot...question is; do they recycle those materials @ the same 95% retainage as "Al-Lew-Min-E-Yum?"

[Old Goat Racer]

Insurance premiums ?

[GpFreak]

http://motrolix.com/2013/12/2015-f-1...6-nano-engine/

[Alvin]

Nano?

[77 TRASHCAN]

The scrap values for one of those fine machines will bring a lot more $$$, when they leave the road in 2-3 years...

[Alvin]

Now that you mention it, I've actually flown @ 30,000 ft in one of those beer cans!
Check out this Website for the overall useage all around us every day, tractor trailers, cars, trains, planes, etc.
http://www.aluminum.org/Content/Navi...ft/default.htm

Actual recycle info instead of my WAGs
http://www.aluminum.org/AM/Template....ontentID=25648

"Ever since the launch of Sputnik..."

[keith k]

Originally Posted by MikeNoun

I wonder why they aren't using plastic type panels that have been used for ages on various American cars (like the 4th Gen Birds)? No rust issues, no dents, lightweight.

My guess is that Ford discovered they can get aluminum cheap over in China or Taiwan.

I also wonder why they aren't focusing more on carbon fiber. Seems like if they could get a major auto manufacturer to begin using carbon fiber bodies, the cost would come down.

Two reasons:
1) Plastic is not lighter than aluminum... it's about the same when both are properly engineered.
2) Plastic is more expensive than aluminum in per unit costs, but the tools to make the aluminum parts cost a lot more. On something like an F150 where the production volume is huge and tooling costs can be spread out over many pieces, aluminum wins out. The opposite is true for a Corvette - relatively low volume so plastic makes more sense for the outer body panels.

In general, the surface quality of plastic panels is not quite as good, and the dimensional stability is not quite as good as metal... so panel margins tend to be a bit greater. Conversely, an advantage for plastic is that it can be formed into more complex shapes than aluminum can be stamped.

Carbon fiber unit cost is multiples (many...) more than aluminum or plastic. It's simply a much slower process to make it. Cost would never come down fast enough, without a major breakthrough in manufacturing process. There have been improvements recently (BMW on the i3 and i8), but nothing yet to make it viable for any vehicle that sells in the hundreds of thousands at a low targeted price point.

Just based on my experience engineering various automotive panels in the past...

[zeebo]

Originally Posted by indymanjoe

watch the scrappers start stealing trucks now..

aluminum is going to go through the roof price wise if this catches on. the big 3 have used aluminum components on cars since the 70s to save weight, but have not built an entire vehicle out of it..im wondering how it will hold up to payloads....and boy, that baby is gonna be pricey...take a defibrillator with you to the dealer.. i have a 2001 park avenue with an aluminum hood..and it had to be repainted as the paint started to corrode off...i have seen expeditions (which have an aluminum taligate) where the paint is flaked off and is corroded badly.

[big hammer]

lol ford had to dump the 6.2. so all they have left is the 5.0 and the highly problematic and gutless ecoboost. looks like ford is in a pretty bad place here. they need some decent engines ASAP.

and their big weight loss puts them within 100 pounds of the sierra.