[fbrown]

It feels like I'm going back wards. I received the Vintage Air unit around the first of August. It turns out that I have to remove the dash in order to install the vintage Air Unit. Access to the Windshield vents is not possible with the dash installed and I had to cut up the factory vent and use part of the factory vent and part of the vintage air unit in order to hook up the driver side windshield vent.

The in dash factory tach would not work with the ECM tach signal. I gave up on making it work and purchased a Speedhut unit.

Cruise Control - I think I found the problem. I forget to hook 12V to the stalk.

I managed to strip the threads on the ignition switch. Waiting for another one.

I started powder coating brackets and other parts. I wish I had done this sooner. I had an Eastwood unit for a long time, but didn't use it because I thought the learning curve would take too long. WRONG - powder coating is quick and easy compared to painting with epoxy based paints. No mixing, no induction time, (time after mixing before you should spray), no messy cleanup, three coats of epoxy takes around 90 minutes. It takes around 2 hours from start of mixing to end of cleaning and you can't really install the part for a couple of days. Powder coating from start to finish takes about 40 minutes and you can install the part right away.

Vacation and work has slowed my build down in the last two months. I usually work three days a week helping my girl friend with her business, but I picked up an engineering job and found myself helping her 5 days a week for a while. Things have been a bit busy lately.

I ordered a Vintage Air unit for a 68 Chevelle. While I am showing some of what I went through, Vintage Air should have a SureFit unit for a 68 GTO available by next summer. I am told they have a car in their shop and are working on the kit now, but don't expect to have anything available for many months.

I used the Chevelle lower bracket. I made an upper one. Failed to take a photo but was a simple bracket.


The lines as supplied for the Chevelle, there is a place for the lines to go. All I had to do was drill a couple of holes and make a bracket to support the lines.




The bracket to support the lines.


And yes the hidden headlights miss the lines and dryer.


Cutting the old windshield duct. You can see where I grafted part of the vintage outlet to the Pontiac piece.




Brackets to hold the driver side duct



Driver side installed



The passenger side was easier. Some modification to the vintage air part.





Trial fit of the evaporator unit.



Bracket for the vintage air controls



These are the first parts I powder coated. Used Eastwood Satin Black. The bracket with the large hole the one that supports the hard lines at the core support. The ring is a spacer to hold the vintage air control out from the panel.



Vintage air control unit installed in custom bracket



I did have to grind the edge of the vintage air controls to fit in the dash, about 1/32" each side. While the ground edge is not black, it is not visible since it is against a silver/chrome dash.


Charging the system was troublesome. My vacuum pump failed 20 minutes after I started. Needed to run for at least 45 minutes. My vacuum pump was at least 30 years old, so I can't complain. Had to buy new gauges since I didn't have a 4 port gauge set for R134 , my set was for R12. After reading about how critical it is to get the right amount of R134 in the system, I ending up buying a special scale for AC work. I have to say the charging of the system was very simple with the right tools and the system blows cold air.

So this is how my car looks now, waiting for the tach and the ignition switch.

[Greg Reid]

Excellent skill on display as usual Fred. Just keep chipping away at it.
Say, did you ever get rid of that repop dash pad you were thinking about ebaying? I'm going to have to dye some interior parts and I might be interested in it.

[paint guy]

fbrown, just to recap specifically how you installed the ls motor/trans: you used Chevy frame mounts with Edelbrock motor mounts, retaining the factory motor position. An AC relocating bracket from Kwik used with the GMPP LS2 corvette accy kit meant no frame notching required. Your existing crossmember was used after drilling two additional holes. A good idea to install 90* fittings for the trans cooler lines before installing tranny. Fuel reg. used is a GM 10299146. Please correct me if anything I posted pertaining to your build is incorrect.
As you can tell, I am very much interested in your project. I will be installing a GM "connect and cruise' package in my 69, which should eliminate some of the things you had to deal with because of the "plug and play" nature of the kit. Nontheless, I am hoping you will answer some questions for me. First off, the cruise control stalk part number if you happen to know? Second, what would you do differently if you were to do another ls install in a GTO? What is your opinion of the Holley oil pan for this type of install? Last, with a different oil pan, do you see any way you could have installed the motor/trans as a unit? thanks in advance for your time.

[fbrown]

Greg - Yes the Pad is still available - never got around to listing it.

Paint Guy

Cruise Control stalk - The Company selling it is out of business. According to John at Speartech any GM cruise control stalk from the 70's - 80's would work. I didn't think the connect and cruise packages supported cruise control.

Installing LS into another A-Body - The Edelbrock parts I used are no long available so that would no longer be an option. The Edelbrock headers don't fit that well so I guess that is no real loss. The biggest problem of the Edelbrock headers is that they hang below the frame.

Oil Pan - I would use the Holley 302-2 - it is reported to fit A-body's and clear the tie-rod ends. It also connects to the transmission which gives extra support, the MAST pan does not tie-in to the transmission but is reported to clear tie-rod ends. I had to raise
my engine for clearance. I don't know if I have a vibration issue yet since I have only reached 75 MPH for a couple of hundred feet.

My engine and transmission might could have been installed as a unit if the car was higher. ie - placing blocks under the front wheels. It's possible with the Holley pan, the engine and trans could be installed as a unit without raising the front end of the car since the front of the pan is not as deep.

I would try and use engine mounts and headers from the same company. I think problems often occur when people use engine mounts from one company and buy headers/exhaust system from another. At the very least determine what motor mounts the headers were test fitted with and use the same motor mounts. It will probably save you a lot of time getting everything to fit.

just to recap specifically how you installed the ls motor/trans: you used Chevy frame mounts with Edelbrock motor mounts, retaining the factory motor position. An AC relocating bracket from Kwik used with the GMPP LS2 corvette accy kit meant no frame notching required. Your existing crossmember was used after drilling two additional holes. A good idea to install 90* fittings for the trans cooler lines before installing tranny. Fuel reg. used is a GM 10299146.

This is correct - and I will add it is very difficult to impossible to connect the transmission lines after the transmission is in place. I connected the lines before installing the transmission.

FWIW - My next LS install will probably be a LSA engine, 6L90 transmission. This would require someone one Speartech to supply the harness and computer since GM does not support the 6L90 in any of their packages. This setup would be installed in my 68 Eldorado. The frame would be a modified 94 B-body frame. That is to say I am converting it to rear wheel drive. This would be my choice today. If the direct injection LS/LT1 engines become available from GM, I might select a direct injection engine instead. Right now support is very limited for the LT1 and since it would be around a year before I start on the Eldorado, a lot could change.

[fbrown]

More on the AC install

Center Vent had to be modified




I melted the ends together with a soldering iron using strips cut from the cut out section to function as welding rod. Stock S clips hold it in perfectly.



Various brackets - Powder coated - water valve, support for overflow tank, support for carpet protector. After market carpet protector is wider than the 68 with mounting hole in different location.



Water valve with bracket installed



Power coated the air intake tube



Glove box no longer fits. The vintage air unit sticks our farther from the firewall. Guess I will make one in metal.





Test fit - one of many - left side not welded on yet



Power coated



A couple of under hood shots





Tach and ignition switch should be here in a couple of days. I hope to get it put back together by the weekend.

[paint guy]

fbrown, thanks for the reply. I wasn't aware that the connect and cruise package may not support cruise control, it will be another question to ask before placing the order. I'm not a header guy anymore, will probably use the manifolds that come with the package knowing full well I'll be giving up some top end. I will use the Holley pan, was considering the GM "muscle car pan" (LH8 I think) but based on yours and others advice, have changed my mind. Thanks again for all your help.

[fbrown]

Don't use the LH8 pan. GM wrongly promotes the LH8 pan for retrofit applications. The only thing that pan might work in is older trucks. I believe the LH8 pan was used on the Hummer. Many people have installed this pan in 94-96 B-Body (Impala, Roadmaster, Fleetwood) and had it hang 3 or more inches below the frame.

The one thing I will not do on future swaps is to raise the engine for clearance. I fought with adjusting the drivetrain for a couple of days. I think I ended up with an angle of 3.4 degrees. I don't yet know if I will have a high speed vibration issue but if I do it will be both hard and expensive to correct.

[GTO4spd]

That is one fantastic looking car now!

[fbrown]

As I said a few posts ago, it seems that everything is fighting me. I forgot to mention the problems with the windshield wiper. I did a quick check to see it the windshield wiper motor worked, then did a cosmetic restoration on it. Looked really good.



Then I discover that the wiper won't stop sometimes. Keeps on running after turning the switch off. This was around July, I ordered new wiper motor and washer. Was back ordered and I forgot about it. Checked on it last week to find no record of my order and none in stock. Checked Rockauto found no listing for a wiper motor under GTO but found that it was listed under Tempest. Ordered wiper motor, arrived a couple of days ago, broken, they put it in a box with no packing and one of the mounting ears broke off. So waiting for a replacement.

It seems that the last few remaining items are the creating the most problems.

Some things are kind of funny, my girlfriend is laughing at me, she said now that its winter you got the air conditioning working.

Anyway I have to get in high gear and clean my basement. It's takes a lot of time to clean the dust out and get it clean enough to paint. It's been almost two years since I painted the car and still have the hood to redo. There is only about a month before it's too cold to paint.

[cuz68]

As aways looking great, Thank you Fred for the updates. Randy.

[fbrown]

I got the Speedhunt tach installed and it works.



This is what the reproduction in dash tach looked like after breaking it open. It was held together by some blobs of silicon.



Looks like the Speedhunt unit can be installed in the old tach housing.



Test fit



I did have to cut the housing a bit. The side that got cut was slanting in.



I will say I give the aftermarket tach housing an "F" for quality. The fit of the lens and bezel was very poor. There was 3/16" gap on one side of the bezel. However at least when it's put together and installed you cannot see the poor fit of the parts. One of the reasons the tach was held together with silicon was because the parts just did not fit together. They used silicon to bridge the gap.

I did remove the lens on the speedhunt unit. There might be glare if I had both the Speedhunt lens and the GTO tach housing lens.



They glove box took far more time than it should have, but it turned out well.

I added a light strip to light up the box. The factory light is almost useless, I also installed the USB port for the radio in the glove box. The trunk release has also been mounted. This is a shot of the glove box in the dark.



Another view - You can see the light strip here. The green unit is my USB strip. I used a panel plug to hide the hole left for the factory glove box light.



Still fighting the windshield wiper motor. I got the replacement for the damaged one and found things still didn't work right. I have only one speed and the park does not work. After testing and tracing wiring for a while, I believe the wiper switch I have is for a non-park wiper motor. It was on of the few things I did not replace. I didn't replace the switch because I don't expect to need wipers very often. That is so say I don't plan on driving the car when its likely to rain. It turns out that the original wiper motor was completely shot, extreme wear, no grease, the switch that reverses the motor was cracked. Anyway I ordered a wiper motor switch today.

[fbrown]

I'm overdue for an update. Things got real busy at work in November so I was unable to paint the hood and bumper. By the time work eased up it was too cold.

I got the windshield wiper worked out. I had the wrong switch. I had a switch for a non hidden wiper. This was the switch that came with the car. New switch made it work perfectly.

I had some leaks from the transmission pan, so I replaced the gasket on the transmission pan.

Engine still seems a little rough. Maybe I need to clean the injectors. The engine sat for several years from the time I first cranked it till I got it running again.

Now for the picture updates.

Hoses from vintage air hang down. Something the girl friend would complain about.



So I made a cover to hide the hoses.



Powder coated and installed.



Now the hoses are hidden



Time to finish the console/shifter

A graphic was supplied for the Hurst dual gate Overdrive conversion, but no clear plastic was supplied. Since I started with a used ebay shifter I was missing some of the indicator parts. Home Depot to the rescue with a sheet of lexan.



The finished result. The back light was very dim so I substituted a bright LED replacement bulb. Worked very well bright enough to see, but not too bright.



I needed a shift knob. While black reproduction knobs are available for the Hurst, I wanted a wood grain knob instead. It turns out that no aftermarket knobs are currently available so I made my own. I started out with a bare wood ball, drilled it for a threaded insert, and then stained it.





I had sanded the hood and bumper. Now I just need warmer weather.... Maybe by mid March it will be warm enough for painting.



One of the problems with an LS3 engine swap is controlling factory gauges. There is really no good place to insert a 68 GTO temperature sending unit on a LS3 engine. The sending unit is too large to be inserted in the head. Some have used the location that is plugged on the passenger side at the back of the head. I think it is very risky to drill such a large hole. In addition the sending unit would almost touch a header pipe. A second problem is controlling the GEN light. There is no provision in the corvette alternator to control a GEN light. My solution to the problem is to use a computer to read the battery voltage and light the GEN light if the voltage is less than 12.5. I also read the coolant temperature from the ECM and have programed a PWM output to drive the coolant temperature meter. I calibrated the gauge so that the middle mark is 200 degrees, the normal operating temperature for a LS3.
The marks on the gauge correspond to 100,150,200,225,250 so now the gauge is useful.

These are the components I used to read the factory ECM. The red board (OBD2 code reader) connects to the diagnostic connector (will be hard wired when I finish) . The red board reads data from ECM and returns the result as ASCII text. The blue board, actually two boards plugged together are an Arduino Mega 2560 with a proto board plugged into it. The Arduino board contains the program that issues commands to the OBD2 reader. The proto board contains the circuits necessary to interface with the car. A relay drives the GEN light and contains a driver circuit for controlling the temperature gauge. The LCD is a diagnostic aid and won't be used normally.



Here is the board polling data from the ECM. For diagnostic purposes the data is being displayed on the LCD.



And a shot with the board controlling the GEN light and temperature gauge in the car. When the ignition key is first turned on the GEN light is blinked and the gauge cycles from cold to hot and back to cold to show they are working.



I don't have much left to do now. Current list.

Paint hood and bumper
Mount temperature/GEN light controller in an enclosure and install under dash.
Figure out why the engine is a little rough
Finish out the trunk.
Install cornering lights.

That's about it. I plan on having the car completed this spring.

[cuz68]

Wow, Fred the dash looks great i like what you did to the glove box also, Did the speakers on the kick panel come with covers for them? Thank you for the update Randy.

[fbrown]

The speakers are JL Audio and came with grills. The speakers were deeper than the space behind the kick panel, so I had to enlarge the opening in the sheet metal.

[Aus Goat]

Your the man Fred love your car and the build notes and pictires.
I was thinking about a metal glovebox like you. My cars RHD conversion made a mess of the cardboard. Why don't they make a metal one they would sell hint hint.
I am currently drawing up the glovebox in CAD so I will R&D your idea on lighting

[fbrown]

While waiting for good weather - hot enough and no rain - I decide to make a real circuit boards to control the factory temperature gauge and GEN light. In a previous life I was an electrical engineer so designing circuit boards is nothing new. It's been almost 15 years since I worked as an engineer and I can say that it is much easier today compared with 15 years ago.

The is the prototype assembly, there are three circuit boards in this box. an Arduino processor board, an OBD2 code reader and a hand made board that I constructed that connects everything together and provide an interface to the gauges/lights.



I replaced this mess with two boards, one to read the ECM and another to control the gauges and lights. There are analog and digital inputs in the event I want to turn this into a BCM.



I was worried that my hand made prototype might have problems in very hot or very cold weather since the integrated circuits were only rated from 0-70 C. My new boards are constructed with automotive grade parts and should not have any problems with the temperature range found in automobiles.

I have a few spares for sale in case anyone needs one.

Finally a coupe of days that it's not raining or very cold. Time to paint the hood and bumper.

Since my last painting session I made a fan to vent the paint fumes. A harbor freight barrel fan was taken apart and installed in a home made frame. Works very well - will clear all mist in less than a minute.



It turns out that I needed the second day as a big roach sized bug landed in the base coat and really messed up the base coat. I had to wait over night to sand the problems out of the base before applying more base. Started at two and finished clearing around 6PM.

No runs or trash this time.







Next cut and buff in a few days and maybe driving the car by next weekend.

[fbrown]

Now for some long overdue updates. I removed the GTO from my basement a few days ago, after finishing all the little things that would best be done in a shop environment.

Going back a few weeks here are some of the final paint work.

Color sanded hood - 1000 grit



Starting the buffing



Initial finish



On close inspection, I wasn't happy with the buffing, there was some micro sized orange peel, that I think was caused by using a wool pad for the first buffing operation. While the shine is very good, the reflection in the clear was not quite as clear as the rest of the car. I corrected the problem by using 1500 grit in a DA then three buffing sessions starting with a red foam pad and meguiars 105, a yellow pad and finally a black pad with meguiars 205.

Here are some pictures of the completed car. It was near sun down so the pictures are a little dark. I will try and post some more pictures later showing inside, outside and under hood.









For comparison here is how the car looked when I bought it off ebay.





The grill I used was a 69, a 68 grill and head light cover was not available when I started the project. I might eventually change it over to a 68.

I have put a few more miles on the car. (43 miles total) AC blows cold, cruise control works, in fact everything works. There are still a few bugs to work out. As I stated before, the power seems down, engine surges a bit. I have MSD spark plug wires on order, some of the GM wires lightly touch the headers. Maybe this is the cause of the slightly rough engine. The only car I have to use as a comparison is my former 2006 GTO. The LS3 engine is not as smooth and I would think that the 68 would be quicker than the 2006, it's not.

[Scarebird]

Did you do a CASE relearn? My LS3 in a 79 TA is MUCH faster than my old 2004 GTO.

[fbrown]

I did not do a CASE relearn. I happened to have a 2008 Corvette pull up next to me and I could tell his idle quality was much better than mine. I ran an spark tester and found 6 cylinders are firing around 18K volts at idle, one is firing at 6K and one at 27K. My rough idle is probably caused by the 18k and 6k cylinders.

It's too hot during the day and we have had rain almost every night, so not much is going on with troubleshooting the problem.


If any one wants to follow the restoration of my girl friends 280zx, the restoration thread can be found here. http://www.zdriver.com/forums/280zx-...oration-40747/

[fbrown]

I changed the plug wires to MSD. Now how good clearance. Engine idles well. There is still some surging, so I suspect the PCM needs some tuning. Maybe need to drive a few more miles and see what happens. About 45 miles on car at this point.

Now have 55 miles on car. Transmission dead. No drive, no reverse, engine just revs. Happened while driving down the road. Was able to coast out of the main road onto a side street.

Since I didn't like the 9" TC, guess I will get a normal street type TC. I'm leaning toward the GMHP 4L70E, SuperMatic transmission with the matching GM TC 11" about 2400 Stall. I'll probably wait until September to swap the trans/TC . It's too hot right now to work in my garage right now and I just tore my GF's 280ZX completely apart in my basement shop.

About the 9" TC, I'm either accelerating like a old lady or repaving the road two strips at a time. There is no inbetween acceleration, it's fairly slow or up in smoke. Maybe the 9" TC would be a good for use with slicks on the strip, but strip use was not my intention. I wish to accelerate quickly without spinning the tires. The current TC would have really sucked for running an autocross.