[Unclesamscandy]

This is a great saga. I like other posters here believe there are far too many unrotted cars to restore with far less investment after having done my share of fixing rotted cars, but I wish you the best in this endeavor!

[LemmyThe1972Wagon]

well, part of saving this car is to say that i've saved it and the end result is either experience and a failed project or experience with many years of enjoyment. i'll be doing everything but paint myself. i've decided to mail him a letter before i start calling or showing up at his doorstep; i'll be mailing that letter tomorrow.

[Cammer-6]

the registration will have the VIN also

Large black and yellow spiders are harmless,just look intimidating

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

I've come across those large black-yellow spiders many times too.
Get a long stick and twist up some web with him hanging on it, and take him to a new location.

If the VIN is readable on the registration, , make direct contact with Jim Mattison at PHS via phone or email and he should be able to fix that error you made, , at no charge.

Would also include the fact that its a Blue/Blue 6cylinder with Manual trans.
And explain your error.

[LemmyThe1972Wagon]

really? well, i'm going to have to give him a call and see what can be done.

[MescaBug]

Yeah, I once paid a PHS for a Canadian built car... Had to contact GM Canada. My bad..

Jim told me to let him know next time I need a PHS and he'll shave a few bucks from the price. Very easy to deal with.

[LemmyThe1972Wagon]

I gave PHS a call on wednesday, and once I explained, the guy (don't know who I talked to) said he'd send out the right paperwork the next day. I just got it back today, and I'm actually pretty excited about what I've found about this car, but I'm also confused. Knowing what I've seen when I looked at the car in person, it all makes sense, but I still have to wonder if this is the right paperwork. I KNOW it's the right VIN, but still. Check it out and see what you guys think. I blacked out the VIN, but everything else is readable. The cordova top makes sense considering that there is no trim at all around the windshield or rear window and the roof is covered in surface rust. And the whole "no A/C with Sprint cars" thing makes sense because I haven't actually inspected the climate controls. I just saw the vent deflector balls and assumed it was for A/C. To tell you the truth, it could be just heat for all I know. And the last time I went back to get the registration I saw a random bracket sitting where the map pocket would be on a 2nd gen. Firebird console, but I didn't know what that bracket went to, but according to the PHS, it's for a stereo tape player. Again, that makes perfect sense. The tape player is gone, as is the hood tach and vinyl top, but there is evidence that they were all once there. The order form only shows one 4 speed manual transmission, which is a Muncie M-20, so I'm pretty sure that's what this car has, I just wish I knew what rear axle it has in it.

I also got the results from that records request I sent to my DMV. The first page said that they had no records on the car because it has been longer than 10 years. The second page is the form I filled out. But then there's this 3rd page, which is completely contradictory to what they said on the first page. The 3rd page has all the stuff that's on the registration, plus stuff that I don't quite know how to decipher, but I do know there are no liens on the car. But it says a couple things of interest. Most notably, the previous title issue date-get this-01/27/1969. Yes, ladies and gentlemen, this would appear to be a one owner car! It says the last registration expired on 04/25/1982 and it has all the correct information for the car, including VIN and title number, so I wonder why they said they had no records and then included this page in the very same envelope. The owner should have received my letter by now, so I'm going to give him until a week from monday to contact me, and if I haven't heard from him by then, I'll be calling him at home and trying to convince him to sell or at least tell me about the car. If he says no at first, I won't give up, I will have this car. I think I would put the vinyl top back on too. warwick blue with a parchment vinyl top would look pretty good, methinks.

Every car has a story, and I can't wait to hear this car's story.

[keith k]

Wow... this is a really neatly optioned car. Great colors, too -- I would definitely put the V-top on it if you get to restore it.

[The Boss]

Hood tach would have been the 5500 redline model. If you get the car & need one - I know who has one.

[Cammer-6]

Originally Posted by The Boss

Hood tach would have been the 5500 redline model. If you get the car & need one - I know who has one.

why not save that for a "prototype" RA tach
or better yet use a 67 Sprint(6500 RPM redline) and really impress them.

[LemmyThe1972Wagon]

nice. i'll keep that in mind if i get the car. who knows, maybe the owner just took it off and put it in the trunk or somewhere in his house for safekeeping with that stereo tape player.

[70Steve]

I'm enjoying your story here.

My old 69 Firebird shipped 11/22/68 through the GM Overseas Dist. Corp. I noticed that your export prep was different...mine is code 761, amount $15.00.

Looking forward to updates about the cars original owner. Maybe he was a serviceman that ordered his car whilst stationed overseas to be ready on his return?

[LemmyThe1972Wagon]

Originally Posted by 70Steve

I'm enjoying your story here.

My old 69 Firebird shipped 11/22/68 through the GM Overseas Dist. Corp. I noticed that your export prep was different...mine is code 761, amount $15.00.

Looking forward to updates about the cars original owner. Maybe he was a serviceman that ordered his car whilst stationed overseas to be ready on his return?

maybe your car had to go farther than this firebird. and that's exactly what i was thinking, was that he was stationed overseas and bought the car while he was over there. all will be revealed once i get a chance to talk to him. i just want to give him a chance to contact me first...

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

The original buyer was definitely an active serviceman when the car was ordered.
Pontiac (at minimum - maybe all GM divisions) gave deep discounts to active servicemen in those days. And all those sales were done through the Overseas Dist Corp.
Check out the DEEP Discounts on base price and the options.

Exports being sold out of country also got price cuts, but much smaller discounts than that.

All had the side ball vents.
A/C would have another center vent above hvac controls.

He didn't order a posi, but it should be some pretty decent gearing with Sprint 4spd.
Cammer or someone probably knows what came standard with that.
Probably 3.23 or 3.55

Wild / Good luck on that title history search.
Page 1 was probably just a formality page that always gets thrown in.

If you tell the owner you already spent $65 just to find out how it was built, he might think you are willing to spend bigger for the car than what you actually have in mind.
IF he wants to sell it at all.

Good luck to you and hope you do get it. cheap/free

[LemmyThe1972Wagon]

the report says 3.55 is standard on the sprint. and positraction can be easily had by just installing a spider gear, unless i'm mistaken.

i haven't told the guy anything about the reports or look ups, i'm going to start out real cheap and kinda dumb and see what he says before i start to ramp up my knowledge. i haven't even mentioned my other 2 pontiacs, so he won't think i'm made of money or anything like that.

[MescaBug]

If you tell the owner you already spent $65 just to find out how it was built, he might think you are willing to spend bigger for the car than what you actually have in mind.
IF he wants to sell it at all.

Yeah, better not to tell too much... I lost a seller about a month ago. I thought he didnt know much about cars. I had the PHS, we were arguing about the price and I pointed out something that was not original on the car, and he asked; how in hell do you know that? He got suspicious, asked for an evaluation the next day and now he wants to keep it because now, he knows its worth much more than he thought.

Anyway... Your story is getting better and better!! This is a nice find, hope you save that poor girl!!!

[PONTIAC LARRY]

You'll need to replace the whole differential (not a spider gear)to change a standard open rear to Safe-T-Track (Posi) . The 3.55 is nice that you can bolt that ring to a new Auburn or Eaton Unit and be good to go.. a bit a other work ahead of that though! LOL
BTW: Very cool car, great colors and options, although really gone and not the best choice for most to build, I wish you luck and this one is finished and featured in HPP by the end of 2012

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Here's an invoice for a 69 that shares some of the same options as the field car.
You can see the difference in base price and option prices.
Almost $900 cheaper than normal full retail on base price.
Even about $200 cheaper than what a dealer paid for base price !
Pretty good discounts in 1968/69 money.

On the cheap ... you can weld the spider gears to make a poor-boy-posi.
When the welding breaks loose, so does everything else inside.
If you have access to plenty of them on the cheap ... its okay ... if you're just racing at tracks. On the street it could be suicidal when it pops/locks.

You'd want a new/used carrier unit to make it a posi.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by Cammer-6

...or better yet use a 67 Sprint(6500 RPM redline) and really impress them.

I got that in the 67 tall-boy version.
Painted Orbit-O from a guys 70 Judge.
He thought it was part of a Drag-Pak option .......... for a while.

[LemmyThe1972Wagon]

Originally Posted by PONTIAC LARRY

You'll need to replace the whole differential (not a spider gear)to change a standard open rear to Safe-T-Track (Posi) . The 3.55 is nice that you can bolt that ring to a new Auburn or Eaton Unit and be good to go.. a bit a other work ahead of that though! LOL
BTW: Very cool car, great colors and options, although really gone and not the best choice for most to build, I wish you luck and this one is finished and featured in HPP by the end of 2012

2012? ha! i hope my '72 firebird will be finished by then! i just hope to have this car at home with new hood and trunk lid by then. and at least be able to start the engine, if not drive it.

and i guess i was misinformed about just adding a spider gear to make it a posi. would i really have to change out the entire rear axle? i couldn't just change the internals and keep the external differential case the same? cause at some point i'd like to put a posi in my wagon, but if i have to change out the entire thing, it's not going to be worth it for a daily driver that will never see the track, or even hard acceleration. it'd be worth it for the pair of 'birds though, just more of a hassle.