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Lemans1 · 06-22-2002, 12:10 AM

OK....It is just about time I buy the paint for my car....it will be ready to shoot in a week or two. But heres my problem....I have asked several different body men and restorers and gotten several different answers. Which is the best paint to use; single shot or two shot? I will be spraying this car myself and have used acrylic enamel before and I thought it came out pretty nice. I have no experience in base/clear. I am interested in strength, ease of application, and final result. What are the pros/cons of each? I appreciate your input on this, nothing like screwing up something you have your blood, sweat, and tears into....thanks

[ June 22, 2002, 02:50 AM: Message edited by: Lemans1 ]

Lemans1 · 06-22-2002, 12:10 AM

OK....It is just about time I buy the paint for my car....it will be ready to shoot in a week or two. But heres my problem....I have asked several different body men and restorers and gotten several different answers. Which is the best paint to use; single shot or two shot? I will be spraying this car myself and have used acrylic enamel before and I thought it came out pretty nice. I have no experience in base/clear. I am interested in strength, ease of application, and final result. What are the pros/cons of each? I appreciate your input on this, nothing like screwing up something you have your blood, sweat, and tears into....thanks

[ June 22, 2002, 02:50 AM: Message edited by: Lemans1 ]

jim darlington · 06-22-2002, 07:06 AM

Use base coat / clear coat . Trust me you will be happy with the results . If you can spray single stage you can spray bc/cc . It will also outlast single stage also .

irgoatmike · 06-22-2002, 11:22 AM

Lemans 1, Ditto on what Jim says. Don't let the extra steps involved with basecoat/clearcoat scare you off. It is a longer lasting finish and in my experience more forgiving when it comes to fixing a mistake in the middle of spraying it. The bottom line is to get the data sheets on your favorite brand of paint and follow the instructions to the letter. Like Jim said, if you can shoot an acrylic enamel job, you can do BC/CC.

Lemans1 · 06-22-2002, 12:12 PM

Are there different types of bc/cc? How many coats of color and clear do you recommend? Finally, how much paint do you think it will take to do a 65 convt? Its an all over job including jambs, inside of the doors, underside of trunk lid etc.....I would hate to have to have a color mixed twice.....knowing they probably wont match.

jim darlington · 06-23-2002, 10:32 AM

Buy a gallon of color and a gallon of clear . 3 coats of color and 3 coats of clear . What color are you painting ? Some reds bleed through and you have to put a sealer down first .

Lemans1 · 06-23-2002, 02:03 PM

I am going to paint it silver. I would like metallic but I understand they can be difficult...sagging and swirling and such. Is there anything done between the color and clear coats...ie color sanding??

John Nimons · 06-23-2002, 04:36 PM

If you are going to be spraying silver, base/coat clear/coat, you definately don't want to sand in between the base and the clear. as you sand you will disrupt the metallic, and it will be blotchy when the clear is applied. If you have a problem in the base, and have to sand something, be sure to recoat it with color, prior to spraying the clear.
A few little things to make your paint job come out a little better:
1- prep, prep, prep. prepping the paint job correctly will make or break you. your final sanding should be with nothing courser than 500 grit wet/dry paper. Take your time, and let the paper cut...don't try to use a lot of pressure to make it cut faster. it will make tiny lines that will be magnified in the clear.
2- make sure you spray over a solid base. Make sure the car is all one color, preferably a neutral grey color, no bare metal, or body filler. The little extra time will be well worth it.
3-Try to pick a day with low humidity to spray your car. the new bc/cc paints aren't affected like the laquers we all used to spray, but in my experience, humidity affects the way the matallic lays out.
All in all. I'm sure you will be much happier using bc'cc paint. it is much easier to control your metallic in the basecoat, as you don't have to spray it wet like acrylic enamel. The clear coat is very east to sand out and buff to a glass like finish.
good luck!!!! hope this helps.

jim darlington · 06-23-2002, 04:38 PM

Nothing is done between coats . Just take your time , use a quality HVLP spray gun . If you never sprayed with a gun like that , practice on a chebby ! LOL . Seriously , do practice and you will be fine . The new paints don't blotch or moltel like the old paints . Use the proper reducer and hardner for the shops temp.

Lemans1 · 06-23-2002, 06:41 PM

Thanks guys, I appreciate the advice. Now to put it to work......

RossGN · 06-23-2002, 10:40 PM

Indeed good tips...I laying down my lacquer primer tonite. Hope to be painting next weekend.

jim darlington · 06-24-2002, 06:08 AM

Lacquer primer ...... I think you should re read some of the post in this section . Just trying to help you my friend .

RossGN · 06-24-2002, 05:26 PM

C455
Chief Ponti-Yacker

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posted December 01, 2001 12:54 PM [Profile for JC455] [Send New Private Message] [Edit/Delete Post] [Reply With Quote] Zedo, et al-
You can use other brands of plastic body filler that are designed to be applied over your protective primer coat. Rage lays down really nicely and generic Poly Putty (your region of the country will have it under varying names) also does an outstanding job.
Primers? There's only one type of primer for me- lacquer primer/surfacer. Unfortunately, the EPA outlawed this stuff many years back. There are other types that are superior for their niche style, but none can compare when it comes to application/sandability/surface build/ease of clean up/etc. Although it would allow water to penetrate it if left out in the elements.
Good luck w/ you projects!

------------------
John

A.W.Dille · 06-27-2002, 11:44 AM

John, I personally don't use Laquer primer for any thing but a cheap enamel job. The new urethanes will eventually lift laquer primer right off the metal. I paint for a living and I've ran into this situation before.As for a 2 stage paint I personally recommend either PPG or Dupont.

sviguy · 06-27-2002, 12:30 PM

the paint job is only as good as the surface preparation

GDK_1968 · 06-28-2002, 08:48 AM

Lee -

Hate to be an antagonist but,

Quote:

the paint job is only as good as the surface preparation

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">is such a broad generalization that I disagree.

So if I spend the best money can buy for surface prep, I can use rattle can paint and I would have a beautiful paint job?

I know that very notion is absurd, but only exemplifies a generalized statement. This car restoration arena is all new to me and learn more everyday, especially from the helpful keystrokes of members here, but is there not a plethora of other factors that determine a nice paint job? Amount of hardener for the humidity and temperature at time of spraying? Amount of air pressure? Type of gun? Paint type matched to the type of primer?

sviguy · 06-28-2002, 10:22 AM

don't know much about plethoras but I have witnessed perfectly beautiful 2500$ paint jobs turn to crap after 3 weeks.....cause.....inattention to detail with surface preparation.....rust bubbles returning.....paint becomming disbonded due to silicone contamination.....etc...I am only trying to emphasize the importance of what is done prior to that 30 minute job of spraying topcoat

Jim Roberts · 06-28-2002, 11:53 AM

Since the EPA mandated changes to lacquer paints & thinner (no toluene, as I understand) the cost of lacquer-based paint and undercoatings plus the compliant solvent (acetone & ketone) approaches the cost of urethane. Why not spend the extra for primer-surfacer and sealer that is COMPATIBLE with urethane base/clear?

Lacquer stays somewhat soft and pliable so using it underneath urethane is only asking for trouble. I believe that's what "The paint job is only as good as the surface preparation" post is eluding to.

One question- Is acetone and ketone really better for our environment than toluene-based lacquer thinner?

[ June 28, 2002, 11:58 AM: Message edited by: Jim Roberts ]

A1Judge · 06-29-2002, 05:39 AM

I asked the same question awhile back. Yesterday I bought all my paints as I should be ready to shoot it next weekend. The whole car has been shot in DP40 Epoxy Primer, body work done, then sealed with a reduced DP40. I'll then shoot the K38 primer surfacer and wet sand that up to 600 grit.

Here are the paints I selected:

PPG K38 Primer Surfacer
PPG Deltron DBC basecoat (1 gallon)
PPG Deltron Concept Clear 2021 (1 gallon)

With all the reducers and hardner, plus a boat load of sandpaper, (grits up to 2000 for color sanding), the whole lot cost me around $500.

DC

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