[slowbird]

I was back on the dyno today and 2 lifters on the intake side have failed. One collapsed to the point there was about .050 play in rocker. The other lifter not sure yet just what all is wrong but it kicked the pushrod. There was zero signs of valve float or engine being unhappy. Pretty disappointed with the hyd roller lifter situation!!
Pulled valve covers and this is what i found.

[Tom Vaught]

Basically why I refuse to run the things except in a pure street OEM application with factory camshafts. Maybe on a full boogie race deal the bushed solid rollers might work ok without the other issues for a period of time.

Tom V.

[AG]

Welcome to the club. I had a wheel brake off of a CC HR lifter in my brother's motor and replaced them with a set of used Cranes I had and the motor has been perfect since. Comp replaced the entire set of lifters and they are still on the shelf, forever. I recently bought a set of Johnson's after talking to them about the quality and manufacturing process, hopefully I'll have good luck with them.

[Formulas]

Got to ask. Are we as a group because I dont run rollers, taking these parts beyond their design limits ?

Just wondering because they used to be the best thing since sliced bread and can beer

Or is it possibly manufacturers are going off shore and are experiencing growing QA pains?

You pay quality money you should get a quality part sad. Hope it works out !

[Formulajones]

Are the Johnsons available??

[tom s]

I had to put Morels in my 383-301 engine,hope they hold up.First time using them.FYI,Morel is making the new Sealpower hyd roller lifters.Tom

[slowbird]

I had just told the dyno guy i was pretty happy with the lifter. They had quieted down, and showing great power at 6300, very next pull they went. Go figure

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by tom s

I had to put Morels in my 383-301 engine,hope they hold up.First time using them.FYI,Morel is making the new Sealpower hyd roller lifters.Tom

Thought you were using Shavers?

[tom s]

Won't work with a 301 block I was told.Oil hole is way diff.Tom

[dataway]

Has to be tough to produce the required precision and quality necessary for a roller cam and lifters at an affordable price. It's a very precision and complex system compared to HFT. Factory can do it because they make them by the millions and can demand the best materials and machining.

Kind of like HFT lifters ... yet to see an aftermarket lifter than can compare to a 60's or 70's OEM NOS HFT lifter when it comes to the precision of machining, the finish and the materials used.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by tom s

Won't work with a 301 block I was told.Oil hole is way diff.Tom

Ah ok.

I guess you couldn't get the Johnsons either.

[Cliff R]

You are finding out why some very experienced engine builders that I know will not use Morel HR's in anything.

6300rpms is solid lifter territory considering the weight and mass of the Pontiac valve train.

ALL of the Morel lifter equipped engines I've built, dyno'd, and owned were pretty much done at 5800rpm's with standard weight valve train parts. Even going to beehive springs and retainers you may get 200-400 more RPM's out of them but you are on shaky ground there.....IMHO.

Put a set of Crower HIPPO's in it and last at .003" and it will rev well past 6000rpm's w/o any issues.

You can also "crutch" the scenario by tight lashing the Morel HR's. Adjust them with a .010" feeler gauge between the rocker and valve tip and they may be OK, but at that point you'd be better off with HIPPO's.....IMHO.....

[Half-Inch Stud]

Building the spare 455+030. Afraid to install the 0.442" lobe Roller. Going Flat HYD, as usual.

[dataway]

I've never run a solid lifter cam in a V8, but tons of them in motorcycle engines ... just curious why not many people use them, they were all the rage back in the day. Not sure if V8s are the same way but on bike engines you set them and they are fine for 8-10,000 miles. Granted with a bike it's easy to roll the engine over to adjust them, but on four cylinder bikes it's still a bit of a chore to get them all done, once you have it down though it's not really that much trouble.

Is it the noise? The adjustments? Idle problems? I'd think on a vintage performance car that only sees a few thousand miles a year it wouldn't be much of an issue.

How is the failure rate for solid compared to HFT and HR?

[Formulajones]

I run 3 of them. One is a daily driver.

As far as noise, I don't even notice it. It's a tight lash (.014") solid flat tappet. With the hood shut you can't hear it.

As far as adjustments, we've put about 50k miles on it so far and it hasn't budged since initial break in. Been close to 5 years now. I was checking it frequently at first but as it got miles on it and wasn't moving I started checking it once a year. This past year I didn't even bother checking it. It's been maintenance free.

As far as failure rate, it's about the same as hydraulic rollers and hydraulic flat tappets have been for me........none. I did go the extra mile and nitride the camshaft, then bought the Comp EDM hole lifters that keep the face of the lifter and the lobe lubed with pressurized oil. Then went through a proper break in procedure.
Apparently it's working perfectly because the adjustments haven't budged anywhere.

Not sure why anyone would be afraid of solid flat tappets. They were OEM in tons of cars right up through the 60's and with todays advancements and all the things you can do, they are even better now.

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

I run 3 of them. One is a daily driver.

As far as noise, I don't even notice it. It's a tight lash (.014") solid flat tappet. With the hood shut you can't hear it.

As far as adjustments, we've put about 50k miles on it so far and it hasn't budged since initial break in. Been close to 5 years now. I was checking it frequently at first but as it got miles on it and wasn't moving I started checking it once a year. This past year I didn't even bother checking it. It's been maintenance free.

As far as failure rate, it's about the same as hydraulic rollers and hydraulic flat tappets have been for me........none. I did go the extra mile and nitride the camshaft, then bought the Comp EDM hole lifters that keep the face of the lifter and the lobe lubed with pressurized oil. Then went through a proper break in procedure.
Apparently it's working perfectly because the adjustments haven't budged anywhere.

Not sure why anyone would be afraid of solid flat tappets. They were OEM in tons of cars right up through the 60's and with todays advancements and all the things you can do, they are even better now.

My '82 Datson 280ZX SOHC inline valve was solid and I put over 135K on it. My '92 Suzuki engine was a SOHC Hemi solid that I put close to 200K on. Today many OHC engines are cam on bucket (solid). If engineered correctly they will last a few long time.

Stan

[taff2]

It's all about 'offshore parts ' or parts manufactured from 'offshore' materials.

[Half-Inch Stud]

AHHHHHH, so tempted to install my Lunati 40707 into the spare 455. BIG!!

[mgarblik]

Originally Posted by Formulajones

I run 3 of them. One is a daily driver.

As far as noise, I don't even notice it. It's a tight lash (.014") solid flat tappet. With the hood shut you can't hear it.

As far as adjustments, we've put about 50k miles on it so far and it hasn't budged since initial break in. Been close to 5 years now. I was checking it frequently at first but as it got miles on it and wasn't moving I started checking it once a year. This past year I didn't even bother checking it. It's been maintenance free.

As far as failure rate, it's about the same as hydraulic rollers and hydraulic flat tappets have been for me........none. I did go the extra mile and nitride the camshaft, then bought the Comp EDM hole lifters that keep the face of the lifter and the lobe lubed with pressurized oil. Then went through a proper break in procedure.
Apparently it's working perfectly because the adjustments haven't budged anywhere.

Not sure why anyone would be afraid of solid flat tappets. They were OEM in tons of cars right up through the 60's and with todays advancements and all the things you can do, they are even better now.

All of the pain and misery above is the primary reason I changed direction on my Catalina engine. I am building it with a solid flat tappet camshaft. That and saving approximately $1200.00 between the camshaft and lifters. Spent the savings on a better set of connecting rods to raise peak power to 7000-7200 RPM.

[BILL BOWMAN1]

I have them in my 421 Catalina. Probably 15 years old, but not a lot of miles. I don’t run the snot out of it just a weekend cruiser. The noise can be a little annoying once in a while but so far so good .