[The Champ]

Ok, yesterday at my part time retirement gig, I went to one of the area hospitals to pick up donated blood from a Mayo Clinic blood drive and transport it to one of the Mayo labs for processing.

While exiting that hospital, I saw this:



A Nissan Leaf. But not a "normal" Nissan Leaf. Notice the rear fender skirts added for aerodynamic improvement of it's range.

When I first saw it, my mind flashed back to when I lived in Germany nearly 50 years ago, and the Citroen:



I thought the Citroen was ugly then and the regular Nissan Leaf is almost as ugly. But putting those fender skirts on only made it look worse.

And I seriously doubt that they really extend the range enough (or at all) to justify the time and expense to have them fabricated. And they didn't even paint them to match, so they stick out like a sore thumb.

[PontiJunk]

It feels like car makers will go to any length to improved an efficiency number on paper. I can't imagine the extra expense and engineering to have gas powered cars shut off at a stop light to save a gallon per year (guessing and maybe guessing poorly). If I get stuck waiting for a long train to go by, I will turn it off myself.

[Half-Inch Stud]

Originally Posted by PontiJunk

It feels like car makers will go to any length to improved an efficiency number on paper. I can't imagine the extra expense and engineering to have gas powered cars shut off at a stop light to save a gallon per year (guessing and maybe guessing poorly). If I get stuck waiting for a long train to go by, I will turn it off myself.

yes, i hear the absurdity of a gas engine start at residential stop signs. Is a wonder they dont roll thru to keep the engine running!

[Lemans64]

Some of the Prius models have aluminum wheels but have hubcap to make it more aerodynamic, LOL.
Might same a few lbs on the wheel weight I guess.

[Vid]

My ‘18 Volvo V90 wagon shuts off at stoplights when it’s in “Eco Mode” or “Comfort Mode”. I always thought it to be true that cars use more gas starting back up from being off, than versus just leave it idling within a reasonable amount of time of course. I’m probably wrong since the auto industry has a little more research invested in that than my old wives tales from the’70’s, hahahaha. That being said, I don’t see any significant fuel savings when it’s in Eco Mode, than when I put the car in “Performance Mode” (and it doesn’t shut off at stoplights in Performance). But it NOTICEABLY hauls ass more when it’s in Performance mode.


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[Stuart]

The auto shutoff is for reducing emissions as well as for economy. This article helps explain, in city driving with lots of stoplights it can improve your mileage: https://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/...save-fuel.html

As for the skirts on the Leaf, the owner must be a hypermiler; they like making modifications to their cars to get as much mileage as they can. It really isn't all that different than people who try to improve the performance of their cars...they have different end goals but both groups do things that may or may not help that much. The enjoyment is in trying things out to see what works.

[mgarblik]

Originally Posted by PontiJunk

It feels like car makers will go to any length to improved an efficiency number on paper. I can't imagine the extra expense and engineering to have gas powered cars shut off at a stop light to save a gallon per year (guessing and maybe guessing poorly). If I get stuck waiting for a long train to go by, I will turn it off myself.

These start/stop systems have been out long enough that I am seeing ALLOT of battery replacement now in my shop. Especially GM cars with the Ecotech 4-cyl. They use two batteries, a smaller one in the trunk for the power electronics and the larger one under the hood on top of the main computer. (brilliant) They are generally sold in a pair now and that can be required to maintain a warranty as they both fail more or less together every 3-4 years max at around $400-450.00 retail for the battery pair from a reliable brand. So with a regular battery costing $150.00 retail maximum, you have to save another $300.00 in gas before you break even every 3-4 years.

[Vid]

Originally Posted by Stuart

The auto shutoff is for reducing emissions as well as for economy.

Yes the emissions aspect seems to make more tangible sense than straight fuel savings. Thanks for posting that article.

My first brand new car was an ‘88 Festiva, one of those pregnant roller skates, lol. I was a young man with a career in sales and was after the most economical car I could find. I did a number of tweaks to that thing from maxing out the ignition timing, the tire pressure, to a home made “Ram Air” induction system made with dryer vent hose. Ford (made by Kia, actually) rated it at 46mpg highway but I was getting 52! Damn I wish I tried the fender skirts, haha.


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[rustedgoat]

To some electric car owners its all about the mileage. Same way people on this board want to increase hp or better their 1/4 mile time. A lot of similar techniques are used like increasing efficiency, reducing any parasitic drag, weight reduction, aerodynamics and some very annoying driving styles.

[Simple Man]

I had a science teacher in grade school who had a Citroen like the one pictured. It was green, and just as ugly as that one.

[bdk1976]

I've always wondered how those all electric vehicles do in places with very cold winters - I would think battery life would take a pretty decent hit due to subzero cold and (I'm assuming) electric resistance heating for the cabin.

[oldblueponcho]

Originally Posted by bdk1976

I've always wondered how those all electric vehicles do in places with very cold winters - I would think battery life would take a pretty decent hit due to subzero cold and (I'm assuming) electric resistance heating for the cabin.

From what I've been told they don't do well in the Yukon, and I imagine Alaska is the same story.

[428goat]

I have a 2012 Chevy Volt. Bought it used with 14000 miles. Great car. Not made anymore. We use it for everything. Yes the miles traveled in the winter goes down because of the electric heater. But I can go for weeks in the winter between getting my 5 gallons of gas..
Average for the life of the car right now is 135 mpg. Normal highway mpg on gas is 41 mpg.

[rtp]

Here is a Tesla story...here in Utah we have near zero temps in winter.
My son lives 180 miles away in SLC and came home for christmas for a few days in his new Tesla.
It consumed about all the charge driving here so we just plugged in to 120v as I don't have a fast charge 240v here. With 120v it will only provide 3 miles in range per charging hour.
After overnite in near zero weather he only had enough charge to go 50 miles so
we took the thing down town to a charging station for another overnight charge
At the medium charge rate available there it will provide 18 miles of range per charge hour however with the cold the battery packs require heated coolant circulation and this alone sucked it down to 28%.
He decided to chance it and took off for home...didn't make it and had to get a room and charge again
Not impressed

[400 4spd.]

I've been asked what gas mileage my Excursion gets. I reply that I don't know, but I've never run out of gas stations.

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by bdk1976

I've always wondered how those all electric vehicles do in places with very cold winters - I would think battery life would take a pretty decent hit due to subzero cold and (I'm assuming) electric resistance heating for the cabin.

Range is reduced, but it's something the owners learn to deal with. Older cars used resistance heating, but more and more they're going to heat pumps that are a lot more efficient.

[jhein]

Fortunately there is a simple, easy prescription to cure that anxiety. The ICE!! LOL

Originally Posted by 400 4spd.

I've been asked what gas mileage my Excursion gets. I reply that I don't know, but I've never run out of gas stations.

Boy, do I miss my Excursion diesel. Selling that was one of the biggest vehicle mistakes I've made. 44 gallon tank and 21 mph at 70-75 mph. Awesome. I still don't know what I was thinking.

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by oldblueponcho

From what I've been told they don't do well in the Yukon, and I imagine Alaska is the same story.

Doesn't have to be the Yukon or Alaska.

EV's in MN (except for city dwellers that use them for short commutes) are pretty worthless in most of the state.

[einstein]

Originally Posted by 400 4spd.

I've been asked what gas mileage my Excursion gets. I reply that I don't know, but I've never run out of gas stations.

Ask them if they run out, will someone come along to rescue them with a 5 gallon can of electricity?

Then there's this concern:

[gobrdgo]

Range anxiety is real. Way worse as recharging is a hassle and can take a long time. I bought a Chevy spark 100% electric. Perfect weapon to have in your quiver for commuting. When new it was 80 miles. Now it’s like 50. So kinda lame as the batteries age. But if you drive a set commute as most do it’s fine. But you need a second car for road trips etc. I gave it to my mother in law. Don’t do any maintenance but tires.