[gregm]

I am interested in some information as to getting it on with a turbo on my car rather than putting it on n,o,s, or a supercharger any leads here would help. I have a 1972 pontiac lemans that is as good as new with 65000 original miles that I bought from the orig. owner in 2000. I have a 1976 ys 400 block with .030 bore and a turbo 400 trans . fresh and a set of 3.42 possi rear out of a 73 gto. The best time I have ever run was two years ago I ran 3 passes at 13.998 and 99 mph times I was happy then and put the car away for the last two and some years. The car is going to need some work to the motor as the rear main leaks oil and one of the intake lobes off the cam is just about gone.... don,t ask. I currently have a set of cast 11 heads re worked on the motor with the valves out of a set of 6x heads that used to be on the car. I am planning on installing a set of cast 94 off a 421 that I spent a small fortune getting rebuilt this fall along with an appropriate cam and of course new bearings and the like. I realize the combo will be a bit of math but hey its a hobby and thats just the way it goes. I am thinking once the motor is back together I would like some sort of belt driven turbo that is connected to the carb to give the car the added kick it needs but at a reasonable price. Has anyone done this out there and if so any help here would be greatly appreciated. thanks sooo much and I would just like to say all the help I have gotten in the past has been great. There are some pictures of the car it was posted as car of the week a few years ago it is green on green bench and the pictures are on the ponmtiac picture site under 1972

[60man]

Turbo = exhaust gas driven...
Super charger = belt driven...
There are a couple options for a Pontiac now.
Pro Charger or Vortec.
I know nothing about install but several members here are knowledgeable..

[Jim Scites]

You should get in contact with Tom Vaught or Pontiac Dude. Both of them are selling complete Vortec or Procharger setups. They are both members on this forum. I'm sure either of them will be glad to help you out.

[Brian Baker]

Sorry to say, but if your heads are cast # 094, you just wasted your money. The only 094 head I could find listed was a small valve (1.88/1.60) 326 head in 1966. Like Troy said, a belt driven "turbo" is actually a centrifugal supercharger (ie - Vortec, Procharger, etc.).

[Mr_GTO]

http://www.ststurbo.com/

Or you could put a custom kit on it.

[Tom Vaught]

First off you need to get the compression ratio right for your supercharged engine. This means working with the PY board members to get a set of heads that would be around 8.2 to 8.6 to 1 compression ratio on your 76 400 +.030 engine. If you were trying to get about 40% more power, the block, crank, pistons should be ok for that deal IF the basic machining was done correctly by the shop.
Unported heads will work fine for your project and save those heads you paid the big money for for a different project.

Vortech Engineering will be offering a 40% HP kit for a Pontiac (with A/C possible) sometime in the February 2008 time frame with their engineerer brackets and supercharger. I can help you out on that deal once the Kit is released. It should be a "BOLT ON" kit with minimal extra fabrication work.

Pontiac Dude, as was mentioned, makes his own kit from items he personally makes. It will not work with an A/C car. It may require some fabrication of parts as Pontiac Dyde does not have the resources that Vortech Engineering has in house. Thousands of Vortech Engineering kits have been made in the past for Fords and Chevy engines. I don't know how many kits Pontiac Dude has sold so far to members on this board. I am aware of maybe 10 people.

Tom Vaught

["Me"]

I would reccomend that you pick up a book by Corky Bell called simply "Supercharged'.

He is good at explaining things in a manner that a non-engineer can understand, and there are a lot of things you are going to need to understand. Everything you change affects something else. Read the book, then read it again, then decide what you want to do.

Amazon/Nobles/ETC. will have it or you can call Bell Engineering and get a signed copy @ 830 438 2890.

Larry

[Tom Vaught]

Quote:

"I would reccomend that you pick up a book by Corky Bell called simply "Supercharged'.

He is good at explaining things in a manner that a non-engineer can understand, and there are a lot of things you are going to need to understand. Everything you change affects something else. Read the book, then read it again, then decide what you want to do."

Totally agree, excellent book! Buy it now, and read it a couple of times, and in a couple of months when the Vortech stuff comes out you will be able to make a much better decision.

Tom V

[gregm]

I understand that doing the belt drive would be essentially a supercharger but having a car that developes only enough power to turn basically 14,s is not what I would like. I would like it if I did not have to spend $10000.00 every time I was looking to inprove the performance of the car but all I ever see is spend spend spend. With the stuff that is available on the market has anyone looked into a feasable turbo system for the 400 pontiac and if not why? The heads I had rebuilt for this car I spent about $900.00 on and they now sit and collect dust never to be opened or used so I might just as well have spent $3000.00 to buy a set of the aluminium heads with no valves or hardware and built from that. The original 6x heads I still have but no valves or springs as the machine shop opened up the cast 11s and put those into them.The problems started growing after the first week bent four pushrods and could not figure out why until we discovered the clearance between the guide and spring keeper was not enough and when I opened it up the pieces came in contact and well the rest is history. I thought screw the small valve head stuff and get a set of bathtub heads and this would help with compression and power as well but then the issue of valve angles starting playin in my mind and voila no way will the heads work without lots of mods to the pistons .Its like being on a merrygo round and it just keeps throwin you off but I don,t have the sence to say enough is enough.---thanks for the help still wonderin where to acrtually go from here with a reasonable price tag.

[screamingchief]

The original 6x heads I still have but no valves or springs as the machine shop opened up the cast 11s and put those into them.The problems started growing after the first week bent four pushrods and could not figure out why until we discovered the clearance between the guide and spring keeper was not enough and when I opened it up the pieces came in contact and well the rest is history

You need to find some pontiac people to build your stuff!!!

That happened because the valves from the 6X's are almost always too short for the earlier heads,and by using those in the 11's they probably reduced the installed height by roughly .100",that means the installed height was fubar likely as well,which is engine assembly 101,and your builders failed miserably IMHO.

Also dont bother with the '76 block casting for boosted applications,those thin main web blocks are bad news for high power builds!!!

Same deal with spending a bunch of money on those 94 cast heads,just a bad idea unless you were after a super tiny combustion chamber or something???

I suggest picking up some of the basic pontiac books like Jim Hands book and the H-O racing books and the Pete McCarthy books,from those you can begin to select the proper components to use as building blocks for high performance builds.

[PONTIAC DUDE]

Originally Posted by gregm

I understand that doing the belt drive would be essentially a supercharger but having a car that developes only enough power to turn basically 14,s is not what I would like. I would like it if I did not have to spend $10000.00 every time I was looking to inprove the performance of the car but all I ever see is spend spend spend. With the stuff that is available on the market has anyone looked into a feasable turbo system for the 400 pontiac and if not why? The heads I had rebuilt for this car I spent about $900.00 on and they now sit and collect dust never to be opened or used so I might just as well have spent $3000.00 to buy a set of the aluminium heads with no valves or hardware and built from that. The original 6x heads I still have but no valves or springs as the machine shop opened up the cast 11s and put those into them.The problems started growing after the first week bent four pushrods and could not figure out why until we discovered the clearance between the guide and spring keeper was not enough and when I opened it up the pieces came in contact and well the rest is history. I thought screw the small valve head stuff and get a set of bathtub heads and this would help with compression and power as well but then the issue of valve angles starting playin in my mind and voila no way will the heads work without lots of mods to the pistons .Its like being on a merrygo round and it just keeps throwin you off but I don,t have the sence to say enough is enough.---thanks for the help still wonderin where to acrtually go from here with a reasonable price tag.

First you have to do more research before you do things and that money already spend woulda been a lot less.
Here ya go. Info along with testing on a few different Pontiac combos.

http://www.angelfire.com/fl4/pontiacdude428/ATI.html

and more stuff to absorb. LOL.

http://www.angelfire.com/fl4/pontiacdude428/ati.html

A Centrifugal Supercharger is basically a belt driven turbo without all the heat loss making more useage hp. Let the arguments begin. LOL.

The wifes car ran 13.20's and with the basic simple P1SC ATI unit ran a second quicker with only 6 lbs of boost first time out at VMP. Driven everyday for 3 months back & forth to work. Had the capability to run mid 11's on pump gas and 10lbs with tuning. And a 068 Cam!!!! 5000 rpm. stock tranny & converter. Never got to tune on it at the track as i sold it right off her car.

Took months after that before this dude got any.

BTW: if ya do. Just buy some 5.050 long 2.11/1.77 ferrea valves and install them in your 6X heads. Good blow thru heads.

[Motor Daddy]

Originally Posted by PONTIAC DUDE

Took months after that before this dude got any.

She must be a good woman and really love you because that's legal grounds for divorce for removing and selling her Procharger.

[BruceWilkie]

PDude"Took months after that before this dude got any." I hear ya man.

Worse if you use her old parts on a new project for yourself. That brings the question of why. You can get away with it as long you dont suddenly go faster!

Dont complain though. How many guys are as lucky as we are to have a wife that likes to play with cars too?

[Tom Vaught]

Quote:

"Never got to tune on it at the track as i sold it right off her car.

Took months after that before this dude got any. "

Deal is I had a new P1sc supercharger I would have sold to Kenny
and told him about it at VMP, but it is still sitting on my shelf and Kenny is still not getting any, apparently. LOL!

Tom V.