[vertigto]

Another PS box thread...

I'd like to rebuild/convert the original Saginaw steering box in my 70 GTO to a quick/fast-ratio unit with 35# valve weight for a more modern feel.

I think I've narrowed it down to powersteering.com or leepowersteering.com. Seems like these are the two most highly regarded and with lifetime limited warranties. Also looks like powersteering.com is significantly cheaper, unless I am missing something.

Can anyone tell me about their recent experiences with either and/or any other companies of equal quality/warranty that I should consider?

Any advice is greatly appreciated.

[tallyhoe]

I think you already have a quick ratio?

[DaSnowman]

I upgraded my '72 Lemans Sport convertible with a replacement steering gear for a '86 IROC Z28 from O'Reillys for $140.00. It's a factory replacement 16:1 ratio. Same physical case as your '70 GTO, bolts right in. I did it in 2006. Not had a problem with ever since. It's 3.5 turns lock-to-lock.

If you are looking for the lower ratio / quicker 1-/12.7:1 ratio, you will pay a lot more money for it. Unless I'm doing autocross or road work, I personally don't need that quick a steering, but it is definitely a big improvement over stock for a whole lot less money. That's my 2 cents.

[tallyhoe]

I installed one of hectors boxes. Works flawlessly.

https://www.facebook.com/17146197959...0798668330552/

[67GTONUT]

I had a great experience with powersteering.com
Rebuilt box and pump, restored to original colors..... and quick ratio.

[Jeff Hamlin]

My gearbox should be returning shortly from PS.com

Highly recommended with great rep & customer service.

[marxjunk]

i bought mine here..i researched it a bunch and looked at feedback and reviews..

ebay.com/itm/64-76-AMC-GM-Intl-Jeep-Fast-Ratio-Power-Steering-Gear-Box-w-Coupler-LARES-974/221893361287?epid=110211144&hash=item33a9dffe87:g: MnUAAOSwUKxYkq3O

weird...it wont link..do a copy and paste

[Cardo]

I have Hector's box too. So far so good. 3 1/4 turns lock to lock.

[gtospieg]

You could also check out "Turn One"

[thebuick]

I have a rebuilt one from Hector that I had done just for a spare still in the box,

[getmygoat]

I've used powersteering.com twice. Good service, works great. But expensive. If you go with some other replacement box, just be sure to check the stops. Some of the replacement boxes have different stop positions than our GTOs and the car can't do U-turns with those boxes. I believe the firebird boxes have different stop positions (shorter wheel base cars require less offset to make the u-turn when compared to longer wheelbase cars I would think the IROC box might have the same issue but I have no first hand knowledge of it.

[Schurkey]

Originally Posted by DaSnowman

I upgraded my '72 Lemans Sport convertible with a replacement steering gear for a '86 IROC Z28 from O'Reillys for $140.00. It's a factory replacement 16:1 ratio. Same physical case as your '70 GTO, bolts right in. I did it in 2006. Not had a problem with ever since. It's 3.5 turns lock-to-lock.

If you are looking for the lower ratio / quicker 1-/12.7:1 ratio, you will pay a lot more money for it. Unless I'm doing autocross or road work, I personally don't need that quick a steering, but it is definitely a big improvement over stock for a whole lot less money. That's my 2 cents.

Originally Posted by getmygoat

just be sure to check the stops. Some of the replacement boxes have different stop positions than our GTOs and the car can't do U-turns with those boxes. I believe the firebird boxes have different stop positions (shorter wheel base cars require less offset to make the u-turn when compared to longer wheelbase cars I would think the IROC box might have the same issue but I have no first hand knowledge of it.

Exactly right. Folks get caught-up in "turns lock-to-lock" which means N-O-T-H-I-N-G unless you ALSO discuss lock-to-lock turning angle. "F-body" and plenty of other GM cars have steering stops in the steering box. The older "A-body" has NO stops in the box--the steering knuckle bumps against a reinforced pad on the lower control arm. A box with steering stops provides a very wide turning circle.

NEXT, folks get caught-up in "ratio", which is important, but just as important is the diameter of the steering box torsion bar. It's the torsion bar, not the gear ratio that provides "modern" steering feel.

Angle, torsion bar, ratio, all three important.

The older Jeep Grand Cherokee steering box is the budget answer---proper angle for A-body, second-largest torsion bar, and fast ratio (assuming it was rebuilt properly--and aftermarket mass rebuilders DON'T guarantee that they'll use the "correct" parts. I bought three direct from used vehicles so I can be fairly sure they've got the OEM parts inside. The two "downsides" are that you need a different steering coupler (but you probably need that anyway!) and the PS hoses that come with the older A-bodies don't fit the metric threads of the JGC box, and the hose sealing at the box is different.

[Steve C.]

" It's the torsion bar, not the gear ratio that provides "modern" steering feel."

BINGO !


https://leepowersteering.com/pages/s...feel-explained


.

[FrankieT/A]

What exactly is the "Torsion bar"?

[Steve C.]

The torsion bar actually slides inside the input shaft. One end is pinned to the shaft while the other is pinned to the spool cap. As the driver turns the wheel, he actually twists the torsion bar, moving the valve. Once the bar has twisted a certain amount, the valve is opened completely and the steering assist is activated. You can use different size torsion bars to adjust the amount of effort required to turn the steering wheel. Smaller bars twist more easily, requiring less effort from the driver, while thicker bars do the opposite. Most short-track drivers prefer a 235 or 250 valve. The numbers represent the thickness of the torsion bar in thousandths of an inch (a 235 valve would mean a torsion bar that is 0.235 inch thick).

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/ctrp...ering-systems/

A common complaint with ‘60s muscle cars is the lack of “feel” in the steering wheel compared to newer cars. Many assume this comes from increased line pressure. The reality is a little more complex.

Inside the steering box, splined directly to the steering column, is a small torsion bar. When the steering wheel is initially moved, this input twists the torsion bar. Original ‘60s steering boxes used very small diameter torsion bars to minimize the effort, creating that “one finger” feel.

https://www.chevyhardcore.com/tech-s...ower-steering/

A topic of interest, valving and road feel. I bought a AGR box with 12:1 ratio and upgraded from the standard 210 valving to a firmer 220 valving. Absolutely outstanding out on the open road with the firmer valving. The upgraded valving provides a firm road feel, like what you might find in a modern sporty car like a BMW, etc, yet for my needs it's adequate for around town and related parking. Side note, info offered for general interest only, the purpose was not to necessarily endorse AGR.



.

[vertigto]

So...I appreciate all the advice, but the original question was rebuilding my original Saginaw box to @ 12.7:1 ratio with 35# valve weight as described on Lee's website and similar to powersteering.com. I believe that would eliminate stop issues and provide the modern/responsive feel I am looking for. Any downfalls, aside from $$?

I realize this may be a more expensive route, but would retain a stock appearance/originality.
Seems like between the two companies, powersteering.com has had more use/positive feedback. Can anyone comment on Turn One of any other vendors worth considering for my application/specs?

[getmygoat]

Also not sure you are looking for this info but if you ship the box and/or pump, make sure to double bag it and tie off each of the bags. One of the boxes I shipped ended up leaking PS fluid which destroyed the box, etc. it made it to PS.com but was quite a mess.

[Tom Vaught]

I had Tom Lee build me a Steering Box back about about 2004,
it is still like brand new and very easy to make turns vs the old 3.5+ turn factory box.
I got spoiled with the quicker steering when I owned my 1978 Trans Am.

For a few years Tom Lee was out of the steering box game but in the last couple of years
is back building high quality steering boxes.

Just a post from a happy Tom Lee customer.

Tom V.

[389]

Its a lot more then the torsion bar... I had Mark S. at SC&C explain it too me... Best bet is Lee steering... https://leepowersteering.com/

[OG68]

Tom Lee retired several years ago and LEE Steering is now run by a former employee. I had them rebuild a JGC box with the stiffer 35# bar for my El Camino. Effort is about as close as you can get to manual steering at a moderate cost and still retain the ability to parallel park with ease. Same great service and quality as before.