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#81
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Thanks for the heads up on this camshaft JC455. I just ordered one for the 433 in my GTO. I didn't know Howard's made them with a 112 lobe separation angle. I hope you guys figure out a lifter that will work. This is a great idea.
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Todd Sedlmeier Who ever thought pinewood derby cars would lead to this! October 2004 HPP Shootout participate http://www.highperformancepontiac.co...out/index.html 86 Grand Prix 535 High Port 8.93 @ 153 65 GTO 433 High Port 12.04 @ 113 |
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#82
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I think this idea is really close to working. I would prefer the gm dogbones if they would work. They have closed ends so it would not be possible to slide around as much. Also look at the later gm 3.4 retainer bar. Instead of spider it is much more rigid. The concept of retaining the dogbone with a rev kit style got me thinking.. If you had a rocker stud girdle it could span all the lifters retain the dogbones, have thru holes for pushtubes, and bolt to a crossbar bridging the valley.
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#83
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#84
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#85
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Thanks for that pic. That is the concept I had in mind. Wasn't aware of that.
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#86
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ah, if the lifters are splayed for the valves then rotating the guide 90° makes perfect sense... |
#87
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'If', that's a big 'if', and most likely a 'no'. Technically its the lifter bores.
This thread is still going? Take the dive and try it, let us know how it turns out. .
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. 1970 GTO Judge Tribute Pro-Tour Project 535 IA2 http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=760624 1971 Trans Am 463, 315cfm E-head Sniper XFlow EFI, TKO600 extreme, 9", GW suspension, Baer brakes, pro tour car https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...ght=procharger Theme Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zKAS...ature=youtu.be |
#88
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The 1997-2000 BBC lifter showed up today. After a quick check I noted it is simply a 2148 lifter with the guides 90° rotated. Still the same issue with the oil feed hole and body of the lifter sticking out.
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#89
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In the for what it is worth file. I measured the Crane rollers I have, as you see the oil band needs to be 0.300" up higher to engage the oil port in the lifter bore. I am debating whether to rework the lifters I have or run the Crower solids I have.
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#90
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So .300 up further is what, from when it's on the base circle?
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. 1970 GTO Judge Tribute Pro-Tour Project 535 IA2 http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=760624 1971 Trans Am 463, 315cfm E-head Sniper XFlow EFI, TKO600 extreme, 9", GW suspension, Baer brakes, pro tour car https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...ght=procharger Theme Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zKAS...ature=youtu.be |
#91
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Couldn't measure from the base circle - the diagonal lines are the oil feed in the bore. Right side is the top of the lifter bore. The tapered section is the oil band on the lifter - the red line where I need to grind for most oil transfer. 0.300" is a blonde one too much, more like 0.270" will work without breaching the top of the lifter bore.
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#92
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#93
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Just need to say, IF, you are starting from scratch, and are worried about hyd roller issues, just dang go solid roller. It's no-brainer. The cam ramps are DESIGNED for a solid roller. A hybrid setup just adds overhead. You stand the extended risk of human error.
I like the fact that people are engineering this stuff out and looking/debunking options, but, um, don't you think others have pioneered this path way before we even thought about questioning it? I just think it's not this complicated, maybe I'm just not as worried as most? Try it, if it fails, keep going until something works for you. Done. (sorry if I'm raining on a parade here, but dang, we are talking about a thread that's gone near 100 posts...) .
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. 1970 GTO Judge Tribute Pro-Tour Project 535 IA2 http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=760624 1971 Trans Am 463, 315cfm E-head Sniper XFlow EFI, TKO600 extreme, 9", GW suspension, Baer brakes, pro tour car https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...ght=procharger Theme Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zKAS...ature=youtu.be |
#94
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Did anyone ever get one of these SBF dogbone/factory GM lifter motors going? I have (IIRC) the same HR cam as the OP waiting to go in my 400.
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-Jeremy 1968 GTO 4-spd convertible, console, factory gauges, hidden headlights, 3.90:1 posi, AM/FM radio. 1962 Catalina convertible, Starlight black w maroon interior & white top. |
#95
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Yeah, a really good question. (I like post #93)
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"No replacement for displacement!" GTOAA--https://www.gtoaa.org/ |
#96
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I’m not saying I don’t agree with you, but for someone doing their research, when a google search points you to someone with “cam designer” by their name and they are lambasting the hybrid idea......it’s easy to start to question it. I was just doing it the other day because I’m considering a hybrid setup in my BBC. In my own head trying to rationalize it all, I’m guessing that your average mild to aggressive hyd roller stick, is likely very similar to a mechanical roller stick designed for a tight lash.
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1967 Firebird 462 580hp/590ftlbs 1962 Pontiac Catalina Safari Swapped in Turd of an Olds 455 Owner/Creator Catfish Motorsports https://www.youtube.com/@CatfishMotorsports |
#97
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Jones cam is one of them.I did the solid on Hyd roller cams years ago but when the lifters got better I changed over and never looked back.FYI,remember when that is done your cam becomes smaller.Comp says you loose about 8 degrees duration plus the lash that is used.Comp told me 6 thou.And Hyd roller cams are not ground with solid ramps.The ramps are designed for zero lash.I was amazed how much more aggressive my old faithful cam acted when I took the solid off and put the Hyd rollers on.Carry on.Tom
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#98
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You'll find many cam designers against the hybrid idea. Harold Brookshire is another one that was against the hybrid idea. He mentioned just as Tom touched on, lash ramp design is completely different as one reason. If you look around the internet you can probably find some of Harold's posts, he shared a wealth of information on his cam designs, very smart guy. Many Pontiac people loved his old Ultradyne stuff, me included.
I'm with Tom and the others. If debating running solid lifters, I prefer to just do the whole deal, change the stick and all. Then you at least will have the ability to have the solid stick ground specific and gain back some of the lost duration you get when putting solids on a hydraulic. |
#99
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spyder set up
I got side tracked on my project with the ford spyder and sealed power lifters but I should be back on it soon. A friend of mine has 5 or 6 of them running that have been done for several years with no issues. I will update when I get mine running.
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#100
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I’m going to pull the motor this fall and change over to a hyd roller, and will give this a shot.
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-Jeremy 1968 GTO 4-spd convertible, console, factory gauges, hidden headlights, 3.90:1 posi, AM/FM radio. 1962 Catalina convertible, Starlight black w maroon interior & white top. |
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