[NeighborsComplaint]

KYB's with OEM replacement Delco springs and 1-1/4" Addco sway bars. I am a fan of the compliant pring/shock, stiff sway bar school of thought. Complaint ride and good handling that becomes tighter when cornered hard.

[Tom Vaught]

Originally Posted by Schurkey

Y The H-O "Tall Spindle" disc conversion moderated the roll center depth--it's actually below ground level on stock A-bodies--so that there's less leverage arm between the CG and the RC. That alone reduces body roll.

The old "H-O Racing" A-body sway bars were 1 3/8 front and rear. Maybe that's overkill. But that's what I have.

I have Adam's Chassis Engineering book. Gonna have to dig it out and re-read it.

https://www.amazon.com/Chassis-Engin...=3NWQDW0KE1VPO

Maybe old school but I have had the Tall Spindle with 12" brakes on the front for many years with the
HO Racing Front and Rear bars. Also have the Tom Lee Power Steering Box. 1964 A-Body vehicle.

Most likely there are other parts out there that might be slightly better but the parts I have (above) have done the job for many years.

Tom V.

[Schurkey]

Originally Posted by chiphead

Took a closer look at the rear suspension. There are 2" coil spring spacers above the rear springs. This is how the PO kept it from dragging on the 275 DRs. How does that affect the suspension behavior?

Spacer or no spacer makes no difference. What matters is ride-height.

The usual problem with jacking-up the back end of an A-body for tire clearance is that it makes the suspension subject to wheel-hop on acceleration.

Originally Posted by chiphead

Is there a front and rear sway bar set that you guys would recommend?

When it was my money, I bought the H-O Racing front and rear bars. The way I remember it, not long thereafter H-O was bought out by Malibu Performance; and I have no idea if they're still in business. Perhaps those parts are now "history". But there are plenty of competing products on the market from Addco, Hotchkiss, and others. No doubt some knockoff crap from China as well.

The low-budget version would be to scavenge a front bar from a Treasure Yard Trans-Am from the '70s or early '80s, and a rear bar from any mid-'60s, early '70s A-body or B-body. The newer body style A- and B-bodies used different rear suspension, those bars don't work for the earlier chassis.

Originally Posted by chiphead

Will a rear bar for a 10 bolt fit a Ford 9"? I assume the lower control arm mounted ones would fit?

The bars are not for a "10-bolt". The bars are intended to fit the chassis, not the specific axle. These cars could have come with various designs of "10-bolt" axles, the Chevy 12-bolt, the Olds "12-bolt" including the aluminum version. The ones that mount to the control arms (stock-style bars for A- or B- and--maybe--C-body of those years) need reinforced trailing arms with the appropriate bolt-holes but should fit any reasonable axle assembly. GM sometimes used shims between the trailing arm and the bar--as few as "none" and as many as three, I think.

I saw a thread in the last couple of weeks where someone had a stock style bar on a vehicle with a 9" axle, clearance was slight, but it did work.

EDIT: This thread:
https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...d.php?t=864524

[1968GTO421]

FWIW After talking with another GTO guy, he recommended Spohn Performance to me as well as UMI. Both are in PA and Spohn manufactures their stuff in the USA.
I used their 926A sway bars with their 221 rear lower control arms. Installed well with no problems and made a real difference in the handling of my A body (GTO). They were helpful to me with some advice when needed.
I like Shurkey's advice on the wrecking yards but here in the upstate there is so much growth we've lost all of our yards that had older cars (pre-2000) to vast housing tracts. That's why I went with Spohn as "treasure yards" have disappeared within reasonablr distance.

https://www.spohn.net/shop/1964-1967-GM-A-Body/

[chiphead]

68GTO, Thanks, I was looking at UMI. The Spohn is a bigger front bar for the same price! Seems like a win to me.

The axle housing needs new bushings. Should I use poly or rubber for a good handling street car? My current boxed lowers have poly bushings. My uppers are adjustable spherical, forget the brand.
If I was going with the KYB shocks in the rear, should I use KYB or Koni adjustable in the front? The front has a drag spring that stores energy and comp engineering 3-way drag shocks. It really wants to hike up on a hard launch.

[Schurkey]

There's no point in putting different (street) shocks on drag springs.

[chiphead]

Here's a pic of the front suspension at ride height and a pic of how the car sits. Does this tell anything about the type of spring or how its set up? I can change the springs later when I do the engine swap. Dont shoot the messenger, I didnt set this car up.

What can I do to make this more street friendly?

[78w72]

Originally Posted by Schurkey

There's no point in putting different (street) shocks on drag springs.

X2 on this. your first post said the car is all over the place like a sailing ship & you want a street shock for a street car thats never raced.

first thing to get the car to handle better on the street if to get rid of those drag shocks, they dont control the ride on the street very well compared to OEM or lowering type springs, get a stock replacement if you like that ride height or buy a more performance type lowered stiffer spring, then pick the shocks you like & can afford. for a street cruiser normal OEM shocks like KYB or other brands mentioned will be fine on a good OEM spring. if you want better handling performance get a lowered stiffer spring and some konis or billsteins... but get rid of the drag springs and shocks if the car will only be street driven.

[Schurkey]

Originally Posted by chiphead

Here's a pic of the front suspension at ride height and a pic of how the car sits. Does this tell anything about the type of spring or how its set up?

Originally Posted by Schurkey

Shocks are only half your problem. They ARE a problem, but you also need springs.

A given ride-height can be had with short, stiff springs, or tall, soft springs. The car will look the same when parked. There will be a night-and-day difference when driving.

You need new springs every bit as much as you need to ditch the shocks. If your "aftermarket lowered" springs are set up for drag racing like the shocks, you'll wear-out new shocks in a hurry. You need "street" springs and shocks in a matching front-rear set.

Beyond that, previous posts have discussed heaps of additional parts that would be an improvement over stock.

Are we sure the front suspension is not just plain worn-out? Limp rag-joints are epidemic. The OEM steering boxes were a mess when they were new--slow ratio, weak torsion bar. Really tragic, because the engineering of the box is marvelous, but the parts selection was a complete disaster. Parts exist to correct that...but GM didn't use them at that time.

Loose wheel bearings, ball joints, tie rod ends, idler arm, etc.?

[chiphead]

You're right. All of that could be suspect. But Rome wasn't built in a day. I just need something to get me by until I pull it all apart and fix it the right way. Shocks and sway bars are easy to do. A full front end tear down is a bigger deal. I'm already swapping in that Ford 9-in that's a big enough project by itself.

I got a Bel air been blown apart for years and I need to get it done. If I've learned anything it's only blow one car apart at a time

[Sirrotica]

Heavier sway bars, make sure the bushings are all in good shape, ball joints, and steering linkage linkage tight. A set of quality gas conventional shocks, springs that are not sagged, or dropped. The steering box needs to be tight as far as backlash. Hopefully the car has power steering, as the manual box is really slow lock to lock. Putting a better/quicker box in helps, but isn't necessary.

Top that off with an alignment that puts at least one degree of positive caster, (more if you can get more with stock parts) sometimes you can get 3 degrees with stock parts. 1/2 a degree of negative camber, 1/8th inch of toe in.

If you have the cars front end set like this, and the rear axle bushings are tight and not worn out, you should have a vast improvement. The car should not be hiked up in the rear, because it will then be susceptible to wheel hop as the geometry is off when it's raised excessively.

I assume you have radial tires, bias ply isn't going to get the job done.

From my own experience, this should get you in the ballpark for a decent driving street car, if you want to spend more time, and money you can surely improve it even more.

This will make most any A body much closer to a better handling street car without breaking the bank, and investing many hours in labor.

[chiphead]

Here's a few pics of the disc brakes. Can y'all confirm what caliper and brake hose this is? I need new brake hoses.

[Schurkey]

Originally Posted by chiphead

Here's a few pics of the disc brakes. Can y'all confirm what caliper and brake hose this is? I need new brake hoses.

Delco calipers and OEM hoses from whatever vehicle was the donor?

Donor vehicle is harder to figure. Likely a '69-72 A-body if the steering knuckle height isn't altered with a "tall-spindle" conversion.

That's where I'd start, anyway.

S10 disc conversions are (were?) also popular, if your rotors are 10" instead of 11". Cheap and available, not especially effective.

[KEN CROCIE]

H-Os F &R sway bar sizes were 1-3/8 front and 1-3/8 rear. We had these custom made by Hellwig. Closest available now are from Hellwig with 1-5/16 front { 55703} and 1" rear {5800}
The shocks I used to sell for my suspension pkgs were KYB Gas Adjusts or Koni s. Ride quality is good.
Use with good sticky tires and you will be amazed.

[HWYSTR455]

A new-to-you car has many 'unknown' parts, who knows what the string of previous owners did.

50+ year old spring are just that, 50+ year old spring. Not only has the tech come light years, but springs that old are done. (and simply, old-tech)

Herb's comments on 'soft-spring/big bars' approach was based off the original, NEW, OE trans am springs, and preferably, the WS6 springs. Once those springs are 50+ years old, it's all moot anyway.

Keep in mind, when the trans ams were new, the 'designed' spring rates took the control arm bushings into account. They changed the spring rate, by loading the bushing in-travel. The moment you go to new OE type bushings, you lose that overall config, because all the replacement bushings are 'generic'. The trans am bushings were unique to the car.

That's why when people went to a free-moving type bushing, which allows for more free articulation (desired), many noticed the change in characteristics, and started 'chasing' to get it back. You have to change the spring rate.

Best approach is to do it all at once, in a 'package', but that's not always in someone's budget. You can choose a desired end-design and go piece by piece, but not only does it cost more in the long run, but you have to tolerate the characteristics that the 'unbalance' creates until it's all done.

Sway bars are used to tune the characteristics of the car's 'attitude' driver's driving style. Understeer/oversteer is basically the 2 factors. Again, you need to wait until everything else above the bars is complete.

So honestly, at the moment, it kinda doesn't matter what shocks you use. Shocks basically last about 24k miles, less if you're a 'spirited' driver. I've used a lot of Bilstein and Konis. Konis are a hair better, but they are both still just 'mid-grade' shocks at best.

4-links in general, eat right-rear shocks. In the LeMans, I would get about 10-12k miles out of them, at most. The more I tightened up the rear suspension, and allowed for more free articulation, the longer they started lasting.

.

[HWYSTR455]

Originally Posted by shaker455

Belltech street performance 55 mm shocks

https://www.belltech.com/oem-replace...ormance-shocks

Those look interesting, and affordable. I'd say they are worth a try. Look like a good mid-grade offering, and bet they challenge the base Bilsteins & Konis.



.