[Nitebird]

Originally Posted by HWYSTR455

Post a pic of that please!

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Is there a forum on this site that would be appropriate to post another make of car? If so I will take a pic and post it there.

[Nitebird]

Originally Posted by llwta76

Okay... My stock ST-10 w/2.43 first gear has been living behind my 440" w/500hp and 520# tq. and BFG 255/60's ( radial T/As) for years. Street only but I've hammered on it from time to time through the gears. No signs of wear.

That is good to know. I will not be hammering on mine at every stop light either but every once and awhile

[glenn911]

Heck I broke both a super T-10 and a wide ratio muncie with a low comp 6x 400.....LOL!

[Nitebird]

Originally Posted by Larry Navarro

2.43 ratio first gear, typical of the late 2nd gen f-bodys, Z-28 included.

Larry, I have the factory stock 10 bolt 4wheel disc rearend in my car...what size should it be 7.5 or 8.2 or 8.5??? I would like to order a rear-end "pre-load" cover like T/A Performance offers.

What size do I order or look for?

[Nitebird]

Originally Posted by glenn911

Heck I broke both a super T-10 and a wide ratio muncie with a low comp 6x 400.....LOL!

It seems that some people are breaking them with stock engines and others who have high HP engines are making them live behind there combo.


What tires and how many miles were on that trans?
What RPM were you shifting at?

When it broke did it break from a holeshot dig or during a roll?

[ta man]

Originally Posted by Nitebird

Larry, I have the factory stock 10 bolt 4wheel disc rearend in my car...what size should it be 7.5 or 8.2 or 8.5??? I would like to order a rear-end "pre-load" cover like T/A Performance offers.

What size do I order or look for?

8.5..Pretty slick unit I have one too..

[rtanner]

ive got alot experience, running the piss out of muncies and st-10s in all kinds a cars, that st-10 will live behind your combo in def, if you lift off the gas going to 2nd and 3rd, shift fast but dont get back on that throttle till clutch is engaged in 2nd and 3rd, pull the gears and shift it on the floor like i do, and second will be gone in short time and so will third, hell ive split the cases on several from the cluster trying to spread away from the main shaft due to the high torque, and yes add subframe connectors regardless off your choice in bushings, but i put poly in my t/a and z-28s

[llwta76]

Originally Posted by rtanner

ive got alot experience, running the piss out of muncies and st-10s in all kinds a cars, that st-10 will live behind your combo in def, if you lift off the gas going to 2nd and 3rd, shift fast but dont get back on that throttle till clutch is engaged in 2nd and 3rd, pull the gears and shift it on the floor like i do, and second will be gone in short time and so will third, hell ive split the cases on several from the cluster trying to spread away from the main shaft due to the high torque, and yes add subframe connectors regardless off your choice in bushings, but i put poly in my t/a and z-28s

First,stay away from sticky tires. That's a killer over time. Also the above advice will help. Speed shifting puts a lot of strain on that thing. A iron mid plate is on my wish list.

[Larry Navarro]

Originally Posted by Nitebird

It seems that some people are breaking them with stock engines and others who have high HP engines are making them live behind there combo.

What tires and how many miles were on that trans?
What RPM were you shifting at?

When it broke did it break from a holeshot dig or during a roll?

....or what "historical" abuse did the trans have previous to the failure?

My car had three different engines in it......from the stock 400, to a 455HO and the current 455 stroker/roller deal. The trans had over 100K miles and same for the untouched 3.23 rear-end.
I would have NEVER figured the trans would let go before the rear-end.
The pre-load rear cover proabably kept that from happening first.

[pippintook]

I know this is an old thread - just my feedback and running a Borg Warner Super T10 4 speed with 450-475HP stroker motor in 78 Trans Am.

I think my combo is likely around 450-475HP (stroker 1978 400 w 6x Heads -ported by SD to 260CFM, 9.2:1 CR, SD Stump Puller cam, 78 cast intake and qjet, 1 3/4" headers, ST10, 3.42s). I had my original Super T10 rebuilt by good local guy. The ST10 was in nice original shape - he put in new kit (synchros, bearings) that was around $200. I used the original case, gears, shafts, side plate etc. I run 255/60/15 Yokohamas Avid STs. I dont speed shift - I always lift off the accelerator when shifting between gears.

I had it at 1/4 track one time this past summer. The 255/60/15 Yokohamas Avid STs are old. At the track, I did real short dry burn out. I totally babied it off the line. I was so paranoid about breaking the original ST10 trans.
I did not rev up the motor or dump the clutch. I just quickly released the clutch and would give it gas. I just tried to find a spot between letting clutch up quickly and giving it gas that would not spin the tires. Using this method, I got poor traction with the Yokohamas Avid STs. The tires always seemed to be slipping a bit. I cant remember what my 0-60ft times were - but i know they were terrible. Using this driving style, on 4-5 passes, I ran mid 13s. Best ET was a 13.65 at 108mph When I broke loose and tires spun - it was 14/15s ET

In a couple of thousand street miles , I have never had any issues. I beat on it pretty hard on the street and it is a blast to drive. With 108mph top speed in 1/4, I know the car can run a high 12 (or better). But , I need better traction coming out of the hole. But, with better traction, I risk breaking the ST10

[pippintook]

Just my 2 cents on this question ...can a stock Borg Warner Super T10 survive behind a 500HP Pontiac 455 (or stroker 400) in a 2nd Gen (ie. heavy 3800lbs) F Body

I would say a stock Borg Warner Super T10 can probably survive behind a 500HP Pontiac 455 (or stroker 400) in a 2nd Gen (ie. heavy 3800lbs) F Body.... though like most issues...there are caveats . Some possible considerations

(i) trans (gears, shafts, synchros, etc) should be in good shape..ideally rebuilt
(ii) soft compound/drag type tires are not used
(iii) no dumping the clutch / hard launches where car really hooks well
(iv) no speed shifting

I know there are some that have successfully run a stock Super T10 and used soft compound/drag type tires and launched at high RPM and speed shifted and the Super T10 survived.
But, I think in general , a stock Borg Warner Super T10 can probably survive behind a 500HP Pontiac 455 (or stroker 400) in a heavy 2nd gen F body if these things are done (trans in good shape, soft compound/drag type tires not used, no hard launches where car really hooks well, no speed shifting)

Though, the whole point of building a 500HP (or 550HP) Pontiac 455 (or stroker 400)....is to run fast..and to run fast in general you gotta launch hard....man, I might just get a TH400

[Half-Inch Stud]

no.

[pastry_chef]

Originally Posted by CROCIE JR

Also its not the HP. Its the TQ. It will be hard to remove the TQ from your 455 combo.

It is ALWAYS about power (horsepower)
wheel force (newtons) = power-in-watts / wheel speed in meters-per-second

One thousand RPM or ten thousand RPM.

1000 ft.lbs of engine torque does not matter but how much POWER is being put to the ground at a given speed does.

Those thousands of newtons (or pounds) to the wheel push back through the chasis.

[goa484]

HP=(Torque x Rpm) /5252, so they are related. Thats why I like it when things like trans are rated in torque, because I could be making alot of torque at a low rpm and not exceed a manufacturers hp rating, but exceed its torque rating.

[pastry_chef]

Originally Posted by goa484

I like it when things like trans are rated in torque, because I could be making alot of torque at a low rpm and not exceed a manufacturers hp rating, but exceed its torque rating.

Some technical details:
http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...5&postcount=10

I guess it depends on WHO the manufacturer is, aftermarket improves where the factory left off.
90% of people do things wrong, don't understand, trip over themselves etc.

Some of the best:
http://www.rosslertrans.com/3-speed.html

The 2.5 is rated for up to 900Hp and is a great option for people who will mostly race.

http://extremeautomatics.com/th400.php

TH-400 Stage I • Up to 750HP

[Cliff R]

"It will survive if you drive it normally, but using all 500+ horsepower in your heavy T/A even without sticky tires will send it to the graveyard before you know it."

Was testing a customers car out a few years ago with a fresh 455 making about 500hp or so. It was here because it was WAY down on power for the combination of parts and the "builder" couldn't figure it out. Turns out the cam was out of phase two teeth as the Rollmaster set was advanced two keyways but they lined up the original "dot", but that's another story.

Anyhow, I corrected that issue, power was restored, etc. Took it for a drive, did a full throttle start, grabbed second gear kinda-hard, it spun a tad then hooked up and BOOM!

The T-10 was freshly rebuild with upgraded internals, but it still wasn't up to the task of holding the power a 455 is capable of making......Cliff

[HWYSTR455]

Originally Posted by Half-Inch Stud

no.

Exactly. It's just a matter of how long, but it will fail if you even rarely hammer on it. Same questions come up with the 2004R. Same answers apply.

A higher rear gear helps, like one is going to last longer when using 411 rear gears than if you are using 2.56s.

What fun is a big block 4-speed muscle car if you can't hammer on it? Redline, power shift, redline, power shift, that's what everyone who owns one or wants to own one dreams about.

And believe me, you will reach a point where you will want to do that, and will, so why feel guilty when that happens?

Run it, and if it grenades, fix it. Once you get tired of fixing it, you will look for a stronger replacement. Natural progression. Point is you need to enjoy the car.

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[HWYSTR455]

Straight from Richmond's website:

https://www.richmondgear.com/richmon...-modern-power/

The combination of lightweight gears, heavy duty synchonizers, less case flex and reduced gear backlash all serve to significantly reduce gear crunch during spirited driving. Richmond Gear Super T-10 and Super T-10 Plus 4-speed transmissions are rated at up to 375 lb.-ft. of torque, weigh a mere 70 pounds (dry), feature a 26-spline input shaft and are available in six gear configurations with a low 1st for a good dig on launch and close spacing between 2nd and 4th to keep your engine in its power band.

So 375 ft lbs is the UPGRADED version, you make the call. The OE ones from the day are rated at LESS.

I think the Supercase munchies are rated at 500 ft lbs. But having troubles verifying that at the moment.

.

[tom s]

Here is the TQ rating for the diff gear ratios.
https://www.richmondgear.com/wp-cont...hmond/RG26.pdf

[Formulajones]

Run it till it breaks and then upgrade.

I'm doing a TKO600 race ready unit from Rockland with upgrades. For $2900 it just makes sense compared to the Richmond 4 speed for $2100 that is only rated at 375 and still just a 4-speed, or the Richmond 5 speed still with no overdrive that is only rated at 500 and costs $3600.