[Sirrotica]

X 5

[Steve C.]

I only have one question: Why bother? Spending 2K on heads and then hiding or disguising them confuses my Vulcan logic! I want to show those suckers off!!
67ramair4

X2


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[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by 67ramair4

I only have one question: Why bother? Spending 2K on heads and then hiding or disguising them confuses my Vulcan logic! I want to show those suckers off!!

Exactly!

Stan

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

On the other side of the coin (conservative purist outlook)
I completely understand folks who remove the branding from aftermarket heads.
Would be my first order of business if I ever use them.

They look too hammy and corny to me.
Especially the engraving on the ends - gawdy & tacky
Would be paying for their performance / advantages - not their name or logo's

Really like what you guys have done with the heads ,,, and intakes.

Also understand where/why some folks DO want all the branding and logo's.
To each, his own

[Formulajones]

To "pull it off" successfully it would first have to be a very strong running car. Second it would have to be a car that sees some dragstrip time because that's where a sneaky build shines. Doesn't shine so much at a local cruise or show. It has to actually be used for it's intended purpose.

I'm not talking about a typical 11 second car either. That can be done easily enough on a street car with real iron heads . It would have to be a car that stands out at the dragstrip, small tire, and appears stock outside as well as under the hood, but can put a number on the board.

That to me, is the purpose of a sneaky build like this.

Nothing funnier than seeing these cars at the dragstrip with $3000 aluminum heads, fancy intakes and carbs, big fat headers, and more bling than I can stand, and they can't go faster than a 13 or 14 second pass LOL And yes there are cars like that at the track.

[ZeGermanHam]

Originally Posted by Steve C.

I only have one question: Why bother? Spending 2K on heads and then hiding or disguising them confuses my Vulcan logic! I want to show those suckers off!!

I totally get why some people would want to remove excessive branding from aftermarket parts underneath their hood. Generally speaking, I fall into this camp, where I prefer less branding if it can be avoided.

However, in terms of removing logos in an attempt to trick people into thinking you have stock parts, I hold a different view of the "why bother" philosophy. The people who know their stuff will still spot the aluminum heads in a millisecond no matter what has been done to disguise them. And the people who can't spot an altered pair of aluminum heads are not likely to care about cylinder head casting numbers in the first place.

It's like the inverse of cloning a GTO. You can put GTO badges on a LeMans, but the enthusiasts will spot the non-GTO VIN right away, and the general public won't know or care what a GTO is to begin with. So ultimately, you're not really fooling anybody that matters.

With all that said, I do very much appreciate people sharing their knowledge on how to make aluminum heads more stealthy.

[Formulajones]

Some are also missing the point of some of this.

What about a rare head like a 722 or 614? Or maybe a Pontiac that originally had a 389 with not so great heads that wants a bigger engine with better heads but likes the appearance of a stock 389? It could also be a cost factor when looking at some of those pricey RAIV parts. Especially when a lot of the Pontiac guys I've run across are some of the cheapest guys on the planet.

There are a lot of pretty good reasons to do something like this.

For instance, I've been casually looking for some 614's. However at current prices I'm not all that interested anymore.

Why would I pay $3000 or $3500 for 50 year old heads to build a clone I want to race, knowing I'd have to spend another $1500 or more going through them, and even more money for a good port job, just to get them up around 280 cfm, when I can just buy some round port Eddy's, disguise them well enough to fool most, even a Pontiac guru at a glance, and only spend $2500 maybe $3000, and have a head that flows 315cfm or more....?? I'd be a dummy to choose the first option for what I'm doing.

Given options like that I can bet what most Pontiac people would do.

This very scenario is why that first discussion of repopping some aftermarket heads with certain casting numbers came up in the first place. Unfortunately that whole discussion collapsed. Not because there wasn't interest, there were pages of interest, but the cost of tooling up something like this is more than anyone is willing to step up and do for such a small group of Pontiac loyalists. So we get creative That's what hotrodding is.

[Skip Fix]

"Especially when a lot of the Pontiac guys I've run across are some of the cheapest guys on the planet."

Many 409 guys are too

But I agree for those wanting it to look stock but go fast makes sense. Heck how many guys that race a little that swap that 455 in place of the 400 still tell folks it's a 400? I mean my street racing Impala just had a "348 truck motor" in it

The SBC guys have some CNC programs to make DART heads have "double humps".

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by Skip Fix

"Especially when a lot of the Pontiac guys I've run across are some of the cheapest guys on the planet."

Many 409 guys are too

But I agree for those wanting it to look stock but go fast makes sense. Heck how many guys that race a little that swap that 455 in place of the 400 still tell folks it's a 400? I mean my street racing Impala just had a "348 truck motor" in it

The SBC guys have some CNC programs to make DART heads have "double humps".

Funny you mentioned that. Trick Flow has been casting their aluminum heads in both the 461 and 186 style hump heads for a few years now. I'm doing a 355 and going to use the Trick Flow hump heads on it. Unfortunately, like everything else, they are at least 6 months out.

[PAUL K]

I started hiding the aluminum heads more then thirty years ago because we grudge raced our cars. We fooled a LOT of folks and no one ever knew for sure we were using aftermarket heads. Including some Pontiac guys because they had never seen an aluminum Pontiac head.

You guys are forgetting, while many of us purists could spot a disguised aluminum head from twenty feet away, most Brand X guys couldn't tell you the difference from a D-port and a round port iron head. One of my buddies worked for a very good local performance (that built a lot of great running performance Pontiacs) machine shop many years ago and all the employees referred to round port heads as "ram air heads" to this day he still couldn't tell you the difference between a RAIV, SD or HO head without looking up the numbers. I continue the practice because I really don't like the way an aluminum head looks.

I doubt I'll fool anyone with the head below but didn't want to advertise the manufacturer. The head made close to 1100 HP naturally aspirated and the manufacturer had nothing to do with that performance other than supplying the raw casting.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Anyone have close up pictures of the engine in the 1970 Knafel Tin Indian Judge race car ?
Air Flow Research made some Angle Plug Ram4 heads back then.
The Knafel car has a set, have only seen a few other sets ... in pictures.

Would be pretty wild to clone some of these new heads into Vintage AFR heads, on a deserving race car. That could draw a crowd , if you could keep a straight face.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by PAUL K

... I continue the practice because I really don't like the way an aluminum head looks.

You really excelled doing casting numbers and faux freeze plugs on these heads.
Fantastic Work and really does so much to take the focus off of them.
I admire them tremendously , full respect.

But this pair of "slogan" heads are UnReal !
lmao

[Steve C.]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve C.
I only have one question: Why bother? Spending 2K on heads and then hiding or disguising them confuses my Vulcan logic! I want to show those suckers off!!

Not my statement. I was parroting someone else. But can agree. I can also appreciate the people who try to make them look factory.
\From what I've seen here Paul K does a killer job at it.


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[Gator67]

I had mine done because I think it looks cool. No different than all the other things we spend our money on for the sake of satisfying our own preferences and sensibilities. This engine (aluminum 535) is going in my 70 pro-touring formula.



Certainly not intended to fool anyone...folks who know enough to care also will know it's not the real deal. Used a real one on top for mock up and building headers...can see many differences.

[Formulajones]

Did you machine the front??

Those don't look like Eddy or Kauffman heads. What are they?

[Gator67]

The front isn't machined extensively like in that video. They're Tiger Cub heads from Allpontiac, which are just CNC ported Edelbrock RPMs I believe. Frank had them done several years ago...I'm going on 9 years on this project.

[Formulajones]

Wow, that's a long project.

I looked on Frank's site, of course he has Tiger heads, but don't see Tiger Cubs offered. I guess since so long ago it's a head he doesn't offer now?