[JSchmitz]

Originally Posted by myckee

Well, I just scored a rebuilt 100A CS130 for $19.79 on ebay. I wish I had found it before I ordered my 140A CS144 from Rock Auto the day before yesterday! Oh well for twenty bucks and free shipping I couldn't resist so I guess I'll have a spare.

Anyway You too can get a good deal on either a AC DELCO 105A CS130 (part# 3342328) or a Beck/Arnley (part# 1866183) 140A CS144 from rock auto. The CS130 is $44, no core needed and the CS144 is $78, also no core needed.

If you want to look them up yourselves:
$44 CS130: 1991 Pontiac Grand Am 2.5L {3 left at time of posting}
$78 CS144: 1995 Buick Riviera 3.8L {11 left at time of posting}

DO NOT order a Beck/Arnley #186-6183. It requires a PCM between the "L" terminal and the idiot light. I just found too late. I talked to a guy at BBB Industries. He looked up the schematic for me. He said to get one for a '93-'97 Camaro/Firebird. It's part #186-6180.

[myckee]

I have received mine but I haven't had a chance to hook it up yet. Hopefully I'll be able to do so on Monday and I'll test mine out.

It might be a worthwhile experiment to see if you try a different reistance source (a light bulb hooked directly to battery or similar) to see if that would make your alt work, given that it tested okay.

Not to dispute the BBB guy but I think most modern cars will have a PCM somewhere between the alt and the dash lights. I know that there are two types of CS144s and some don't have an "L" terminal, but an "I" (I think) and thus requires a slight change in the way it is wired, but will still work. I dropped my alt off at my storage place for my car, so I can't verify the terminals present at the moment.

In any event, I'll give it a try on Monday and post back here.

[Tripower455]

Originally Posted by Socrates

Ugggghhhhhh....You've gotta love the internet. There will always be someone, somewhere who swears on their mothers tombstone that they got away with doing something exceptionally stupid themselves to otherworldly great success, and then they get on a BB and suggest other people do the same inane thing...

Would anyone here call up GM/Delco and tell them how foolish they were to spend millions engineering and producing a super efficient modern alternator cooling fan when a 50yr old relic would have sufficed Not likely! I have never, ever heard of the composite fans just exploding, and I participate on many online forums and local clubs. Sounds like a total BS wives tale to me.

PS, please, by all means, if anyone could show us a factory CS144 with the ugly old school multi-blade metal fan on it from the factory, do so! I'm open to being proven wrong, though I'd wager you'll not find one, and if you do you'll find 18 million cars with the modern design to the one oddball you find with the poor old-school design in use. While searching, look for how many composite alternator fans actually explode vs. don't. Most all GMs for the past ~20 years have used the modern composite fan design. I can't recall ever hearing about common explosions, nor a recall or anything of this nature in the real world. Fantasy hick-engineering world, maybe. Real world, no. I'm sure one composite fan somewhere may well have exploded under some unique circumstances, just as one metal fan may have lost a blade or two as underhood shrapnel on equally rare occasions, though associating value to the extremely rare and isolated stories is pretty ludicrous in my mind, especially when it leads people jeopardize the function of a critical component in their cars which will leave a bunch of people stranded or calling AAA as a result...Sorry, this "one guy" story just totally pegged, overshot and exploded the fan on my BS meter this morning

Well.....

I just had this happen to my CS144 the day before yesterday! I was running my 66 up through the gears and heard a loud bang (sounded like a backfire through the exhaust) at the top of 3rd (less than 6k RPM). I thought it went lean (I've been messing with the end carbs.). I couldn't replicate what I thought was the lean condition while recording with the LM-1.

When I got home, I noticed that the plastic part of the alternator fan was GONE, leaving the metal disk.

Fortunately, I can't find any damage under the hood anywhere, but the thing definitely came apart.

I am hesitant to put another plastic one on there, but I don't want to burn up the alternator either! I have the metal one off my old alternator on there for now.

Are there any all metal fans that are as efficient as the plastic ones?

[1967Tempest]

Is there any reason that I could not go higher than 140A? The new stuff and a lot of performance alternators are coming in around 200-250A.

My Tempest is almost all electric. I have the 100A alt and a yellow top deep cycle Optima and at idle with the stereo, fan, blinkers and lights on, it is a BIG drain on the bat.

Thoughts?

[HWYSTR455]

Like I mentioned above, v-belts won't hold anything over 140a, and even slip at that. You glaze the belt quick, starts slipping, and the charge falls off. Serp is the way to go, and if you do, you can toss a 350a on there!

As for idle, not sure if I mentioned it in this thread, but you need an alt that has a high rating at idle, not peak, like something for an ambulance or police car. Most companies don't provide an output graph to RPM (alt spindle), which is the problem. It will most likely be a custom, and you will pay. Your 140a probably only puts out like 30a at idle, which is the problem. Shoot for a '96 caprice police model, see if that helps.

You can do the math, using roughly 70% peak load for your rating on the alt. For example, if you have a peak load of 100a, you need a min of a 70a alt, and you can;t be in peak load more than 30% of the time. Roughly.

I'm getting by with a 105a, and I have fans that draw 30a+ when they kick on. That, with the stereo, fuel pump, and at idle, with your foot on the brake, AC on, it dips. But it does catch up.

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[1967Tempest]

Originally Posted by HWYSTR455

Like I mentioned above, v-belts won't hold anything over 140a, and even slip at that. You glaze the belt quick, starts slipping, and the charge falls off. Serp is the way to go, and if you do, you can toss a 350a on there!

As for idle, not sure if I mentioned it in this thread, but you need an alt that has a high rating at idle, not peak, like something for an ambulance or police car. Most companies don't provide an output graph to RPM (alt spindle), which is the problem. It will most likely be a custom, and you will pay. Your 140a probably only puts out like 30a at idle, which is the problem. Shoot for a '96 caprice police model, see if that helps.

You can do the math, using roughly 70% peak load for your rating on the alt. For example, if you have a peak load of 100a, you need a min of a 70a alt, and you can;t be in peak load more than 30% of the time. Roughly.

I'm getting by with a 105a, and I have fans that draw 30a+ when they kick on. That, with the stereo, fuel pump, and at idle, with your foot on the brake, AC on, it dips. But it does catch up.

.

Yeah, the serp belt would need to be an upgrade as it is expensive. Yeah, the battery does catch up VERY quick compared to a regular battery. As soon as you get over the 1k-1.5K rpm, the volts are fine. I was looking at a 220A with 105 at idle. But there is the rub.


They will put the v belt on, but you said that it will glaze. Is that due to the drag on the belt? Why? I just have not seen it. Plus as stated, the belt is almost180* around the thing.


Yeah, my crappy 140A that died was most likely fried cause of low output at idle. My Summit 100A is bulletproof!!!

[HWYSTR455]

It's because of load. Once youu put a load on it, and the regulator kicks in, it goes full output, and loads the pulley. Not sure it having the belt 180 around the pulley would help, kind of doubt it, think it will still slip. I tried everything, different kinds of belts, those stupid green ones (don't do that, by the way), different and NEW pulleys, everything, they slipped. Dropped back to a 105 and problem gone. Went with a marine battery, largest that would fit in the tray. Only time I have a problem is sitting at idle at night with the AC on and have the fans kick on, but I can toss it in neutral and give it some gas if I have to.

140a alts are overdriven (regulated) 105s, and they don't take too kindly to that. Same with the 200s. The 130Ds and 144Ds are better alts all around, fyi.


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